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Recently i have gotten into a small matter of whether or not someone who has bought off me, 18 khorne bezerkers (8 of which were missing their Close Combat Weapons) a Chaos Lord with 2 Power Fists, and a Kharn the Betrayer Conversion stand in model for a Grand Total of £20.

i feel these three points beat his argument.

1. I stated the Missing weapons and the conversion model before the agreement of price and to purchase.
2. He felt they needed stripping and he paints models for a living so its not that much a deal.
3. He had a good half an hour to examine the models before handing me the money.

He feels he deserves the Money back Due to...

1. They need stripping
2. Its a converted Model


This is the Message i sent him as well for those interested:

i have 18 Khorne Bezerkers with one Skull Champion who has a Plasma Pistol and a Power fist.

I also have a Khorne Chaos Lord with 2 powerfists, even though he can only use one...
and a rather odd Kharn the Betrayer converted Model, that will require some stripping as chris did a gak job at painting and a great job of erasing all the detail ¬¬.

i got ALL of theese off of chris for my necrons and there in... mixed condition... 8 of them do not have any close combat weapons, but i am working on getting those repaired at the moment.

I am also looking for Money as i am starting my Dark eldar army as you know, and the less money i have to put into the project, the better XD!

So i am Looking for £27 for the lot if you have that to spare

Thoughts and Opinions People?

And i do apologise if this is in the Wrong Place....

Your last point (giving him 30 minutes to have the models in his hands) is enough to deny him the refund. If he had any doubt about the models while he was giving them the once or twice over, he should have said so and thanked you for your time. That's just me, I won't feel guilted into buying something that doesn't meet my standards (I'm not saying you guilted him). You also were up front about the condition of the models in your post, it certainly doesn't look like a bait and switch to me.

But of course I could be wrong and because he is such a magnificent person he deserves the refund AND the models :-P

Thats what i thought as well. My last point i mean.

Not YOUR last point ;-) XD

They need to take responsibility for there purchase;
His two reasons for wanting a refund are two things that he was aware of prior to purchase.

He was fully aware of the condition of the models before he agreed to buy them.

The contract is good.

You do not owe him a refund.

If you wanted to be nice, you could take the models back and give him a refund, however there is no obligation on you to do so.

Kilkrazy wrote:He was fully aware of the condition of the models before he agreed to buy them.

The contract is good.

You do not owe him a refund.

If you wanted to be nice, you could take the models back and give him a refund, however there is no obligation on you to do so.

Yes. This. In life there are some people who you will never be able to please for reasons that are unfathomable. Tell him no and move on.

You could have said mini x counts as kharn or something rather than

and a Kharn the Betrayer Conversion stand in model

for clarity,

'Some stripping' is not the same as 'OMG it would be better to poke your eyes out than view these god damned eyesores, sand blast them to hades!'

You say the buyer viewed the minis before buying, did he see them in the flesh or was this an internet transaction where you provided images? if images what quality were they? could you see all the defects or major flaws enough to make a decision?

It is buyer beware and you are right to refuse a refund but lets not inter-lynch the buyer just yet.

If you were clear about what was needed, which it seems you were, and he physically handled them prior to purchase, then he has no argument. He knew what he was getting into and is now trying to mess you around (or has discovered he owes someone 20 quid and needs money in a hurry?).

I'd politely but firmly tell him no chance. If he didnt want them, he shouldnt have bought them after seeing them.

He handled them Physically for 30 minutes as we met for a game at maelstrom, and i was called over to a game next to ours for ALOT of assiatance ¬¬.



I have denied him his refund, and the aftermath of this is:

I'm not welcome at his house anymore, nor can i use his painting services anymore. He thanks for the game and the extra £11 of Stripping materials.

Well, if you're not welcome at his home then giving him his twenty back probably isn't going to change that. Forget him, move on and find another painter?

You are better off not doing business with a toerag like that.

feth him don't give a refund the guy is an idiot because if he couldn't work out in half an hour that models where missing parts etc he was either blind, slowed or both. If he is either of those things give the money back if not as I said at the start feth him off.

If he thinks he needs to spend £11 on materials to strip 20 odd models then he is somewhat idiotic.

Pay him no heed. You were right to not not refund the money.

Bloodhorror wrote:He handled them Physically for 30 minutes as we met for a game at maelstrom, and i was called over to a game next to ours for ALOT of assiatance ¬¬.



I have denied him his refund, and the aftermath of this is:

I'm not welcome at his house anymore, nor can i use his painting services anymore. He thanks for the game and the extra £11 of Stripping materials.

Direct him to this thread , beyond your reasoning or his reasoning , have him see the reasoning of members that gave our unbiased opinion.

And i would love to hear why despite he has the time to look over the minis IN PERSON , he accepted the transaction at that time.

If this deal was done over the net with lack of pictures , i can see where the misunderstanding comes from. But in person inspected = no more excuses.

If anything , he simply regretted his decisions back then , which is his own fault.

Now beyond who is wrong and who is right , let me suggest this. Give him a refund , not because he deserves it no. Because you are a better person and if refunding £20 can satisfy the petty quarrel caused by him ,
thats another win in your book. Then you can calmly decide whether you want to deal with that kind of person again in the future.

Again , let him read this thread so he can rethink what he has done.

He is playing head games with you, trying to take advantage of your decent nature.

I don't think you should refund him. If you give in to him to 'be the better man' he'll know that threatening people to get what he wants works for the future.

