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I'm new to WH40K and I picked IG as my first army. The Army I've massed so far consist of an overwhelming amount of infantry that I use mostly for shooting (as I thought they were intended for). Recently I've been hearing of power blobs, or blobs. from my understanding a blob jut uses your commissar/sergeant cc weapons and uses the infantry as fodder. I can see how a blob would be effective, but it seems like a waste of man power. Anyway, can some one explain the pros and cons of each? Should I focus on one or the other? or find a balance of both? I'm trying to get opinions from those who've played these tactics or know the game better then I do. In the end I play for fun, but I'd like to do some competitive games later on and I'd like to see if i should build my army with more power weapons or more guns.

The idea of power blobs is against many armies, those power weapons can let you win via attrition. Against some armies like hordes of orks or tyranids, you'd still be better off shooting.

The thing is, a blob with a commissar and power weapons can still have guns. There is nothing forcing you to assault the enemy. Most people, I'd say, take special weapons and leave the heavy teams behind - reasoning is that you will usually want to move anyway (into position or towards objectives) You are paying a fair bit to give yourself an assault option, but the squad has the same shooting options as before. I would avoid taking the expensive special+heavy combos though, eg lascannon+plasma gun+power weapon squads are too expensive and you'll never use them all together. I'm going for power weapon and meltaguns.

I would strongly advise taking commissars whether or not you equip them and your sergeants with power weapons. A big issue for shooting armies is when/if their units break after being charged by real assault troops. Commissars give you the option to almost-certainly stick around for a couple rounds of combat, or to probably break and leave your opponent open to shooting (the commissar can't really be hit in melee until the squad is worn down, but you can allocate a wound to him, ideally from a power weapon, to help the squad flee)

From a modelling perspective man, just make sure you build sergeant types with blades, try out some games, and you can paint them as power weapons if you like!

In my army, I'm planning to have some combined squads with power weapons and some without, but all platoons will include a single commissar.

Power Blobs consist of a PW Comissar attached to a multiple squads of guardsmen merged in a single 'blob' of men) with PW sergeants. The guys with power weapons can't be singled out, and will be the last ones in the group to die.

Power Blob
Pros:
-Tarpits enemy squads, bogging them down and preventing them from assaulting vulnerable units
-Stays in combat a long time, because the comissar makes them Ld9 and stubborn
-Cheap(-ish) for what they do; die for the emperor, slowing the xenos by providing corpses for them to stumble over

Cons:
-Slow, vulnerable to shooting, die in droves, needs a Comissar to not run from an enemy so much as yelling 'boo!' at them

Lasgun barrage
Pros:
-By Blobbing up, you get the equivalent of a HWT that uses guardsmen as ablative wounds.
-A single order (FRFSRF, Bring it Down, Fire on my Target) benefits entire squad's shooting

Cons:
-Only shooting one target, static unit prone to getting decimated by template weapons, poor Ld w/o a Comissar, easily bogged down in close combat.

With a powerblob I'd run it with powerweapons and maybe krak grenades. With a shooty blob in an all-comers list I'd probably run it with Autocannons and grenade launchers, offering a fullisade of str 3, str 6, and str 7 fire.

Power Blobs in CC have a few benefits over shooting blobs:

1) Armor Saves: Most shooting attacks will ignore a guardsman's armor save. In CC, you at least get a save.

2)Weight of attacks: In CC, you get two phases (your assault and their assault phase) to do damage.

3)Power Weapons: You get to use armor ignoring weapons against your opponent that are very hard to pick off.

4)Stopping Assault units: A power blob (30+ guardsmen) will stop or slow down most assault units by weight of numbers. Even if they get chewed up, with stubborn and a reroll, it will take some time for something to kill it.

Also, remember that they still have lasguns and can shoot a lot of st3 in a pinch. They are pretty flexible.

Interesting, thank you for the break down. I built my squads without HW that way I could move and shoot, I didn't include commissars because I figured if I got in CC I'd want to flee so my other squads could fire on the assaulting squad. For 35 points it might be worth it to inflict some wounds before my men flee though. at the moment I'm planning on 2 platoons filled with 8-10 infantry squads (total) and some vet squads to perform specific tasks. I had all of my infantry squads outfitted with melta guns to allow them a chance to take out tanks/transports. I also have HWS in the rear to take out armor, I usual keep my PCS/CCS w/ flamers + plasma guns back to protect them from deep strike or flanking.

How do you feel about combined squads? When I first started playing I didn't use them, but as my army grows I'm starting to consider it more.

[edit]

Thank you AdeptSister and Jerjare! Defiantly see why power blobs are recommended, a unit tied up is a unit not killing your guys, also the power weapons being swung by a weak (by SM standards) guardsman at no armor saves is a slap to the face! I will defiantly be including commissars in my army now.

I do a mix of the 2 approaches, a little pricier than either individually, but it works for me.

