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I have grown to hate the word "hero" its one of those words that people just seem to throw around willy nilly to try and heap praise on others for even the most minor of achievements.

Take this for example..

http://tech.uk.msn.com/news/articles.aspx?cp-documentid=154128972

Moat Facebook page fans 'ignorant'


The wife of the policeman shot by Raoul Moat has condemned a Facebook group describing the gunman as a legend
The wife of the police officer shot in the face by Raoul Moat has condemned members of a controversial Facebook group dedicated to the gunman as "ignorant".

The creator of the RIP Raoul Moat You Legend group took down the webpage after it came under fire from Prime Minister David Cameron.

However, Siobhan O'Dowd was unrepentant, saying the steroid-addicted former bodybuilder was "still a human being at the end of the day" and that she may reinstate the group.

And now a new Facebook group called RIP Raoul Moat! has already attracted more than 12,000 members, with some describing the killer as a "loving father and an all round canny lad".

Pc David Rathband, 42, was left blind after Moat blasted him at close range through the window of his parked patrol car.

His wife Kath said she could not understand why Moat was hailed as a "legend" on Facebook when her husband was the real hero.

"Why anyone with any morals would think that Moat was a hero and a legend is beyond me," she told The Sun.

"My husband is a hero - and there is no comparison between my husband and Moat. David's bravery is astonishing. Moat was an out-and-out coward."

Asked why she removed the Facebook page, Ms O'Dowd said: "I don't know really. A few of us came to a decision but it's going to be up again running. We don't condone what he did as what he did was wrong. He had problems and needed help and he didn't get any help."

Moat, 37, shot himself last week in Rothbury, Northumberland, following a massive manhunt, which ended in a six-hour stand-off with armed police. As well as blasting Pc Rathband, he shot and wounded his former girlfriend Sam Stobbart, 22, and killed her new partner Chris Brown, 29.

Clearly im not going to say that Moat should be revered by anybody, he was a murderer, but that aside.

How on earth does getting shot by someone make you a hero? And what else do people refer to as heros? Sportsmen?

A successful sportsman most fething definately isnt a hero.

If a fireman rescues someone from a burning building, he isnt a hero, he gets paid an ample sum to do it, its his job. If he doesnt do that, he is a coward and a douchebag, but it doesnt make the guys who do a hero.

A policeman who chases a robber or jumps into a river to save a kid (some dont) isnt a hero, its his job. It just makes the guys who wont lazy and cowardly, it doesnt by default make the ones who do a hero right?

A soldier isnt a hero. Its their job, you sign up and you know the risks. I went to the middle east 4 times, i was involved in some of the hardest fighting over there, particularly in Kajaki in Helmand province and during the initial surge into Iraq, nothing heroic about that. I even joined for base reasons because i was young and angry and i wanted to kill people, that rage fueled me through my commando training when so many fell by the way side, and whats noble about that? And you look out for your friends because you care about them and forge a strong bond with them, im sure they know this and thats why they train you in this way, which means you have a "dog in that hunt" when comrades are in need of your assistance, so its entirely natural to do so. Whats heroic or noble about any of that?

I think it is pretty hard to define someone as being heroic, but i guess an obvious one would be someone assisting someone else at a great risk to themself even if they really dont need to do so.

For example i think that a regular civilian such as a bus driver or something, if he is driving along and he notices that a car has overturned by the side of the road and its on fire, and rather than just call the emergency services, he runs over and starts dragging people out or whatever.. i think helping people you dont actually know at a risk to yourself is heroic. But you could argue that they have to be anonymous right? Cos i mean.. its not heroic if its your kids in the car is it!? Everyone would do the same!

I think we may have confused "douche" with "hero" ie. So many cops and firemen are cowards who say "oh im not trained to do that" that when you see one who actually does what they are supposed to do anyway they get branded a "hero"

So what makes someone a hero? Am i being too cynical and hard on people?

What defines the word for you?

Someone who does something for the betterment of mankind, not for himself. Watch the last episode of Band of Brothers, where Lt. Winters quotes his grandchild saying "Granddad, were you a hero?" To which he replied, "No, but I served with a unit of heroes."

Those men did not go looking for fame or glory, they had a job to do and they did it, knowing they would bring peace.

So merely serving in WW2 makes you a hero?

I must disagree, clearly that blokes grandad was humble, but i mean, saying "im not a hero but everyone who served there was" is basically just saying "i think im a hero but im saying it in a nice way"

If there is a draft and you go, then your just doing the right thing. Millions of people served during WW2, are they all heros?

If there was WW3 now and they had a draft, you and i would both get drafted and we would both serve. How does that make you a hero? Your SUPPOSED to do that!

As i said, it makes the people that refuse to serve and dodge the draft cowards and douchebags, but it doesnt by default make everyone else a hero does it?

