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With more and more safety concerns about Chinese toys I've been wondering if GW might not benefit with a 'China free' campaign.  It's one of the few toymakers out there with few or no Chinese components.

 

Any thoughts?

They have thier own sweatshops to worry about poking a stick in someone elses eye.

The Chinese toy problems seem to be mostly related to paint so it's not really an issue for GW to trumpet - unless thier about to go pre-paint........

You would be surprised. After all, where do you think the books come from?

Grot: "They have thier own sweatshops to worry about poking a stick in someone elses eye."

I am quick to rib GW when they deserve it, but Citadel have a good safety record and pay their staff a reasonable wage. Also they have NOT outsourced their manufacturing to sweatshops abroad, they deserve some credit for that.

Printing is outsourced to China because of the cost of book quality paper in ther UK. Even so typesetting for the work is done in the UK studio and White Dwarf is printed here on recycled paper.

Old Peculiar: "The Chinese toy problems seem to be mostly related to paint so it's not really an issue for GW to trumpet - unless thier about to go pre-paint........"

I hate prepaint. Yes Wizkids can sell boxes of MWA for little money with painted mechs trhe size of GW dreadnoughts. Yet it is done on the backs of wage slaves in Chinese factories. Just because the nation has turned capitalist doesnt mean they dont keep communism going to fill the factories with underpaid workers.

Citadel stuff is overpriced, but the manufacturing is still ethical.

Next time you go to your local store check out GW's Urban Barricades and Walls. Look at the back of the package it will say made in china.

Well then, judging by everyone's knowledge of virtual" Slave labour" in China,

"Next time you go to your local store check out GW's Urban Barricades and Walls. Look at the back of the package it will say made in china. "

These should be cheaper for the customer than anything else they sell. Unless of course, they are a business interested in making $$$'s

I don't think an ad campaign that condemns 1 billion people for the actions of unscrupulous businesses, is any way fair.

Not all factories in China / Asia put arsenic in their clothing.

Not all people working in China / Asia are slaves.

This is national stereotyping.

Posted By Orlanth on 09/03/2007 1:23 PM
 pay their staff a reasonable wage.

 

 

This made me laugh.  Decent pay my arse

"I don't think an ad campaign that condemns 1 billion people for the actions of unscrupulous businesses, is any way fair.

Not all factories in China / Asia put arsenic in their clothing.

Not all people working in China / Asia are slaves.

This is national stereotyping. "

Absolutely right. My apologies if I have implied/given any offense.

Posted By Orlanth on 09/03/2007 1:23 PM
Grot: "They have thier own sweatshops to worry about poking a stick in someone elses eye."

I am quick to rib GW when they deserve it, but Citadel have a good safety record and pay their staff a reasonable wage. Also they have NOT outsourced their manufacturing to sweatshops abroad, they deserve some credit for that.

Printing is outsourced to China because of the cost of book quality paper in ther UK. Even so typesetting for the work is done in the UK studio and White Dwarf is printed here on recycled paper.

You haven't worked in a GW shop in the states, have you? :S

China is a communist dictatorship. Why on earth are you apologizing?

I guess I felt that he was correct in the sterotyping call.

There is a lot of sweeping comments made(myself-no exception)

So I thought it was the right thing to do.

Posted By beef on 09/04/2007 1:58 AM

Posted By Orlanth on 09/03/2007 1:23 PM
 pay their staff a reasonable wage.

 

 

This made me laugh.  Decent pay my arse

In comparison to the wages paid in the Chinese garment / toy / etc / etc industries, GW wages are very decent.

The Shanghai production facility is very well run and a stand up business in China. I am fluent in Mandarin and know that this is no sweatshop affair. It pays well for the wages in China and is a standard factory job. Most businesses in china are above board as it is easier to run production facilities that way.

The problem with the paints is the govenrment didn't really care until the buyers started caring and we were buying from them and letting them figure out the cheapest way to get materials.

A good part of this is due to Mao Ze Dong and his race for producing the most iron in the word which turned out to be mostly worhtless and left a lot of waste behind that has industriously been turned into other things because no one is standing there saying hey this might kill someone.

Mostly it is the up and coming business owner looking for a cheap way to make goods and make a profit that just does it and doesn't ask too many questions.

Orion

Posted By Broon on 09/05/2007 3:16 PM

Posted By beef on 09/04/2007 1:58 AM

Posted By Orlanth on 09/03/2007 1:23 PM
 pay their staff a reasonable wage.