I use 2 Blobs with Commissars, PWs on both Sgts and the Commissar in each blob, 2 Lascannons in 1 Blob, and 2 Autocannons in the other, 2 Plasma guns in the lascannon blob, 2 Grenade Launchers in the AC one. I fire until the enemy finally gets close enough to be able to assault me next turn, I then Charge the enemy. I might be expanding my list to include 2 more Squads and another PCS; that way i can use 2 30-man Blobs. My PCSs are some of my Forward elements for Objective grabbing, alone with 3 Units of Veterans.

Defiantly seems to be on the pricier side, Kommisar. More compact squads it looks like, I'd rather break my units up then try to make one fix it all unit.

The list I've built has two 30 man power blobs, all sgts have PW, Commisars have PW, no HW, all squads have melta guns. Then I have two 20 man squads with just melta guns they're more or less mobile units used for versatility. I might drop the meltas in favor of plasma or flamers. I also have 3 vet. squads to perform specific missions outfitted with various weapons.

AdeptSister wrote:Also, remember that they still have lasguns and can shoot a lot of st3 in a pinch. They are pretty flexible.

This is a big point for me. Against certain enemies (horde Orks, horde Tyranids, certain Chaos Daemons etc.) I FRFSRF them down to manageable numbers before assaulting. The flexibility of the blob squad is something I've been wishing for in the Guard since I started playing 40k in early 3rd edition.

On a side note, I occasionally run a build with 30-man powerblobs, GL/Flamer, commissar, 4 power weapons and a preacher and combined with Creed using "For the honor of cadia". It's not competitive, but hilarious to watch an unwary opponent being caught up in a charge by 30 stubborn guardsmen, clawing and biting at their armor, all with furious charge and rerolls on all misses in close combat.

Powerblobs work though. I cant tell you how many times I've ran 50 man conscript squads with a commissar and they gunned down daemon princes and such. Just think about it. At rapid fire thats 100 shots. Statistically speaking you should get about 15-20 wounds.

Has anyone put a priest in their blob? I just made one and was wondering what success people had with him. Tracer have you ever tried the priest in a more competetive list?

Also I was going to run 2 power blobs with Al'reham so I was wondering if anyone tried the "Like the Wind!" order with blobs.
Outflank, move 6", shoot assualt weapons, move D6 with "Like the Wind!" and assualt 6". Does that sound like it's worth buying Al'reham? For his points I can get another PW squad.

Oh and making power weapons is pretty easy, After making so many troops I tend to have lots of extra chainswords so I just green stuff a blade on that and there you go. Unless you want robot arms...

There is no difference between a power blob and a lasgun barrage. The same unit is both.

There could be a difference. My power blobs are always moving. While a dedicated volley blob would tend to stand still and have HWTs in the blob and get orders for FrFsrF! or BiD!

I have both, my volley blob stays back on my deployment/objective next to a CCS (if i'm not running 2 primaris psykers as I tend to do now) and heavy weapon teams while my power blob outflanks and bum rushes.

portugus wrote:Has anyone put a priest in their blob? I just made one and was wondering what success people had with him. Tracer have you ever tried the priest in a more competetive list?

Also I was going to run 2 power blobs with Al'reham so I was wondering if anyone tried the "Like the Wind!" order with blobs.
Outflank, move 6", shoot assualt weapons, move D6 with "Like the Wind!" and assualt 6". Does that sound like it's worth buying Al'reham? For his points I can get another PW squad.

Oh and making power weapons is pretty easy, After making so many troops I tend to have lots of extra chainswords so I just green stuff a blade on that and there you go. Unless you want robot arms...

I haven't used priests in competitive environments, and personally I doubt they are worth it. The whole Close Combat power blob thing is not something for an "all-comers" list, you are better of putting points for the priests into artillery or more squads. Especially since the priest is only useful on a charge.

But play around with the priests, I hope you can prove me wrong

I spent a good long while making my priest so i'll try him out at least once.

another thing Power Blobs have going for them is that they will almost never break.

the Commissars give them Ld9 stubborn that they can reroll by killing a sergeant. they arn't going anywhere if they lose.

and even then, there are very few units which can take out a blob squad in more then a couple of CC phases.


I think the one unit which could expect to remove a Blob squad from the table would be a unit of Purifiers. Cleansing flame can deal massive damage and it can snipe the power weapons and commissars.

Grey Templar wrote:another thing Power Blobs have going for them is that they will almost never break.

the Commissars give them Ld9 stubborn that they can reroll by killing a sergeant. they arn't going anywhere if they lose.

and even then, there are very few units which can take out a blob squad in more then a couple of CC phases.


I think the one unit which could expect to remove a Blob squad from the table would be a unit of Purifiers. Cleansing flame can deal massive damage and it can snipe the power weapons and commissars.

Or anything with a blast marker and decent range. A pair of LRBT will do the job from the other side of the table...

tracer wrote:

Or anything with a blast marker and decent range. A pair of LRBT will do the job from the other side of the table...

"Blob" doesn't mean you have to deploy them in the shape of a Large Blast Marker. At 2" coherency, the most you're going to hit against a competent opponent is 5 or 6. Say you wound them all, they are probably getting cover, so one shot kills 2 or 3 Guardsmen maximum. Meh...

