Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I'm looking into picking up WM.

However, I'm not sure what army to play.

From WH40k I played Orks and Blood Angels.

So I'm accustomed to these playing styles.

Being fast and overpowering with numbers / strength.

Being fast with superior firepower and above average strength.

I also play WHFB with Warriors of Chaos.

That's more a synergy-theme army. Everything comes together to downright kill my opponent.


I played as Menoth against Cygnar, I was getting my teeth kicked in but I used the main HQ for Menoth and used that fire ability and nuked his HQ resulting in a win.
Now I'm not saying I should play Menoth just because I won my first smallest point game.
But I'd like to know where I could find a list of the spells and feats, or if someone could PM me.

I heard some good things about Cryx as far as speed goes, and Khador being the heavy hitters.
I'm aware Cygnar is Ranged and Menoth is more of a finesse army.

I'd appreciate any help.

Also what's the best box to go with?

There are actually quite a few feats and spells, too many to list. The website http://battlecollege.wikispaces.com/ gives you a general idea of the feats do and wht not, but does not specifically stat stuff. The analysis is usually good though.

There's not best box in the same way as there's no best faction. Just choose a faction first, worry about boxes later. Unless you mean dollar value best that is.

As a side note, take everything on BattleCollege with a healthy grain of salt. There's a rather large number of rules errors on there that keep getting introduced to new players, and it's a pain in the ass to have to correct every new guy I see.

I wouldn't quite call Protectorate a finesse army. While there's a fair bit of synergy that dictates turn order to an extent, the way it behaves on the table is incredibly straight forward, almost to the extent of Khador's patented Axe-To-Face strategy.

I'd suggest looking at the Hordes factions as well. Hordes runs on the same rule set as Warmachine- with some minor diffrences in how FURY works for warbeasts compared to Focus for WM.

Fast with numbers could be Cryx or Legion of Everblight.

Dividing the difference between Ork and Blood Angel style will likely come down to more of the selection of models used from any particular faction. For example, with Cryx you could field many Mechanithralls for a mob, or Bane Knights for elite hard hitting infantry.

Speed is also a relative issue, based on model selection, and the abilities of a warcaster/warlock. Many of the casters have abilities through spells or feats that provide additional movement bonuses and can make even typically slow armies gain a surprising burst of speed.

Poke around the fluff and models- with the Privateer Press games its not uncommon to find the minis you like, and then find ways to adapt them to the style that suits you with the right warcaster and synergy bonuses

What are the main HQ units in the battleboxes called?

For Cryx at least.

Warwitch Deneghra.

Soladrin wrote:Warwitch Deneghra.

Thanks.

The_Savior wrote:What are the main HQ units in the battleboxes called?

For Cryx at least.

You've got:

Cryx - Warwitch Deneghra (Denny, pDeneghra, Deneghra1)
Cygnar - Captain Victoria Haley (Haley, pHaley, Haley1)
Khador - Kommander Sorscha Kratikoff (Sorscha, pSorscha, Sorscha1)
Protectorate of Menoth - High Exemplar Kreoss (Kreoss, pKreoss, Kreoss1)

In brackets are the most common nicknames you'll see around internet for them. Though they are not HQ units, they are warcasters. This is very pedantic but Privateer Press uses very specific words to help define what spells have what effects. (One spell could improve a model, another a model/unit. The second could be used on a warcaster or unit but the first would only improve one model in a unit rather than the whole group)

You say about synergy being important for Warriors of Chaos, that's what warmachine is about. This model does this, so that unit can do that, ending with a giant robot throwing another and squishing the opposing warcaster underneath. However, some factions need the synergy more than others.

Menoth is a good example as their jacks are comparatively worse than others. A point or two less armour than Khador but still as slow and the weapons are slightly less powerful. When you add in the choir (a cheap unit), they go first and either protect the jacks from ranged attacks so that their armour doesn't matter as nothing is going to hit them or improve their damage so that the weapons can do a load of damage in one turn.

"Being fast and overpowering with numbers / strength" - generally this matches cryx (or legion over in the hordes part of the game)
"Being fast with superior firepower and above average strength. " - This can match up with Khador.

The reason I'm being general about matching those quotes with a faction is that, like Mistress of minis says what you choose for your army means different play styles. For cryx I could put a load of cheap expendable troops on the board (Mechanithralls) and with pSkarre just throw them at the front lines without a care in the world for their deaths. I change pSkarre for Terminus and those troops are then being used as a screen against things shooting me and when they are damaged they have a one in three chance of staying alive.

