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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 18:12:35
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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Committed Chaos Cult Marine
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http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/08/us/politics/08impact.html?_r=1&hp
The deal to extend the Bush-era tax cuts for two years includes a bevy of additional credits and deductions that will reduce the burden on nearly all households.
But the tax benefits will flow most heavily to the highest earners, just as the original cuts did when they were passed in 2001 and 2003. At least a quarter of the tax savings will go to the wealthiest 1 percent of the population.
The tentative deal includes a two-year patch for the alternative minimum tax, a reduction in the payroll tax and a plan to reinstate the estate tax with lower rates and higher exemptions than in 2009 — all of which will offer far more savings for high earners than those in the low- or middle-income bracket.
The wealthiest Americans will also reap tax savings from the proposal’s plan to keep the cap on dividend and capital gains taxes at 15 percent, well below the highest rates on ordinary income.
And negotiators have agreed that the estimated $900 billion cost of the cuts will simply be added to the deficit — not covered by reductions in spending or increases in other taxes. That is good news for hedge fund managers and private equity investors, who appear to have withstood an effort to get them to pay more by eliminating a quirk in the tax code that allows most of their income to be taxed at just 15 percent.
In fact, the only groups likely to face a tax increase are those near the bottom of the income scale — individuals who make less than $20,000 and families with earnings below $40,000.
“It’s going to look like the rich are getting richer again,” said Anne Mathias, an analyst for MF Global Inc.
In the agreement, which breaks a campaign pledge to eliminate some tax breaks for the top 2 percent of American earners, President Obama won a few concessions from Republicans, including a 13-month extension in government benefits for the long-term unemployed. After several extensions, the maximum has been 99 weeks.
The administration also succeeded in extending several of the tax credits in last year’s stimulus plan to aid low- and moderate-income Americans: the earned-income tax credit, the child credit, the child and dependent-care credit and the tuition deduction.
As a result, families with an income near the median of $55,000 would owe about $2,700 less in taxes than if the Bush-era cuts had been allowed to expire.
A two-income couple earning $146,000 would owe about $7,000 less than if the tax cuts were allowed to expire, and about $3,400 less than they did in 2009.
The proposal does not include an extension of Mr. Obama’s signature tax cut, the Making Work Pay credit, which provided a credit of up to $400 for individuals and $800 for families of low and moderate income. Instead, the plan creates a one-year reduction in Social Security payroll taxes, which are generally levied on the first $106,800 of income. For an individual earning $110,000, that provision would reduce payroll taxes by $2,136.
Although the $120 billion payroll tax reduction offers nearly twice the tax savings of the credit it replaces, it will nonetheless lead to higher tax bills for individuals with incomes below $20,000 and families that make less than $40,000. That is because their payroll tax savings are less than the $400 or $800 they will lose from the Making Work Pay credit.
“It will come to a few dollars a week,” said Roberton Williams, an analyst at the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center, “but it is an increase.”
To the wealthiest Americans, however, an assortment of breaks is available.
The plan includes a two-year “patch” for the alternative minimum tax, which is now paid by about 4 million taxpayers with income in the mid- to high six figures. Without the patch, more than 20 million additional taxpayers would have been liable for that tax.
The estate tax — which was allowed to lapse this year and was scheduled to resume at a rate of 55 percent on most assets above $1 million — will be reinstated under less onerous terms. Estates over $5 million will be subject to a 35 percent tax.
The proposal will also maintain the current rates on dividends and capital gains, averting scheduled increases to ordinary income and 20 percent, respectively.
The marginal tax rate on high incomes will also remain unchanged. The top brackets had been scheduled to increase to 36 percent and 39.6 percent, from 33 percent and 35 percent.
Under Mr. Obama’s failed proposal, which would have raised the rates on income over $250,000 for families and $200,000 for individuals, the taxpayers at the top 1 percent of the income scale — those with incomes above $564,000 — would have received an average tax break of $28,000. Under the agreement reached with Republicans, the top 1 percent will receive breaks of about $70,000.