The first point you stated to beat his argument; 'stated the Missing weapons', is not completely valid though, as in your pm you said: '8 of them do not have any close combat weapons, but i am working on getting those repaired at the moment.'. Which to me implies that you get them fixed before selling them on.

I would say you are completely correct in refusing the refund and frankly, if an individual is that much of a douche, do you really want to play him anyway?

If he's a professional painter, then I would be inclined to name and shame the firm on the grounds that if he's trying to rip you off, he could be doing it to other clients too.

If he didn't want them he could have refused upon sight. Giving a refund won't get you back in his good books, you won't be playing around his house again either way. Just move on.

Hmm lets see he handled the models for 30 mins you say? Well I am fairly sure that makes him a douchebag and the prices you charged seem very reasonable.

I feel his actions give you all the rights to break into his house kill his parents/family, rape his pets and spit in his milk.

From what you stated if that is correct,
what KK said
end of story.

Caveat emptor and all that.
Jubear goes too far.
Don't spit in the milk

He was fully aware of the condition of the models before he agreed to buy them.

The contract is good.

You do not owe him a refund.

If you wanted to be nice, you could take the models back and give him a refund, however there is no obligation on you to do so.

It's called buyer's remorse.
He did not realize what he was getting into until it was too late.

1) *Forget* him and his house. Plently of other games to be had.
2) *Forget* him and his painting service. Give your money to one of the myriad OTHER services out there.

Eric

Kilkrazy wrote:He was fully aware of the condition of the models before he agreed to buy them.

The contract is good.

You do not owe him a refund.

If you wanted to be nice, you could take the models back and give him a refund, however there is no obligation on you to do so.

+1

Also, if the guy is complaining because he needs to strip some paint then well.... ask him if he knows what Simple Green is. On a side note, I think its bad form to air out your dirty laundry but I get that you are annoyed.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Bloodhorror wrote:
I have denied him his refund, and the aftermath of this is:

I'm not welcome at his house anymore, nor can i use his painting services anymore. He thanks for the game and the extra £11 of Stripping materials.

Sounds like a prick. Burning someone over the equivalent of $38 and change is really really dumb. I want to quibble about the quality of the work, but if this guy had 30 minutes to physically check the mini's then he shouldn't get a refund.

What the hell does he use to strip the mini's with? Methadone? 11 quid for stripping is utterly ridiculous.

notprop wrote:If he thinks he needs to spend £11 on materials to strip 20 odd models then he is somewhat idiotic.

Pay him no heed. You were right to not not refund the money.

This was my thought as a 50p bottle of dettol will do. The bloke sounds like a complete ass-hat... If he physically handled them and was happy to hand over cash then and there fro them then its his own damned fault for changing his mind.

Bloodhorror wrote:Recently i have gotten into a small matter of whether or not someone who has bought off me, 18 khorne bezerkers (8 of which were missing their Close Combat Weapons) a Chaos Lord with 2 Power Fists, and a Kharn the Betrayer Conversion stand in model for a Grand Total of £20.

i feel these three points beat his argument.

1. I stated the Missing weapons and the conversion model before the agreement of price and to purchase.
2. He felt they needed stripping and he paints models for a living so its not that much a deal.
3. He had a good half an hour to examine the models before handing me the money.

He feels he deserves the Money back Due to...

1. They need stripping
2. Its a converted Model


This is the Message i sent him as well for those interested:

i have 18 Khorne Bezerkers with one Skull Champion who has a Plasma Pistol and a Power fist.

I also have a Khorne Chaos Lord with 2 powerfists, even though he can only use one...
and a rather odd Kharn the Betrayer converted Model, that will require some stripping as chris did a gak job at painting and a great job of erasing all the detail ¬¬.

i got ALL of theese off of chris for my necrons and there in... mixed condition... 8 of them do not have any close combat weapons, but i am working on getting those repaired at the moment.

I am also looking for Money as i am starting my Dark eldar army as you know, and the less money i have to put into the project, the better XD!

So i am Looking for £27 for the lot if you have that to spare

Thoughts and Opinions People?

And i do apologise if this is in the Wrong Place....

His points do not really even look serious, or even deserve serious discussion.

You sold him some guys, he paid for them.... end of story.

Of course if there is something missing from the tale, you'd better fess up now... We will find out sooner or later.

Well there was that point i held the gun to his head and said gimme the £20....

But surely that makes no difference ^^?

Bloodhorror wrote:Well there was that point i held the gun to his head and said gimme the £20....

But surely that makes no difference ^^?

Basically, unless you actually did this, the buyer is a clot.

I cant even think of buyers remorse as an excuse, did he twok £20 out of his grannies purse for these?

Some where along the time line in the future , the story of what happened regarding this incident will change.

He is going to have customers and fan base following him around , and he'll make up a whole new story to what happened.

So store up some proof if you can.

i.e. this site?

All that is on this site is a bunch of stories anonymous people tell on the internet.

+1, to most of the above (except the messing with his family bit)

Obvious buyers remorse. However, even here in AUS you can strip that many minis for only $4AUD, which is only 6.5GBP, not what he suggested...

If he IS in fact a professional painter who makes a living off his services, this should be nothing and he should not need to go out and buy special stripping fluid as he would have some already. Especially if his services are worth his costs...

Find somewhere else to game, tell him to feth off and Im sure you could paint your minis yourself or even find a better alternative, as per his stripping quote, he already charges too much for his time.