If I stay with Cryx and choose Mortenebra for my warcaster, she loves 'jacks so I'm going to be looking at a low model count but all of them can hit hard.

Oh and the reason for the p's and 1 with the nicknames is that the timeline moves in warmachine so after 6 years of war the warcasters there at the beginning have learnt different skills and ways to deal with things. Asphyxious1 (pAsphyxious) is generally about getting to the other caster and killing them in close combat. Asphyxious2 (eAsphyxious) is about sending in his troops to do the same thing whilst he hangs at the back.

BTW, I play cryx mostly so that's why my examples are biased towards them. Choose your faction based on looks and general playstyle and you can't really go wrong, but you should be prepared for different warcasters in the same faction to have wildly different ways of playing.

Pst. The Cygnar battle box caster is Stryker.

yastobaal wrote:

The_Savior wrote:What are the main HQ units in the battleboxes called?

For Cryx at least.

You've got:

Cryx - Warwitch Deneghra (Denny, pDeneghra, Deneghra1)
Cygnar - Captain Victoria Haley (Haley, pHaley, Haley1)
Khador - Kommander Sorscha Kratikoff (Sorscha, pSorscha, Sorscha1)
Protectorate of Menoth - High Exemplar Kreoss (Kreoss, pKreoss, Kreoss1)

In brackets are the most common nicknames you'll see around internet for them. Though they are not HQ units, they are warcasters. This is very pedantic but Privateer Press uses very specific words to help define what spells have what effects. (One spell could improve a model, another a model/unit. The second could be used on a warcaster or unit but the first would only improve one model in a unit rather than the whole group)

You say about synergy being important for Warriors of Chaos, that's what warmachine is about. This model does this, so that unit can do that, ending with a giant robot throwing another and squishing the opposing warcaster underneath. However, some factions need the synergy more than others.

Menoth is a good example as their jacks are comparatively worse than others. A point or two less armour than Khador but still as slow and the weapons are slightly less powerful. When you add in the choir (a cheap unit), they go first and either protect the jacks from ranged attacks so that their armour doesn't matter as nothing is going to hit them or improve their damage so that the weapons can do a load of damage in one turn.

"Being fast and overpowering with numbers / strength" - generally this matches cryx (or legion over in the hordes part of the game)
"Being fast with superior firepower and above average strength. " - This can match up with Khador.

The reason I'm being general about matching those quotes with a faction is that, like Mistress of minis says what you choose for your army means different play styles. For cryx I could put a load of cheap expendable troops on the board (Mechanithralls) and with pSkarre just throw them at the front lines without a care in the world for their deaths. I change pSkarre for Terminus and those troops are then being used as a screen against things shooting me and when they are damaged they have a one in three chance of staying alive.

If I stay with Cryx and choose Mortenebra for my warcaster, she loves 'jacks so I'm going to be looking at a low model count but all of them can hit hard.

Oh and the reason for the p's and 1 with the nicknames is that the timeline moves in warmachine so after 6 years of war the warcasters there at the beginning have learnt different skills and ways to deal with things. Asphyxious1 (pAsphyxious) is generally about getting to the other caster and killing them in close combat. Asphyxious2 (eAsphyxious) is about sending in his troops to do the same thing whilst he hangs at the back.

BTW, I play cryx mostly so that's why my examples are biased towards them. Choose your faction based on looks and general playstyle and you can't really go wrong, but you should be prepared for different warcasters in the same faction to have wildly different ways of playing.

Why thanks for all of that.

I was looking them up, and I really like the way they look. I also like the spells and play style.

Something about slowly weakening my opponent, and then crushing them in one mighty blow appeals to me.

I'd appreciate it, if you could PM me on Cryx, to discuss tactica, and what models to avoid and look into on building.

Another trick for Cryx armies- is arc nodes! Arc nodes are on certain light warjacks- and allow your warcaster to cast their spells through the warjack with the arc node. With the right warcaster and a few arc nodes on their bone jacks a spell can come from several different angles and really makes the opposing player have to work

One other option you might want to look into- is watching some warmachine games on Vassal. Sometimes the games flow pretty quick- but often its a good way to see other peoples armies at work and get an idea of how certain forces work ^_^

I played my first game tonight against Cryx, it did not end well for me. They are quick and deadly, I'd say go for the battle box!

I bought the battlebox last night actually.