I might as well vote republican, or hell become one myself. They get what they want anyways. Hell if they well take Michael Steele there has to be a spot for me!
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And whilst you're pointing and shouting at the boogeyman in the corner, you're missing the burglar coming in through the window.
Well, Duh! Because they had a giant Mining ship. If you had a giant mining ship you would drill holes in everything too, before you'd destory it with a black hole |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 18:14:53
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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So you're a left winger then. Got it.
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 18:27:05
Subject: Re:Failure-in-chief
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Stubborn Hammerer
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I'm glad everyone is serious about reducing the deficit.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 18:29:34
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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Raising taxes in the middle of the worst recession since the Great Depression is contraindicated. Anyone espousing such frankly is falling into the same trap that happened with FDR.
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 18:44:57
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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Hangin' with Gork & Mork
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Frazzled wrote:Raising taxes in the middle of the worst recession since the Great Depression is contraindicated. Anyone espousing such frankly is falling into the same trap that happened with FDR.
Is that how he got polio?
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Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 18:48:38
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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!!Goffik Rocker!!
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Frazzled wrote:Raising taxes in the middle of the worst recession since the Great Depression is contraindicated. Anyone espousing such frankly is falling into the same trap that happened with FDR. Says the guy whining like a baby every time anyone brings up debt statistics while blaming the dems for "outrageous spending". That KoolAid must of had some LSD in it.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2010/12/08 18:49:13
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Do you remember that time that thing happened?
This is a bad thread and you should all feel bad |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 18:50:29
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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Ahtman wrote:Frazzled wrote:Raising taxes in the middle of the worst recession since the Great Depression is contraindicated. Anyone espousing such frankly is falling into the same trap that happened with FDR.
Is that how he got polio?
No, but it was fundamental to his transformation from mild mannered US President to ROBOSUPERPRZFDR! Fortunately for us, his transformation was complete in time and he was able to foil Red Skull's nefarious schemes. But it sure was touch and go I'll say. Automatically Appended Next Post: ShumaGorath wrote:Says the guy whining like a baby every time anyone brings up debt statistics while blaming the dems for "outrageous spending". That KoolAid must of had some LSD in it.
I wish!
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/12/08 18:51:48
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 19:39:23
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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I'm not sure how useful losing .5 trillion American dollars in revenue can work. Some one explain using graphs, charts, and data that I could comprehend this. Psst....I'm not a pinko-liberal, but I would like concrete facts that Limbaugh economics does work.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/12/08 19:39:28
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 19:53:58
Subject: Re:Failure-in-chief
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Mutated Chosen Chaos Marine
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Obama....another talking head of a president. At least he has worked to patch up our international relations, but his campaign promises of change and real transparency were just that. Campaign promises.
P.S. I'm so far to the left you'd think I was a right winger on occasion. Overly powerful central government scares me, as does a government with no fear of its populace.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2010/12/08 19:55:12
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 19:55:35
Subject: Re:Failure-in-chief
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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agroszkiewicz wrote:Obama....another talking head of a president. At least he has worked to patch up our international relations, but his campaign promises of change and real transparency were just that. Campaign promises.
Well, you could actually go out on a limb and say that Obama hurt us in the opposite direction for international relationships by not appearing as strong on the international stage as Bush projected. Of course, domestic conservative media could be the only ones saying Obama is an apologetic coward.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 20:42:45
Subject: Re:Failure-in-chief
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Mutated Chosen Chaos Marine
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WarOne wrote:agroszkiewicz wrote:Obama....another talking head of a president. At least he has worked to patch up our international relations, but his campaign promises of change and real transparency were just that. Campaign promises.
Well, you could actually go out on a limb and say that Obama hurt us in the opposite direction for international relationships by not appearing as strong on the international stage as Bush projected. Of course, domestic conservative media could be the only ones saying Obama is an apologetic coward.
