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I have noticed in some paintings and pictures that among the space marines, there are somewhat looking human people crowding around the marine. They are often seen around company command sqauds and librarians. They are seen doing the the dirty work for the marines like holding up massive books for the librarians and aiding the apothacaries. Does anyone know about these guys, what are they called? I want to see if i could make a couple of these guys and put them in my army to acompany my models, not for combat but just for that depth. here is a link to a picture. http://images.wikia.com/warhammer40k/images/8/8d/Sons_of_Corax_by_MajesticChicken.jpg
I count six in the picture. Thank you.

serfs or servitors most likely

Serfs.

Servitors are usually lobotomized and have all kinds of techy bits in place.

Kanluwen wrote:
Servitors are usually lobotomized and have all kinds of techy bits in place.

Agreed, but in the picture the OP linked it looks like they all have cybernetic augmentation, so I'd say they servitors.

I wouldn't necessarily say they're Servitors. They have techy bits, but no surgical scars around their heads for lobotomy.

You definitely could be right. It was my understanding that serfs didn't go into battle with the SM, but I could be wrong about that.

It depends on the Chapter. Some Chapter Serfs are just as able to fight in combat as your 'average'(read: not Cadian or Tanith or any constantly fighting regiment) Guardsman.

Grass4hopper wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
Servitors are usually lobotomized and have all kinds of techy bits in place.

Agreed, but in the picture the OP linked it looks like they all have cybernetic augmentation, so I'd say they servitors.

Cybernetic augmentation does not mean servitor, there are literally millions of fully functioning humans that have augments, from guill pen fingers to rebreathers, augments are used to allow a normal human to do a task as best as possible and live longer so the organisation gets as much out of them as possible.

The differance is that cybernetics are given as a reward, while to become a servitor is a punishment as you basically lose all higher brain function.

Kanluwen wrote:It depends on the Chapter. Some Chapter Serfs are just as able to fight in combat as your 'average'(read: not Cadian or Tanith or any constantly fighting regiment) Guardsman.[/quote

I thought they as well trained as marines just they rejected the gene-seed......

Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:It depends on the Chapter. Some Chapter Serfs are just as able to fight in combat as your 'average'(read: not Cadian or Tanith or any constantly fighting regiment) Guardsman.

I thought they as well trained as marines just they rejected the gene-seed......

Not all of them.

Many serfs are normal humans that came to the service of a SM chapter one way or another. They could be the children of a previous chapter serf for instance. Or were simply born on a world ruled by astartes. I guess some SM recruiting worlds send serfs to their chapter, along with potential recruits.

The serfs that are failed initiates will always have a few SM implants along with an excellent training and physical condition. Thus, they are probably given important jobs and tasks, such as the protection of the chapter's fortress monastery, its vessels. Some might even become the commanders of some small warship, like a monitor defense vessel, or an escort.

The failed initiates almost always either die or are so damaged that they'd be useless as serfs.

Kanluwen wrote:

Which chapter is this? I can't pick out an insignias...

Raven Guard. The artwork has been used elsewhere with that specific part being identified.

May be found on pages 7 and 47 of codex space marines , just cut in two.
The shoulderpads and the banner in the background make them identifyable.

Kanluwen wrote:The failed initiates almost always either die or are so damaged that they'd be useless as serfs.

I recall them mentioning that in Rynn's world. One of the initiates survived the failed implant but remained with the Crimson Fists as Kantor's personal aid.

As to what the guys in the pictures are, some could be servitors, some could be serfs. Serfs could be initiates that failed the implants or failed the trials but were so loyal to the marines that they were allowed to remain as hangers on. Still others could be invited to join them for some reason, ala the narator in Prospero Burns.

kronk wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:The failed initiates almost always either die or are so damaged that they'd be useless as serfs.

I recall them mentioning that in Rynn's world. One of the initiates survived the failed implant but remained with the Crimson Fists as Kantor's personal aid.

It's been mentioned before as well. The 'failed implants' early on usually result in a dead Aspirant. Sometimes something goes...wrong, but they survive and can still be salvaged. Sometimes it results in trainers, armorers, things like that.

As to what the guys in the pictures are, some could be servitors, some could be serfs. Serfs could be initiates that failed the implants or failed the trials but were so loyal to the marines that they were allowed to remain as hangers on. Still others could be invited to join them for some reason, ala the narrator in Prospero Burns.

Again: Serfs rarely are failed Initiates. Initiates more often than not die.

Failed Aspirants usually will die during the Trials as well.

The Remembrancers, as far as I know, no longer exist as that specific form.

Aspirants must be first tested BEFORE their implants, to see if they are able to receive them. This is most likely where chapter serfs come from (although it would vairy from chapter to chapter) Each chapter requires thousands of serfs and servitors to support them (at least 20:1 id say) so they must have other ways of recruiting them aswell.

The 'underdogs' clearly are those marines who need to wear helmets in combat.

Uhlan wrote:The 'underdogs' clearly are those marines who need to wear helmets in combat.

No, those would be in fact the smart ones.

They are most likely Serfs or Servitors, or at a push, allied forces, though that latter is unlikely.

Platuan4th wrote:

Uhlan wrote:The 'underdogs' clearly are those marines who need to wear helmets in combat.

No, those would be in fact the smart ones.

The 'law of uber' and the 'rool of cool' say otherwise...

Thank you. Serfs and servitors seem likely. Modeling these guys would be a tricky task. I also spotted a few more in the picture, a total of eigth, lol they are hidden.
What about those flying robotic skulls? Does any one know anything about them? My best guess is that they record events because it looks like they have a camera on the side of them.

Those are Servo-skulls. They are made from the skulls of fallen Imperial servants, and it is considered an honor to be made into one. They serve a small purpose, but an important one. They can be uses to aid Apothecaries, Librarians, and even Inquisitors.

Seems like it would be hard to live with, seeing space marines everyday and how awesome they are, and knowing how close you came to being one. But instead you're just polishing thier armor or mopping the floors.

Yeah but what do they have to go back to?
At least this way they are helping some of the most 'heroic' of the emperor's servants.

Polishing the armor, mopping the floors, and just being in the presence of SM is a very high honor to them.

Ashryu wrote:Seems like it would be hard to live with, seeing space marines everyday and how awesome they are, and knowing how close you came to being one. But instead you're just polishing thier armor or mopping the floors.

Again:

You're not going to "be close to becoming one" if you're going to be recruited as a serf.

You're going to be during the testing phase, maybe having passed the trial but not being able to pass any further.

If you're going to be "close to becoming one" and fail at some point after the modifications--you're going to be dead. Or so horribly maimed that you'll be stripped of the modifications, lobotomized, and fitted with cybernetic implants to become a servitor.

Kanluwen wrote:The failed initiates almost always either die or are so damaged that they'd be useless as serfs.

false,

many chapters give initiates the option to back out of training and become serfs.

and not all tests will result in death if failed.


a initiate that fails the tests, but survives will become a serf. if he dies, his body will become a servitor.

Grey Templar wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:The failed initiates almost always either die or are so damaged that they'd be useless as serfs.

false,

many chapters give initiates the option to back out of training and become serfs.

Those aren't initiates then. They're aspirants. There's no "option to back out of training" when the modifications and implants have begun. Which is one of the first things that happen to the initiates.

and not all tests will result in death if failed.
a initiate that fails the tests, but survives will become a serf. if he dies, his body will become a servitor.

When you're an initiate, they usually are. Of course, part of those "tests" are the genetic modifications and implants--and if those go belly-up, then you will die.

read Sons of Dorn.

it goes into detail about this and supports my claim.