The_Savior wrote:I bought the battlebox last night actually.

A good step from there is either the faction deck or the faction book. They helped me a lot, gave me a chance to see what all was available and what fit into my playstyle.

I wanted the book, I already found the cards online. Where I can view them.

My local rules are no cards, no game. Don't know how your FLGS works, but playing without cards is no-no for me. Having to pick up a book everytime you want to know some model's stat line is just no fun. That, and we put ours in card protectors (Think MTG) and just use erasable markers to keep up the damage points.

So... you mean even if I had it bookmarked, and or memorized. Could easily show it, or had the book open to prove it.

You'd say no, just because you think it's not fun?

You don't deserve to have insanity wolf for an avatar sir.

I will note though, when I demoed it, my opponent/friend did have the cards in sleeves as you aforementioned.

Soladrin wrote:My local rules are no cards, no game. Don't know how your FLGS works, but playing without cards is no-no for me. Having to pick up a book everytime you want to know some model's stat line is just no fun. That, and we put ours in card protectors (Think MTG) and just use erasable markers to keep up the damage points.

First off I would totally agree with this. No cards is means no game with people that I play with. And for a few reasons

1: You maybe able to memorize you peices, but I do not and if I want a reference what you abilities are I am not going to trust your memory, since simple wording like "MAY" or "MUST" can get lost in translation. Some abilites are lengthy in wording, and have conditions that need to be meet before you can use them. You will say but I have the book, we can look there...which brings me to point 2.
2: Yes it is in the book, and having the book there is nice, but if I want to read an ability then you have to flip open the book to the right page, and that is time consuming. A card can simply be passed examined and returned. Which brings me to point 3.
3: You have to track damage accurately, and is always available for your opponent to examine. While you can design grids to track the damage with many of the army building programs and website, if you track it on the card then it is all right there for inspection.

I guess I'm just biased because I'm patient and non-lazy. Also the members of my FLGS are all close friends. We have a tight circle, so I guess that's why I consider it not a problem.

But I did plan on getting the cards.

Wait a second, the models don't come with the cards when you get them?

The models do indeed come with cards. There's the occasional one that will still have MkI cards in the blister, of course, but picking up a 2010 faction deck can fix that quickly.

I was aware they do come with cards.

Do they say MK2 or something on them though?

No, but a giveaway is the point cost of the model. In the old system things cost about 10x what they do in the new system. For instance my Man O War Kovnik came with a MkI card that said it cost 35 points. The MkII card says 3 points.

The_Savior wrote:So... you mean even if I had it bookmarked, and or memorized. Could easily show it, or had the book open to prove it.

You'd say no, just because you think it's not fun?

You don't deserve to have insanity wolf for an avatar sir.

I will note though, when I demoed it, my opponent/friend did have the cards in sleeves as you aforementioned.

Well we don't enforce it that hard. But it's generally frowned upon to not have the cards for your own army.

Proxy/try outs is a different matter ofcourse.

Well the Battlebox comes with the cards yes?

If that's the case, we'd have no problems.

Not sure, never bought a box.

That said, having the deck is (IMO) always handy.

Well, apparently it comes with the cards if I've read correctly.

So, no harm no foul?

The_Savior wrote:Well the Battlebox comes with the cards yes?

If that's the case, we'd have no problems.

I'm confused about this whole conversation: it's my understanding that all models for Warmachine/hordes come with the cards to play them, no?

As for not playing with the cards, while that could conceivably work for single wound models, it would be prohibitively difficult to play a warjack/warbeast without the relevant card. The only reason I can imagine you would want to play without the actual cards would be... testing a new list before you have the models, I guess?

As for the boxes, the plastic boxes definitely come with the cards, as do any modern blister packs (see the excellent "What's in the Box" series of vids put out by Beasts of War for the exact contents of a number of things).

All WM/ Hordes models come with cards. The only blisters without cards are the ones, which have extra grunts to update min size unit to max size unit. The reasoning behind that is that you need to have the unit box to add the extra grunts to.

The problem is that a lot of stores still have old stock, which has Mk1 cards in. For example last month I bought Basilisk Drake from Maelstrom and it had the Mk1 card included. I have the Mk2 deck for skorne so it made no difference, otherwise I would have needed to contact PP for replacement.

If you purchase minis off of ebay or acquire them via trades they usually dont have cards. Which is why I now have to get a merc, cryx and cygnar deck....stupid addictions.....