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In The Eldar Codex It Says "To all intents and purposes, An Avatar is a daemon and will therefore be affected by weapons and abilities that affect Daemons"

Does this mean that the Avatar is immune to instant death? he does not have the Daemon special rule but that's because the Daemon codex was not out at the time and it does say that it is a daemon.

If i were against him, i would say yes. It only seems fair.

No, he is just a Daemon. He is not a Codex Daemons daemon, therefore does not get Eternal Warrior.

nosferatu1001 wrote:No, he is just a Daemon. He is not a Codex Daemons daemon, therefore does not get Eternal Warrior.

Yeah, this is true, I was just wondering seeing as now he and the Eldar are having a massive debuff against Grey Knights, and also, as Grey knights have preferred enemy (Daemons) does the Avatar get effected by this?

@ GoDz BuZzSaw -
Eh? How in the least did eldar get a massive debuff against GK? If anything, they got a massive boost competitively, as the are the only codex with access to the piece of wargear known as the 15pt "I troll your army" button.

Yes, runes of warding is the equivalent of giving the middle finger to the vast majority of the Grey Knight list.

Back on topic: Grey Knights definitely get preferred enemy against the avatar, as a result of the "Daemon" special rule.

On an amusing side note, if the avatar actually got eternal warrior as a result of the daemon special rule, he would probably have to enter play by deepstrike just like all the other entries in the daemons codex. That would be most amusing...

Warboss Gutrip wrote:@ GoDz BuZzSaw -
Eh? How in the least did eldar get a massive debuff against GK? If anything, they got a massive boost competitively, as the are the only codex with access to the piece of wargear known as the 15pt "I troll your army" button.

Yes, runes of warding is the equivalent of giving the middle finger to the vast majority of the Grey Knight list.

Back on topic: Grey Knights definitely get preferred enemy against the avatar, as a result of the "Daemon" special rule.

On an amusing side note, if the avatar actually got eternal warrior as a result of the daemon special rule, he would probably have to enter play by deepstrike just like all the other entries in the daemons codex. That would be most amusing...

Yes, That Is a massive boost, making GK's take the psychic tests on 3D6, but the avatar can be ID'd easy, all a normal guy needs to do is pass one ld and he's dead. And that's with a guy from a strike force. and the banner means they get to activate them automatically.

True, but the avatar doesn't feature in a mechdar list, and the extent of the debuff isn't initially fully apparent. Don't forget that the psychic test is taken on 3D6 even for vehicles, and that perils of the warp (any roll of 12 or over thanks to RoWa!) causes a glancing hit. This could very easily turn the "immune to shaken and stunned" GK tanks into shaken, stunned, immobilised and weapon destroyed!

It is also important to remember that the GK psychic powers are factored into their pts cost; if the GK player fears the runes so much that he simply doesn't cast all game, he is effectively throwing away a large number of pts. Also, the banner of 'auto-pass psi tests' is only really taken on big expensive deathstar units, units that the speedy Eldar are more than capable of zipping away from.

Call me insane, but I would go so far as to say that Eldar are Grey Knight's worst matchup. By quite a long run.

Orks? I can't see them doing well against a green tide.
But I would agree apart from a triple vindicator list Eldar would be tough match against GK.

Eldar are tough for GKs,

unles they have some Riflemen dreds. and then its goodnight eldar.


regular Auto-cannons rip Eldar up, Str8 auto-cannons even morso.

Rifleman dreads become a lot less scary when you can stun them, or when they try to prevent that from happening and end up stunning themselves.

Does the thingy that lets dreads fire without LOS require a psychic test? If so, I would say that eldar are undoubtedly bane of Grey Knights, pretty much all flavors.

Warboss Gutrip wrote:Rifleman dreads become a lot less scary when you can stun them, or when they try to prevent that from happening and end up stunning themselves.

Does the thingy that lets dreads fire without LOS require a psychic test? If so, I would say that eldar are undoubtedly bane of Grey Knights, pretty much all flavors.

There's no such thing as a thingy that lets dread fire without LOS.

GoDz BuZzSaW wrote:In The Eldar Codex It Says "To all intents and purposes, An Avatar is a daemon and will therefore be affected by weapons and abilities that affect Daemons"

Does this mean that the Avatar is immune to instant death? he does not have the Daemon special rule but that's because the Daemon codex was not out at the time and it does say that it is a daemon.

against GK you are better off taking 2 farseers. Double the rune of warding bubble and incase one dies.

Given the bubble is "the entire table", two arent really needed...