I am supposed to go to war because my number got dialed up? Screw that crap, if I don't believe in the war, I'm not in this thing. Don't give me that "Your supposed to do that!" crap. The only thing I am supposed to do is make sure I survive until tomorrow. It does not make people cowards or douchebags. Why would I be considered a douchebag if there was a draft for the Iraq War and I just up and left the US because I think it is a load of crap. I do not believe in it and I am standing by my beliefs. For that, I think I am more of a man than just mindlessly going to war because some guy tells me to.

Now, as far as being heroes goes. I see WW2 Vets as heroes. They fought for a good cause, saving a lot of lives and protecting the US from the Japanese(Pacific Theater) and the Germans who would have eventually come after us if we had not gotten involved in Europe. A lot of men risked their lives for others that really meant nothing to them. That is heroism, and really, pretty much everybody involved in WW2 was doing that.

Dreadwinter wrote:I am supposed to go to war because my number got dialed up? Screw that crap, if I don't believe in the war, I'm not in this thing. Don't give me that "Your supposed to do that!" crap. The only thing I am supposed to do is make sure I survive until tomorrow. It does not make people cowards or douchebags. Why would I be considered a douchebag if there was a draft for the Iraq War and I just up and left the US because I think it is a load of crap. I do not believe in it and I am standing by my beliefs. For that, I think I am more of a man than just mindlessly going to war because some guy tells me to.

Now, as far as being heroes goes. I see WW2 Vets as heroes. They fought for a good cause, saving a lot of lives and protecting the US from the Japanese(Pacific Theater) and the Germans who would have eventually come after us if we had not gotten involved in Europe. A lot of men risked their lives for others that really meant nothing to them. That is heroism, and really, pretty much everybody involved in WW2 was doing that.

They didnt have a draft for the Iraq war.

They have a draft when there is dire need, you know, like WW2. The same guys your calling heros, would you have dodged the draft then? If you did, you would be a douche and a coward.

Doesnt make the guys who did serve heros. It makes the guys who didnt dicks. My grandad got one of the top medals in WW2 and he was in a centre spread in the local paper, he crawled half a mile through a mine field to get his mates out of a tank, got there, they were all dead, crawled all the way back. Got a medal and some cash for it, spent the cash in two days on booze and cards.

Doesnt make him a hero. He would just be a dick if he didnt try!

A hero is someone who goes above and beyond what is expected of them for no personal gain. It can be the lady down the road who gives all her time and efforts in charity work or the homeless man who drag a child out of a river and saves it.

I know soliders serve and put there lives on the line but that is what is expected of them, however saying that some soliders do go above and beyond and are true heros.

I also think the word hero is used far to often, and that we need to aknowldge what is good and what is done without tarnishing the memories and deeds of others.

nitty wrote:A hero is someone who goes above and beyond what is expected of them for no personal gain. It can be the lady down the road who gives all her time and efforts in charity work or the homeless man who drag a child out of a river and saves it.

I know soliders serve and put there lives on the line but that is what is expected of them, however saying that some soliders do go above and beyond and are true heros.

I also think the word hero is used far to often, and that we need to aknowldge what is good and what is done without tarnishing the memories and deeds of others.

Aye thats more like it..

I agree, I don't really know what to class a heroism. However, your grandad sounds like a hero to me, as many others would just leave them to their fate.

You're all wrong. What makes a hero?

Fresh baked softbread, preferably honey wheat.
Fresh lettuce, tomatoes, ham, with just a hint of strong mustard
Bacon, lots of bacon.

A lot of it depends on what you think the reasonable thing to do is in a given situation. Going beyond that, without selfish reasons is what makes you a hero.

Two people can both save someones life while one is a hero and the other isn't. A doctor saving someone's life isn't a hero as that is part of their job, while someone who performs first aid to someone hurt could be seen as a hero.

I agree with mattyrm and nitty.

However I think there are exceptions such as if they do their job exceptionally in such a way (some obvious exceptions) that is more than just what's required. A doctor that heals people is just doing his job, one that figures out a solution to a pandemic could be seen as a hero. It's the effort that goes into it as well, not just what they do.

True heroes are people who due to their martial prowess, personal bravery and skill become a 'legend' not only to their own side (for that is too easy to hype) but also amongst their opponents.

Frazzled wrote:

You're all wrong. What makes a hero?

Fresh baked softbread, preferably honey wheat.
Fresh lettuce, tomatoes, ham, with just a hint of strong mustard
Bacon, lots of bacon.

Does your wife read these boards frazzled??? Or has she got you that well trained?

Frazzled wrote:

You're all wrong. What makes a hero?

Fresh baked softbread, preferably honey wheat.
Fresh lettuce, tomatoes, ham, with just a hint of strong mustard
Bacon, lots of bacon.

