Dire Avengers!?

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**EasyE**

What upgrades do you use with your DA squads, items/exarch, complimenting units, ect?

I have been interesting to converting my army to a more mech-style, and am thinking shimmershield will work to my advantage, being able to bladestorm a small squad to the size where they can be easily taken in an assault. Though I have been reading some mixed reviews about people saying to keep DAs out of assaults because they have decent range and a lot of mobility and can move from objective to objective.

Eldar players, what do you use, how do you use it? I feel like DAs are a really great troop choice, probably the best for a mech-eldar style army, which would cater to my "hit hard and fast" style of play.

**willydstyle**

When I use them, I use 10 with no upgrades in a wave serpent.

**whitedragon**

5 with a serpent is cheaper. They shouldn't ever be getting out.

**Squig_herder**

Here are my mixes i use at different times:

Hordes (ork/nids/etc.)
10 dires, exarch 2 catapults and bladestorm

Elite killers (IC character/multiwound)
5+, exarch, defend and diresword & Serpant
comment:
This can be an expensive, one purpose squad but i have killed a hive tyrant & chaplian using this.

Tau/Eldar
6+, exarch, power weapon, bladestorm & Serpant

**Ghetto_Fight**

You should try having a farseer near by to caste DOOM with your bladestorm. Last time this bastard tried it and wiped a entire 10 men necron squad!!!!!

**Tek**

Yeah, try to keep them near a Farseer for maximum effect.

It's worth noting that without bladestorm, the mathammer says you'll get a very similar result if you're using guardians with a scatter laser.

It's rounghly 5 wounds apiece firing.

Plus Guardians are hella cheap. I love guardians, that's why I mentioned it :-)

My DAs, however, I run 10 (inc Exarch w/2 Cats & BS) in a serpent. It's costly, but is good to use for
a)clearing out stubborn objective-holders or
b) softening up a squad for my banshees (who are also in a serpent)

I feel that PW and shimmershield is a waste of points as I tend to keep them out of assault. Build on the strength of the squad, not the weakness.

**Exarch_Nektel**

I use them one of two ways:
1) 9+Exarch w/2 catapults+bladestorm mounted in a wave serpent with a Guide/Doomseer. I combine these units with the Fish of Fury tactic.
2)9+Exarch w/Diresword+defend+Bladestorm. I advance them up the board with the Avatar.

My Dire Avengers usually worry about forward objectives while the ever tenacious guardian squads provide backup fire support.

**Old Man Ultramarine**

9+Exarch w/2 catapults+bladestorm mounted in a wave serpent. Preferably Farseer near to guide/doom.

T1 Bladestorm, T2 remount in serpent, T3 Bladestorm, T4 remount.......

Very effective.

**Exarch_Nektel**

Old Man Ultramarine wrote:9+Exarch w/2 catapults+bladestorm mounted in a wave serpent. Preferably Farseer near to guide/doom.

T1 Bladestorm, T2 remount in serpent, T3 Bladestorm, T4 remount.......

Very effective.

This only works for a limited time against a certain opponent, they will wise up to it. However, since you probably only face someone once in a tournament, this is a great tournament strategy.

**Darkreaver55**

I don't play them myself, but I've seen some perfectly hilarious amounts of wounds landed when a serpent full of DAs with a doom/guide farseer pops in and unloads. In a friendly game between a couple of the guys I know the Eldar took apart about 1/3 of the Chaos Marine player's army in one round of shooting with that squad, not to mention the other serpent full of DAs that was hanging back, ready to do another bladestorm next turn. If the DA's gun only has 12" range, though (I don't know the range), be careful of using that against Berzerkers, Space Wolves, etc etc. If enough of them are left and get a charge in, that DA squad isn't going to make it back into its transport.

**Exarch_Nektel**

Darkreaver55 wrote: If the DA's gun only has 12" range, though (I don't know the range)

18"

**Silchias Ruin**

It really depends on what I'm going to do with them.

Up until recently I always took the exarch with 2x catapults, and bladestorm. Good at shooting from 18" obviously. Don't get them in cc.

Last game, however, I took the Dire sword/defend/bladestorm and must say I was impressed. With Guide and doom they pretty much single handedly took out a full squad of black templars w/ neophites. I found it amazing and slightly hilarious. I couldn't believe it worked. Who'lda thunk?

**Darkreaver55**

Ah, I didn't know they had 18" of reach. That doom/guide bladestorm will account for just about anything, then, except jump infantry and bikes. If those aren't eliminated entirely, they'll be able to lock up those DAs until something else can be brought to bear. If they have room to hop back into their serpent to retreat and reload, though, they'll be unholy terrors.

**der Wiskinator**

I exclusively use bladestorm, defend, power weapon, and shimmershield. I advance on assault units, shooting, bladestorming and charging. I havn't had much luck getting the doom off at the right time (my farseer stays back to fortune other units), but once I am in combat I fortune the DA's so that they tie up the assault unit for the rest of the game (or kill it).

**pakman**

I usually run two squads of DA with no exarch in a Serpent with Spirit Stones. I don't like bladestorm, you lose shots over the course of the game. Instead, I run the Avenger Serpents together and keep a farseer nearby for Doom.anything they fire at usually dies.

**EasyE**

what do you use on their transport? TW BL?