 

 

This made me laugh.  Decent pay my arse

In comparison to the wages paid in the Chinese garment / toy / etc / etc industries, GW wages are very decent.

OK, I know I shouldn't wade hip deep into this, but here's a few things to remember about global trade:

1) Wages mean different things in different countries, where $1000 a year goes from crushing destitution in the industrial world to middle class in the developing world, to wealthy in sub-saharan africa.

2) Even given that, the definitions of class in different countries varies incredibly.  In the US, even the working poor often own their homes and a car for every working adult.  In India the middle class often have domestic servants.  In Western Europe, nobody needs to worry about health care or education.  In Asia or Africa, the middle class might not even have electricity or running water.

3) Wages, living conditions, working conditions have to be viewed in both absolute and relative terms.  While it's reprehensible to treat workers as chattel, without knowing what the options are for those workers, it's hard to condemn it universally.  Sure, I'd never want to work in a chinese sweatshop, but working as a chinese dirt farmer isn't exactly high on my list of dreams either.

4) Trade benefits both partners.  Not equally, but trade only helps.  If we refuse to trade with China, because they are too repressive, poor, etc.,, then both us and them are worse off.  Trade is one of the most powerful tools for change in the world.

5) Finally, I'd want to point out that while even today sweatshops and child labor aren't completely eradicated in the West, they were overt and widespread as recently as a hundred years ago in the US.  Around the same time, social welfare in the UK involved virtual incarceration in a workhouse.  The west got better, the east will catch up.

Hi Akira,

Thanks mate, I do appreciate it, though I did not take exception to anything you wrote in particular.

Two years ago, I would have made the same judgments. Now that I am an Asian business owner and frequently read comments about how I must run a sweat shop or own slaves, the stereotypes of Asian business have been made very clear to me.

Tai-Pan.

Posted By jfrazell on 09/05/2007 9:14 AM
China is a communist dictatorship. Why on earth are you apologizing?

China's not really communist anymore.

Generally not one to nitpick, but you gotta work the poli-sci degree every once in a while.

You're right. the system is a defacto Fascist state at this time. So I restate, why on earth apologize.

Nah its still communist.

However they are smart communists who realised that Marx was wrong. You can build successful socialism if you realise capitalism isnt the enemy of communism. Quite the opposite in fact, capitalism thrives in communism countries with limited free markets as they dont hae to deal wioth a labour movement or high service prices. The middle class powerbase is the enemy of communism.

er, by nature, capitalism and communist can't co-exist. They only exist in socialist and fascist regions.

Posted By Orlanth on 09/06/2007 4:54 AM
Nah its still communist.

However they are smart communists who realised that Marx was wrong. You can build successful socialism if you realise capitalism isnt the enemy of communism. Quite the opposite in fact, capitalism thrives in communism countries with limited free markets as they dont hae to deal wioth a labour movement or high service prices. The middle class powerbase is the enemy of communism.

You are confusing Communism with a non-democratic, one-party Capitalist state, where trade unions are effectively banned, and there are few legal safeguards for workers.

Yes communism and capitalism cannot co-exist. The chinese government is trying to make this happen. The administrators want to keep power but want big business and money too. Right now we are watching to see what gives way. And more and more it seems to be communism.

Orion

President Bush needs to split a thirty cube of Tsingtao with President Hu Jintao whilst he's in Australia, I'm all for leaders of countries being reserved, even dour, but I swear the guy looks like he just read the new Chaos Codex when he's on TV.

I don't think GW can do a "China-free" campaign. Only companies who are into being hip, edgy, cool, or pretend like they're hippies do these sorts of campaigns.  Foods that cater to vegetarians typically fall under this category.

THey'd have to do an all natural/organically grown campaign to go with it.

Posted By Salvation122 on 09/05/2007 10:03 PM

Posted By jfrazell on 09/05/2007 9:14 AM
China is a communist dictatorship. Why on earth are you apologizing?

China's not really communist anymore.

Generally not one to nitpick, but you gotta work the poli-sci degree every once in a while.

Has anyone told the Chinese Communist Party?

They may not live up to YOUR idea of communism but if you ask them they will tell you they are practicing Socialism With Chinese Characteristics, and that they never claimed to be communist but working through socialism towards communism. 

Of course in the real world there is economic communism and political communism.  While China's economy is capitalist with a bit of national socialism and kleptocracy thrown in their political system is basically soviet.

How would you know, its not like you're there.