Well, that's definately a hero for my stomach.

ShivanAngel wrote:

Frazzled wrote:

You're all wrong. What makes a hero?

Fresh baked softbread, preferably honey wheat.
Fresh lettuce, tomatoes, ham, with just a hint of strong mustard
Bacon, lots of bacon.

Does your wife read these boards frazzled??? Or has she got you that well trained?

Dude she has access to weiner dogs. You don't ever ever with someone who has a full auto weiner dog.

So if she looses the wiener dogs on to you, they will obey her unwaveringly and refuse to listen to their other master!!!???

How horrid!!!!

Unfortunately our dog is the same way...

I thought a hero was someone who "went above and beyond the call of duty" . The story the OP mentions was not a hero for sitting in his cruiser. Does it anger me? Yeah, I have two uncles that are officers and it pisses me off when I hear/read this sort of thing. Also, while people may be doing what their job is, I feel "above and beyond" calls for recognition and when people help others (the old woman/charity example) that is also an above and beyond the duty of a citizen.

In my mid, what makes a hero is someone who dose their best for the greater good of people, Like a UN person driving a suply truck to a refuge camp, Or someone who clears landmines. Or Police officers who risk their own life so that we all may have a pleasant life.

Yay
Frazzled is my hero, for no matter what the topic, he successfully shoehorns in the pictures of Daschunds!

It is a matter of degree and not necessarily a martial prowess.
Self sacrifice is an importart aspect imho

Thankfully I haven't seen all the hype surrounding Moat.
While his situation may have been tragic and certain aspects demand sympathy, he was not heroic in the least.
The heroic thing for him to do in his situation was to defeat his own demons rather than project them onto the police.

Calling him a legend would be rather amusing if the shootings were not so sad.

Hero- suicidal idiot who happened to survive.

The term hero gets thrown around to much. I agree with that.

Just being a cop or a soldier doesn't automatically make you a hero in my book.

If a woman wants to call her husband a hero, and he's a police officer that was blinded by a crook, I'm not going to argue with her, if I agree or not. There's certain things you just don't do. Only a dick would say, "STFU, that blind feth is no hero."

I think this is quite an apt quote imo.
"Do you know what the definition of a hero is? Someone who gets other people killed. You can look it up later. "

Frazzled wrote:

You're all wrong. What makes a hero?

Fresh baked softbread, preferably honey wheat.
Fresh lettuce, tomatoes, ham, with just a hint of strong mustard
Bacon, lots of bacon.

Gyro Frazzled. Thats a Gyro. Sound the same but different. The man who invented that tastey foodstuff is a hero to me though. In seriousness though I consder anybody who saves multiple lives a hero regardless of if its their job or not, as long as they were not responsible for the initial endagerment of said lives.

Tights and a cape.

kronk wrote:If a woman wants to call her husband a hero, and he's a police officer that was blinded by a crook, I'm not going to argue with her, if I agree or not. There's certain things you just don't do. Only a dick would say, "STFU, that blind feth is no hero."

Agreed. Only a dick.

For me, a hero can be many things.

It can be:
- Someone to aspire to be like, to shadow a great feat, strength (mental or physical, preferably the former) or simply for the kind of person they are.

- whatever it says it is in the dictionary

- Someone who helps other people, no matter how small or how big.

You don't have to save the world to be hero IMO, but you don't have to be praised as a saint for saving a cat stuck up a tree.

I know what makes an hero....



Yeah okay I'm going to hell now.

kronk wrote:

If a woman wants to call her husband a hero, and he's a police officer that was blinded by a crook, I'm not going to argue with her, if I agree or not. There's certain things you just don't do. Only a dick would say, "STFU, that blind feth is no hero."

Clearly she can. If i want to call my dog a hero, i can. Its got nothing to do with anybody else, but would YOU agree with me?

Of course i wouldnt agree with telling some poor woman "STFU that blind feth is no hero" but i dont think he IS a hero.

Seriously, how does getting shot make you a hero? Do you agree with me or disagree with me? Cos all i said was that getting shot doesnt make you a hero. I didnt say "im off round to his wifes house to tell her that her husband is a blind feth"

Was Tupac a hero? Or what about Ronnie Lee Gardner?

Someone who selflessly puts themselves forward for the betterment of mankind (either an individual or a group) at personal risk to themselves.

The element "selflessly" is important - soldiers, firemen, policemen, etc, are all expected to do their duty to keep others safe and protect them in their day to day working life. It is only when they go beyond that expectation that they enter the realms of being "heroic". When they do something that the majority of people would not be capable of doing.

SilverMK2 wrote:When they do something that the majority of people would not be capable of doing.

There's an important difference to make with this, and that's between those that can't and those that won't.