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I recently bought Warhammer 40k kill team and plan on getting space marine when it comes out. As a player of the tabletop I like that they are trying to stick with the fluff as much as they can and make good games. Ive played all the dawn of war games also. So in short my questions are what do you think of the quality of the games being put out and if you have played them what do you think of them?

So far I'm pretty happy with them. Let's me play around in the 40K universe when I can't get in a 40K tabletop game.

I very much liked all the dawn of wars, got space marine pre ordered but alas... only have gotten to play the kill team demo :(

Played Firewarrior, it's alright if taken with a grain of salt, there was some potential for epicness, but as a first toe dip into the water it's good. Sadly with exception to the Squad Command for the DS it's the weakest 40K game. and DoW and it's packs are the best.

I have just about all of the DOW games and I can't wait for the 40k Space Marine game to come out.

I really like DoW. However, I've looked into Space Marine and it looks like it's going to be a bit of a disappointment. From what I've seen, it looks like a few 40k Ultrasmurf fanboys who decided to make one heck of a gory game. I mean, it's literally just "hack the orks!" and "punching does more damage than a chainsword swing!". I think it's going to be a load of overheated puffery about Ultramarines, but the graphics look pretty good, so that's at least one thing to look forward to.

I dislike how Space Marine has already revealed some inaccuracies: Such as the lascannon being an automatic weapon fired from the hip without a Devastator backpack.


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IIRC they described it as an 'upgunned lasgun'.

Looking forward to Space Marine. Looks pretty faithful to the universe. The Lasgun could be better, I think they got the size fine, but the mechanisms wrong, such as four shots per power pack and a lack of massive back pack and wires. I think they want'ed to push it in the sniper rifle direction for multiplayer, which should make sense with the low clip size, long range, high power, high accuracy, low rate of fire that most snipers have in games.

Henners91 wrote:I dislike how Space Marine has already revealed some inaccuracies: Such as the lascannon being an automatic weapon fired from the hip without a Devastator backpack.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
IIRC they described it as an 'upgunned lasgun'.

Maybe there are just referencing the original incarnations when you could indeed fire the lascannon from the hip (model produced doing exactly that) and Imperial Guard (or Army back then) could use them on their own over the shoulder

Fire warrior I enjoyed alot as I did Dawn of War - both I feel captured the essence of 40K

Henners91 wrote:I dislike how Space Marine has already revealed some inaccuracies: Such as the lascannon being an automatic weapon fired from the hip without a Devastator backpack.

Sounds like a Multi-Laser, which is actually a neat idea. I know it's not strictly canon, though.

The 40k video games have been a mixed bag, but overall I've liked them. Space Hulk was pretty good for its time, Chaos Gate too. Fire Warrior was ridiculously bad, but Dawn of War made up for it completely. I didn't get Kill Team, but I will be picking up Space Marine.

Henners91 wrote:I dislike how Space Marine has already revealed some inaccuracies: Such as the lascannon being an automatic weapon fired from the hip without a Devastator backpack.


IIRC they described it as an 'upgunned lasgun'.

The "Lascannon being fired from the hip" is in fact not the 'standard' Lascannon. It is a man-portable(as in a single, unaugmented human can carry it) variant that is in Dark Heresy that operates off a cell that is inserted into the Lascannon proper.

Multiplayer has shown that the Devastator's Lascannon will be the one we're used to for Astartes. The Lascannon is, seemingly, going to be less of a 'sniper rifle' and more like Halo's "Spartan Laser".

The 'sniper rifle' is available to the Tactical Marine, in the form of the Stalker Bolter.

I've enjoyed them thus far, looking forward to space marines, though as an ork player I can't help but want to play as the orks and squish some smurfs

G00fySmiley wrote:I've enjoyed them thus far, looking forward to space marines, though as an ork player I can't help but want to play as the orks and squish some smurfs

In muliplayer you can play as CSM and squish some smurfs. Is that good enough?

TrollPie wrote:

G00fySmiley wrote:I've enjoyed them thus far, looking forward to space marines, though as an ork player I can't help but want to play as the orks and squish some smurfs

In muliplayer you can play as CSM and squish some smurfs. Is that good enough?

hadn't looked into the multiplayer part yet, all I've seen is the trailer on steam and screen shots not much mroe research, once it is out I plan on buying it. and yea squishing smurfs is good no matter who is doing it... I just like choppin things in ways only an ork could acomplish

I like DOW1, I really do love it, but it's devolved clanning backwards online community keeps putting space between me and the game. They're like the WAAC dudes of vidya games who won't shut up if you're doing one thing wrong that could cost them winning.