One could also conversely argue that Bush strengthened American foreign policy because the world now knows its not ok to "try to kill my daddy".
And that the moon landing is fake.
And that there is a giant dinosaur living in a lake in Scotland.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 20:43:35
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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Joined the Military for Authentic Experience
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Blame Obama for the Republicans, seems sensible. I mean, he MADE all those people vote them back in, after all.
I'm gradually getting more and more frustrated with people who seem to fail to understand that governing requires compromise. It seems to be particularly left wing people that have trouble with this, and will turn on their representatives viciously if they don't live up to frankly unatainable standards. But by the same token, they won't get up off their arses and vote unless those unatainable things are promised.
*growl*
(I'm projecting some discontent that is unrelated to american politics here)
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 20:47:46
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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Mutated Chosen Chaos Marine
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Da Boss wrote:It seems to be particularly left wing people that have trouble with this, and will turn on their representatives viciously if they don't live up to frankly unatainable standards. But by the same token, they won't get up off their arses and vote unless those unatainable things are promised.
More like frustration with politicians promising the moon and then barely having the ability to give us a piece of cheese. Not government cheese, just some nice sharp cheddar....tasty but in the end it leaves you hungry and with stinky poo.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 20:50:20
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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Joined the Military for Authentic Experience
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Yeah but do you not accept that a lot of left wing people (primarily younger voters) will not get up and vote for anything less than a promise of the moon?
Also, the Irish Government could help you with that cheese problem:
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2010/1105/breaking22.html
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 21:01:47
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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Committed Chaos Cult Marine
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@ Da Boss. This isn't a compromise. The health care bill was (no universal care or abortion care). giving up on the climate bill was also. The was one side getting everything they want and the other giving everything they have.
All that talk about the debt ruining our nation, then they turn around and pile more on. Hell we haven't even closed Gitmo. People on the left are angry that all the hard work done to elect BO amounted to nothing. Hell did Bush give the Democrats everything? No, the man lacked a lot of things, but one thing he had was a back bone.
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And whilst you're pointing and shouting at the boogeyman in the corner, you're missing the burglar coming in through the window.
Well, Duh! Because they had a giant Mining ship. If you had a giant mining ship you would drill holes in everything too, before you'd destory it with a black hole |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 21:05:06
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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Joined the Military for Authentic Experience
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He got some concessions, they're in the article. I will admit, the republicans seem to be much better negotiators than the democrats, and as a party, much more disciplined, which makes them more effective.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 21:20:50
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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!!Goffik Rocker!!
(THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY LEFT BLANK)
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Da Boss wrote:He got some concessions, they're in the article. I will admit, the republicans seem to be much better negotiators than the democrats, and as a party, much more disciplined, which makes them more effective.
Sebster had a great quote about the republicans being a great and effective party thats utterly insane and the democrats being an ineffective and confused party that is reasonable.
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Do you remember that time that thing happened?
This is a bad thread and you should all feel bad |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 21:25:47
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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[MOD]
Solahma
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Da Boss wrote:I'm gradually getting more and more frustrated with people who seem to fail to understand that governing requires compromise. It seems to be particularly left wing people that have trouble with this, and will turn on their representatives viciously if they don't live up to frankly unatainable standards.
The left you say? Watch the Tea Party in the coming months. You'll have to pay closer attention than in the past, however, because people aren't as loud when they realize they're wrong.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 21:26:27
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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Joined the Military for Authentic Experience
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That will be fun, and it is a good point, Manchu.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 21:27:29
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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[MOD]
Solahma
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ShumaGorath wrote:Sebster had a great quote about the republicans being a great and effective party thats utterly insane and the democrats being an ineffective and confused party that is reasonable.
Authoritarians are usually well-organized. Automatically Appended Next Post: Da Boss wrote:That will be fun . . .
No it won't, as an Irishman in 2010 knows better than most.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/12/08 21:33:21
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 21:50:32
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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[SWAP SHOP MOD]
Killer Klaivex
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One of these days, I should really learn how the American political system works.....
