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I was just wondering why these seem so rare. I can understand the obvious advantage of having assault troops get where they need to be faster. But surely at least one of the many chapters out there has ASM with Bolters, Plasmas, and so on. Or maybe tacs with jump packs makes more sense? I wouldn't be suprised if this is answered in a Codex or on some article on SM organization, however I admittedly do not read these because I don't like wading through endless minutiae like how many Heavy Bolters a certain company has, or how many Predators the chapter owns, just to find one small detail. Plus I'm not really a marine guy, unless we're talking traitors...

I was thinking this...
Fast moving tactical marines who can redeploy really quickly... sounds great for fightng Tyranids...

Assault marines do take range weapons. All come standard with bolt pistols. Plasma guns, flamers, and Meltaguns can be taken instead for certain dudes. Death company (I play BA so this is relevant) can be tooled as a death star ASM squad, and they can take bolters standard. The reason that they don't is because assault marines are designed to close with the enemy. Heavy weapons require a backpack of ammo/battery to power and that replaces their jump packs, so only rifles and such could be taken, and in a close combat situation, or at close range where they'll be operating, a pistol will suffice and still give attack bonuses.

Jump packs let them move quickly so if you equipped a normal tactical squad with them they would not only be able to avoid enemy CC but you could have a very fast moving strikeforce without the need for vehicles.

Well, nobody is preventing you in punting bolter into your ASM model...

I could get some wolf guard with bolters and give them jump packs... but that would be hidiously expensive... i may try it someday.

You could but they'd then suffer when it came to combat. It's all about optimisation. If you move quickly, you don't need long ranged weapons and vice versa.

That's why Devastators don't tend to run with chainswords and Assault marines don't tend to carry lascannons.

That makes sense. I guess I was thinking along the lines of a Crisis Suit. There's just something so quintessentially sci-fi about a space marine with a jetpack shooting a laser gun. When you give him a sword it gets a wee bit anachronistic, but hey that's 40k for you.

Are there really no chapters that do this though? Seems like out of all the various doctrines and stratgems employed by the many, many SM chapters someone out there would do this.

Also as clarification when I say ranged weapon I mean Plasma Guns, Meltas, Bolters, and so on, not just a pistol.

Yes, there are sometimes one or two members of an assault squad who will carry a flamer or melta gun - allowing them to take on any additional armour threat or dug in enemy without compromising the overall effectiveness of the unit.

But, by and large, not a lot of point. If you wanted a squad of Marines with Bolters and Plasma guns, they have Drop Pods and fast transports to do that job.

Jetpacks is fer jumpin' towards the enemy chainswords a blazing!

The 4th ed BA codex could have Veteran Assault Marines with bolters and packs if I remember rightly. It's more or less disappeared besides Death Company though.

asimo77 wrote:That makes sense. I guess I was thinking along the lines of a Crisis Suit. There's just something so quintessentially sci-fi about a space marine with a jetpack shooting a laser gun. When you give him a sword it gets a wee bit anachronistic, but hey that's 40k for you.

Are there really no chapters that do this though? Seems like out of all the various doctrines and stratgems employed by the many, many SM chapters someone out there would do this.

Also as clarification when I say ranged weapon I mean Plasma Guns, Meltas, Bolters, and so on, not just a pistol.

Why not play Tau?

Good man! +1 to you!
But in all honesty there are a lot of chapters with a heavy focus on jump infantry (BA, Doom Eagles, Raven Guard, etc etc etc) but the defining lines of the codex astartes differentiate the tactics applied to jump infantry heavy infantry and general infantry. They're armed that way out of tradition and tactics, as They're optimised (as someone said earlier) for their jobs. Space marines are monstrous compared to a regular human in close combat, so they have jetpacks to prevent the cowards from running, to vault over obstacles, and generally to pull a Superman and go flying into the enemy. Plus there's a certain amount of bravado (at least for my BA) associated with the risks of launching oneself head on into oncoming fire and blades...
As to the "power armored dude with a sword" being backwards, Considering even today, when we have prototype energy weapons, the general grunt still carries a knife, blades and sharp pointy things will always be useful in a close arena scenario, where, as the BRB puts it "The best gun in the galaxy won't help if your enemy is bashing your head in with a rock!"

I'd find it extremely weird to call someone an ASSAULT marine, unless they were specifically made to make ASSAULTS. I assume by ASM you mean Assault Space Marines. If you give a guy a gun instead of a sword, he'd be silly to run into a melee, which is what assaulting is. A dude with a jump pack and a gun is just a fast moving tac-marine, in my opinion.

Not necessarily...
The rules of the game call CC assaulting but it could just as easily be aggressively moving and shooting...

The rules of the game states that assaulting is moving into close combat.

SgtSixkilla wrote:The rules of the game states that assaulting is moving into close combat.

Fair enough but my point is still there. The rules say assaulting is one thing but the actual definition of the word is different.

True. But the OP had to do with this game specifically, unless I'm completely mistaken.

SgtSixkilla wrote:True. But the OP had to do with this game specifically, unless I'm completely mistaken.

I think it's a mix of in-game and background...
Background-wise there isn't much of a reason and it may be really good for certain areas/enemies.
Game-wise-It would either be really really bad or really really over powered.

Or balanced if you limited it to a specific number of Special Weapons, and allowed bolters. It would kill my nids much faster to say the least...

Pretty much...
I have an urge to try out combi-flamer Wolf Guard with jump packs now...
I wonder how they would play...

Oh let me clarify I was talking from a fluff perspective only. I guess I could have just as easily called them tacs with jump packs but ASM with Bolters is more or less the same idea.

It makes sense as an idea...
Imagne fighting Orks or Tyranids and you're frontline units can move doble the speed and across unpassable terrain e.g. rivers, chasms etc

Tbh I think jet packs make every situation better. Wouldn't you say at any given point in time having a jetpack would make your life better? I would fo sho

asimo77 wrote:Tbh I think jet packs make every situation better. Wouldn't you say at any given point in time having a jetpack would make your life better? I would fo sho

Quoted for truth. Fluff or not.

Well, it makes sense to me to have a shooty unit with jump packs.

As the enemy draws near, you jump backwards or above them yo keep the distance and keep shooting at them while shouting "LOL I TROLL U!" xD

Does the SM Codex allow for ranged ASM, though? If not, the question is largely moot.

asimo77 wrote:There's just something so quintessentially sci-fi about a space marine with a jetpack shooting a laser gun.

40K is more Science Fantasy than Sci-fi, though.

You could say that about most sci.fi., since it almost always revolves around an impossible concept. I hate fantasy, and would therefore never include fantasy in describing 40K. And since even magically looking things in 40K are essentially warp-bourne, it strays even further from the science fantasy genre. (But logically, I do agree.)

Eh it takes place in space and has lazor guns. That's enough science and fiction for me personally.

And it has mind readers, sorcerers, demons, gods, immortals, eldar etc.