Orks use a very similar tactic with 30 man boys units that carry a nob with power klaw and bosspole. Probably the best counter attack to an IG blob except guard go first!

the blob is what guard CC should look like methinks. seeing as how a regular 10 man squad is a joke, a blob has real pain potential.

I feel like I've discovered a whole new side to my guardsmen! I've got a few more questions concerning power blobs though.

I plan on running a foot slogger army, originally I was just going to mass infantry squads consisting of 8x lasguns, 1x sgt, and 1x melta/plasma (yes, very noob of me). After being on the forums I've already managed to learn a few new things. My new load-out consist of 10 squads broken down into 20-30 man blobs. The two 30-man squads would have a commissar w/ PW and three sergeants with PW/BP, the special weapon choices would either be melta or flamers. I'm learning more towards meltas because it allows my blob some anti-tank abilities, but flamers would be nice for that last ditch desperate charge when my unit goes into melee.

Is it worth it to take more then one commissar per blob? Should all blobs have a commissar, even if they're not going to be the 'melee blob?'

I appreciate all the discussion and I can't wait to field test everything I've learned

ZombyJezuz wrote:I feel like I've discovered a whole new side to my guardsmen! I've got a few more questions concerning power blobs though.

I plan on running a foot slogger army, originally I was just going to mass infantry squads consisting of 8x lasguns, 1x sgt, and 1x melta/plasma (yes, very noob of me). After being on the forums I've already managed to learn a few new things. My new load-out consist of 10 squads broken down into 20-30 man blobs. The two 30-man squads would have a commissar w/ PW and three sergeants with PW/BP, the special weapon choices would either be melta or flamers. I'm learning more towards meltas because it allows my blob some anti-tank abilities, but flamers would be nice for that last ditch desperate charge when my unit goes into melee.

Is it worth it to take more then one commissar per blob? Should all blobs have a commissar, even if they're not going to be the 'melee blob?'

I appreciate all the discussion and I can't wait to field test everything I've learned

The problem with flamers is that they can sometimes end up killing enough of the enemy to get you out of charge range by killing off the models at the front of the squad. If you don't plan on charging and plan on using your lasguns more that's probably perfectly fine, of course.

I'd say that any blob should have a commissar. If a Guard blob gets charged it will lose combat 99% of the time and without a commissar it will run off. Even if they're not geared for close combat they'll still hold up whatever charged them for several turns. Note that you can chose to lose the blob by allocating wounds to the commissar, killing him and letting them get run down. Yet another way in which the power blob is flexible.

lazgun magic ftw

no mathhammer reason , i just like them

I run power blobs. 31 man blob, power weapons, two melta bombs, and three meltaguns. Lets me blow up tanks before assaulting the insides, or more reliably deal wounds to MCs and such.

If you're looking for a CC Guard army, don't forget about Ogryn. Hilarious and can really help a blob assault. They're basically concentrated guardsmen.

I run two thirty man blobs both with commissars and priests . One has three plasma guns Commissar has plasma pistol and power weapon Priest standard issue the other has three flamers Commissar power weapon Priest with shotgun sometimes i like to throw a Primaris Psyker in with them fun fun haha even if the Commissar blows him away. Backed by 2 Griffons and some lucky orders they have been very destructive. Even with out every sgt having power weapons they can win the day in assault vs a riddled down Space Marine squad.

Blobs rule

I don't see him post much on here anymore, but from my memory, Ailaros was one of the archtypical powerblob guys. He's got a pretty awesome set of battle reports at http://ailarian.com/folera/index.html. I recommend taking a look. As far as your situation, you should know that a unit that can lasgun barrage is basically the same thing as a powerblob. It's just a matter of choosing to shoot rather than charge forward. I think what you might actually be asking is whether you should build a gunline or build a power blob list. To be honest, I've seen both work to amazing effect. It mostly depends on what you want to play, however, one thing to keep in mind is that if you emphasize gunline, you'll still need something to protect your squishier units, and if you emphasize the powerblobs, you'll still want something to hurt tanks and things faster than you. I run a hybrid list with two power blobs that has melta vets and deep striking storm troopers worked into it. I run down anything I can, and I have the vets and storm troopers head off anything I can't.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And remember, IG is all about battle attrition. A power blob isn't a group of beautiful unique snowflakes, it's a S3 T3 W31 monstrous creature with 9 attacks. Remember that, and you'll do fine.

Having a large group of guardsmen with lots of heavy weapons means you can distribute wounds NOT on your vulnerable heavy weapons teams. So it's actually a nice way to hide lascannon spam behind ablative wounds.

A power blob isn't a group of beautiful unique snowflakes, it's a S3 T3 W31 monstrous creature with 9 attacks. Remember that, and you'll do fine.

-quoted for truth and lolz-

this is true. so.. so... true.

Mine is:

S4, T3, I4 W41 Assault4 A20 on the charge =p

Defiantly gonna run a hybrid list, at the moment I only have the parts to build roughly 90-100 guardsmen out of the 160 I'll need, but I'm gonna try out some PW and melta bombs tonight, see how they work out, wish me luck!

Again, thanks for all the great info and help!