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 21:53:47
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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Joined the Military for Authentic Experience
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Manchu wrote:ShumaGorath wrote:Sebster had a great quote about the republicans being a great and effective party thats utterly insane and the democrats being an ineffective and confused party that is reasonable.
Authoritarians are usually well-organized.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Da Boss wrote:That will be fun . . .
No it won't, as an Irishman in 2010 knows better than most.
Indeed, my statement was dripping sarcasm that doesn't come across well in text.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 21:55:25
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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[MOD]
Solahma
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I was just trying to come across as prophetic. But predicting that a man will fall down the stairs if you push him down the stairs is not very prophetic, I guess.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 22:02:19
Subject: Re:Failure-in-chief
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Nasty Nob on Warbike with Klaw
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Left wing and right wing are just two hands of the same puppet master. Don't fall for their manipulations. Partisan politics is a trap to stop you from thinking about the real issues, like how the government is just a front for the global elites.
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WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!!!!! |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 22:04:01
Subject: Re:Failure-in-chief
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[MOD]
Solahma
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warpcrafter wrote: like how the government is just a front for the global elites.
The time is past when this can be dismissed as paranoia. Even so, I think there are some who are genuinely disatisfied with this arrangement. As constituents, they lean right. As governors, they lean left.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 22:05:04
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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Hauptmann
Diligently behind a rifle...
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sexiest_hero wrote:@ Da Boss. This isn't a compromise. The health care bill was (no universal care or abortion care). giving up on the climate bill was also. The was one side getting everything they want and the other giving everything they have.
All that talk about the debt ruining our nation, then they turn around and pile more on. Hell we haven't even closed Gitmo. People on the left are angry that all the hard work done to elect BO amounted to nothing. Hell did Bush give the Democrats everything? No, the man lacked a lot of things, but one thing he had was a back bone.
The healthcare bill was a compromise?! When did this happen? Why did 71% of Americans who said "No" in polling get ignored?
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Catachan LIX "Lords Of Destruction" - Put Away
1943-1944 Era 1250 point Großdeutchland Force - Bolt Action
"The best medicine for Wraithlords? Multilasers. The best way to kill an Avatar? Lasguns."
"Time to pour out some liquor for the pinkmisted Harlequins"
Res Ipsa Loquitor |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 22:06:18
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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[MOD]
Solahma
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Said no to what?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 22:07:32
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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Hauptmann
Diligently behind a rifle...
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Manchu wrote:Said no to what?
That they didn't want the Healthcare bill as it was passed.
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Catachan LIX "Lords Of Destruction" - Put Away
1943-1944 Era 1250 point Großdeutchland Force - Bolt Action
"The best medicine for Wraithlords? Multilasers. The best way to kill an Avatar? Lasguns."
"Time to pour out some liquor for the pinkmisted Harlequins"
Res Ipsa Loquitor |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 22:09:05
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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[MOD]
Solahma
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Ah. So was that a rhetorical question or do you really think that the electorate is happy with anything as intensely and expensively opposed as the healthcare bill? Automatically Appended Next Post: I mean, I don't know anyone who would say yes to "death panels" but I know many who believe that was what was going to be/what was passed.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/12/08 22:10:04
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2010/12/08 22:11:55
Subject: Failure-in-chief
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Hauptmann
Diligently behind a rifle...
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Manchu wrote:Ah. So was that a rhetorical question or do you really think that the electorate is happy with anything as intensely and expensively opposed as the healthcare bill?
I don't think they're happy with it at all.
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Catachan LIX "Lords Of Destruction" - Put Away
1943-1944 Era 1250 point Großdeutchland Force - Bolt Action
"The best medicine for Wraithlords? Multilasers. The best way to kill an Avatar? Lasguns."
"Time to pour out some liquor for the pinkmisted Harlequins"
Res Ipsa Loquitor |
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