**Polonius**

I use 10 men, Bladestorm, twin Shuricat Exarchs in Serpents with twin BLs. It's a pricey and fragile troops choice, but it works pretty well.

**Fenris-77**

There's nothing wrong with piddly squads of 5 to take up unused space in Falcons. Late turn objective grabbing at a bargain rate. Really, you're paying 60 pts to make you Falcons scoring, which isn't terrible.

And hey, once every 3 or 4 games they might even kill something. (The DA, not the Falcon).

If you don't have unused Falcon room then I'd say you want to go middling with them, either 10 in a Serpent with no upgrades, or maybe 10 with BS if you;re running with a lot of Doom and Guide. Personally, I think there are better ways to spend points in the Eldar Dex than seriously buffing the DA. A little extra oomph is fine, but I wouldn't go overboard.

**pakman**

When I run my DAs in serpents, I usually put a BL on top. The starcannons go on the serpents carrying the three flamer templates.

**whitedragon**

Polonius wrote:I use 10 men, Bladestorm, twin Shuricat Exarchs in Serpents with twin BLs. It's a pricey and fragile troops choice, but it works pretty well.

5 with Serpents with S. Cannons is alot cheaper. The DA's really don't have to get out, they are much safer inside their vehicle.

**Xenith**

I use 10 in a serpent, exarch with dual cats, blade storm.

They shoot doomed units, and kill lots!

**dahli.llama**

Xenith wrote:I use 10 in a serpent, exarch with dual cats, blade storm.

They shoot doomed units, and kill lots!

This is my loadout too.

I run 2 Serpents with Avengers in my mech list, and the only time they get out is late game to clear an objective. So missing a turn of shooting doesn't really matter, since they should clean up in a single turn.

**Augustus**

whitedragon wrote:5 with a serpent is cheaper. They shouldn't ever be getting out.

Thats exactly what I do too. I don't think of them as a squad to actually use, they are a 60 point upgrade that makes a flying waveserpent score.

They only get out when the serpent explodes, and then they run.

Honestly, Dire Avengers are novel with cool powers but really don't compete with any other armies troop choices very well, being S3, T3, Sv4 and having to deal with the Morale rules for real, unlike fearless, LD10 or ATSKNF troops do they tend to fold in melee, loose in shooting and are generally outclassed. Adding the exarch and all the candy makes the unit so expensive you could have 2 smaller ones, and as their best feature is scoring unit for minimum cost, thats what I use them for.

(A Bladestorm and doom with a 10 man unit seems cool, but is over 300 points to set up, with a transport too it is over 500, All the tough units in tourney armies like Nob Bikes, Space Marine Bikes, Plague Marines and AV 11+ vehicles and dreads just laugh at it...)

**augfubuoy**

Augustus wrote:
(A Bladestorm and doom with a 10 man unit seems cool, but is over 300 points to set up, with a transport too it is over 500, All the tough units in tourney armies like Nob Bikes, Space Marine Bikes, Plague Marines and AV 11+ vehicles and dreads just laugh at it...)

What? 300 points? More like 153 points and then a Waveserpent with whatever you want on it. I mean, seriously, they're not all that bad: 18 BS4 and 4 BS5 S4 shots at 18 inches with the option to assault. You're right. That's just horrible and it won't kill hordes like it's supposed to do. No, wait, that's exactly what they do, and they're scoring! Besides, while everybody wants a unit of Striking Scorpions to cut through hordes of guys, the fact is that they're just one unit that doesn't score and will draw loads of fire. Not to say that SS are bad, just that DA are good anti-horde for cheap, are innocuous, and can claim objectives. Not bad!

**Exarch_Nektel**

Darkreaver55 wrote:Ah, I didn't know they had 18" of reach. That doom/guide bladestorm will account for just about anything, then, except jump infantry and bikes. If those aren't eliminated entirely, they'll be able to lock up those DAs until something else can be brought to bear. If they have room to hop back into their serpent to retreat and reload, though, they'll be unholy terrors.

Yes, they are truly agents of Phase-out.

**Avariel**

Either 5 in a Falcon with holofields and spiritstones or 10 in a Wave Serpent. Like to keep them cheap.

**Wehrkind**

What does blade storm do again? Hopefully a little more than provide the option of 22 Str4 shots from 10 men... that's not too exciting.

**Xenith**

gives them all an extra shot, at the expense of not shooting next turn - which is no loss, as they should either be in combat or jumping back into a transport.

**Brother Bartius**

I've started to prefer runing 10 on foot without exarch.

Pair them with a unit of Scorps.

Attach a Doom & Fortune Farseer or even Eldrad and you have a very effective block of units that can pretty much take on most things for under 500pts.

It excells in lower point games where there is a lack of AP3 and under firepower.

Just use the scorps with eldrad as a shield for the avengers.

As long as Eldrad can get fortune on the Scorps (and Avengers) this unit is remarkably resilient. Plus he can soak up the odd AP3 or under hit.

**tuatha1337**

Xenith wrote:gives them all an extra shot, at the expense of not shooting next turn - which is no loss, as they should either be in combat or jumping back into a transport.

Why does everyone put Dire Avengers in CC? They have no CCW (except for their catapult) so they only get one attack, and they get smeared quite easily in comparison to other units more designed for CC (Stiking Scorpions, Howling Banshees, etc). It seems to me that the DAs are better designed for mid-range shooting, with the plus of being a troop choice.