I used my GKs against a Footdar army with Eldrad and the Avatar and well I tabled him. Psy missles are nasty. Making the Avatar I 1 and T5 with my Grand master being Str 6 and Auto killing.

nosferatu1001 wrote:Given the bubble is "the entire table", two arent really needed...

well twice the wounds is nice

Warboss Gutrip wrote:Rifleman dreads become a lot less scary when you can stun them, or when they try to prevent that from happening and end up stunning themselves.

Does the thingy that lets dreads fire without LOS require a psychic test? If so, I would say that eldar are undoubtedly bane of Grey Knights, pretty much all flavors.

the Dreds have Fortitude, which negates Stunned and Shaken.


the thing you are thinking about is the GK Purgation squad's power Asteral Aim.

@ Grey Templar -
My apologies, you are absolutely correct, I simply had my wires crossed with it being a new codex and all.

@ Exergy -
Why double farseers? Why not just run Eldrad? He has RoWa, and contributes pretty nicely to the game with his "cast three powers a turn" niftiness.

Warboss Gutrip wrote:@ Grey Templar -
My apologies, you are absolutely correct, I simply had my wires crossed with it being a new codex and all.

@ Exergy -
Why double farseers? Why not just run Eldrad? He has RoWa, and contributes pretty nicely to the game with his "cast three powers a turn" niftiness.

I was going farseer and eldrad, 6 total wounds on 2 models.

Exergy wrote:

Warboss Gutrip wrote:@ Grey Templar -
My apologies, you are absolutely correct, I simply had my wires crossed with it being a new codex and all.

@ Exergy -
Why double farseers? Why not just run Eldrad? He has RoWa, and contributes pretty nicely to the game with his "cast three powers a turn" niftiness.

I was going farseer and eldrad, 6 total wounds on 2 models.

Just Eldrad would do fine in 1500 Vs Grey knights, he's pretty hard to kill and casts 3 powers a turn

As above. Farseers really shouldnt be getting wounded in the first place....

InquisitorVaron wrote:Orks? I can't see them doing well against a green tide.
But I would agree apart from a triple vindicator list Eldar would be tough match against GK.

Depends on what the GK list is. A Crowe list makes green tide cry like a little girl.

Hell, a normal list without Crowe but still taking purifiers makes green tide cry.

Losing half your boys before any blows are struck is a bad thing.

Yeah, don't charge purifiers... shoot them and run away. With only 3+ saves, there is only so much S4 shoota boy fire you can take before dying. What really hurts is Warbosses being nullified by GK, as he will die on the first wound.

18" < 24"

They shoot you and run away. S4 AP5 is no good for a green tide that has to keep moving to keep the purifiers in range.

6" difference means, if you shoot me, I can shoot you.
Their shooting is not scary, their cleansing flame is. Even with psybolt ammo, a squad of purifiers will only drop 7 boyz on avarage(4-5 with regular ammunition), as a kff should be there. While on the other side 30 shootas will average to 3-4 dead purifiers. So they both take about the same amount of time to wipe the other out in a vacuum, just by shooting.

But purifiers cost about twice as much as the boyz, and in a green tide there will be more units of boyz than units of purifiers, plus some Kanz shooting rokkits their way, or even assaulting them. Lootaz should be shooting riffle dreads, so they are out of the equation. It might be a hard game for the tide, but purifiers are by no means an "I win"-Button for the Grey Knights.

Which is the problem with talking about things in a vacuum.

Greentide also cant get away from purifiers if they want - rhinos deal with that.

or, even worse, if the Purifiers are in a Landraider or a Stormraven.

Why worse? More points on stuff I don't care about much, less purifiers and rifle dreads.

Green tide is usually also known as kan wall. Driving heads first into the kanz with your razobacks is a great gift to the ork player. And there is still the option of grot tarpits. Either way, when two mobs open fire at them, they are unlikely to survive the next turn, it gets way worse when kanz and lootas have the time to shoot them, too. I am more afraid of a single blend-a-tron dread than of a whole army (= max 4 squads of 10) of purifiers.

Also, don't forget the 1:10 chance of the purifiers charging boyz and getting smashed after their boss died of perils.

all Kan walls are Greentides, but not all Greentides are Kan Walls.


a pure Greentide means KFF meks and tons of boyz.


Kan wall is KFF Mek, slightly less boyz, and 6-9 Kans.


and a 1/10 chance to NOT get flamed is a horrible odd. it's not going to happen very often.

It is a 1/12 chance, not 1/10; there are 2 results on 2d6 that kill the Knight of the Flame: 2, and 12, the 2 will still have the power go off.

There is a 1/36 chance that any given result will occur on 2d6; there are 3 results that will have the power fail: 10, 11, and 12. 1/36*3 is 3/36, or simplified 1/12.