In short, love the game, hate the people playing it.

theman99808 wrote:I recently bought Warhammer 40k kill team and plan on getting space marine when it comes out. As a player of the tabletop I like that they are trying to stick with the fluff as much as they can and make good games. Ive played all the dawn of war games also. So in short my questions are what do you think of the quality of the games being put out and if you have played them what do you think of them?

I think I've played most of them going back to Chaos Gate, and I've enjoyed them all. I downloaded Kill Team over XBL last weekend and I'm really enjoying that one as well.

DoW 1 is a great game. I've spent many hours playing it. I like the Dark Crusade campaign a lot.

DoW 2 is fun, but more of a skirmish game. I prefer the WarCraft feel of DoW1.

I haven't played the other games.

All in all, they're cool. So far I've played Chaos Gate, Final Liberation, Dawn of War 1 and Squad Command. And I've enjoyed them all!

My single one gripe with them is that - with the exceptions of Fire Warrior and Final Liberation - they all focus extensively on Spess Mehreens, which is a trend that seems to have been getting stronger again. It'd be cool to have a bit more variety here, reflecting the wider universe. I really liked how DoW1, if you include all expansions, shows close to every army there is, thus offering something for everybody than the usual catering.

In general, the games are of a high quality and enjoyable gameplay. If you don't like one it's probably a genre thing or because a game - just like many novels out there - may fail to portray something accurately that one may see as a critical detail (such as the lascannon discussion above).

Lynata wrote:All in all, they're cool. So far I've played Chaos Gate, Final Liberation, Dawn of War 1 and Squad Command. And I've enjoyed them all!

My single one gripe with them is that - with the exceptions of Fire Warrior and Final Liberation - they all focus extensively on Spess Mehreens, which is a trend that seems to have been getting stronger again. It'd be cool to have a bit more variety here, reflecting the wider universe. I really liked how DoW1, if you include all expansions, shows close to every army there is, thus offering something for everybody than the usual catering.

There's a reason for that, which is a sad but true reason. Nobody outside of the 40k fanbase wants to play as a Tyranid, Necron, or Ork. There's no 'humanizing' element about those three, nor about Daemons for that matter.

Space Marines, however, are something that people can get behind. They're supersoldiers, and they work quite well as 'propaganda' introducing new people to the property.

In general, the games are of a high quality and enjoyable gameplay. If you don't like one it's probably a genre thing or because a game - just like many novels out there - may fail to portray something accurately that one may see as a critical detail (such as the lascannon discussion above).

The Lascannon discussion is irrelevant, because as mentioned it isn't some kind of failure of canon. It's a different weapon that exists in the canon before Space Marine was in production.

The problem is that it's only during the course of the campaign that we see the non-backpack Lascannon, which leads me to guess that it is something we'll be picking up from a Guard armory at some point. The multiplayer variant shown has the backpack present.

If Space Marine is a success, and hopefully its subsequent Space Marine sequel is one as well, then hopefully they'll start to branch out.
If you think about it, there a considerable number of Warhammer titles being worked on, or that have already been released with success. DoW1, all it's expansion, DoW2 and it's, Space Marine is shaping up, and then Dark Millenium as well. GW is set to make a big dolip of cash from this, which makes the price hikes on models even less justified.

I think the reaction to how the parties involved in Space Marine is going to affect what game we see next.

But on another note, how do you make a game about an Imperial Guardsman different from a generic military shooter?
There's not many ways even with the background that you can do it well without making the wider appeal go down.

Although, since people like hardcore heroes...Kasrkin are there, THQ.

I hate to be an echo, but I love the DoW series. Especially in some situations, while playing guard, when you end up in these "meat grinders" situation, it feels like I'm really seeing the 40k universe in action.

I've got no problem with Space Marines being about Space Marines (see what I did there) and look forward to anything related; Something tells me the game's success will bring out other games centered around the other factions, like they did with the DoW series.

I doesn't necessarily have to be a shooter. I multi-race RPG would work. Inquisitors, Eldar Seers and Harleguins, Ork freebootas. I also don't think that the game has to differ than much from a generic military shooter in terms of gameplay. I would put forward that idea that it would be different by making you a lowly guardsmen amongst heaps of other guardsmen fighting far superior enemies, creating a unique atmosphere where you are the true underdog.

Kanluwen wrote:There's a reason for that, which is a sad but true reason. Nobody outside of the 40k fanbase wants to play as a Tyranid, Necron, or Ork. There's no 'humanizing' element about those three, nor about Daemons for that matter. Space Marines, however, are something that people can get behind.

I know - and even within 40k, Space Marines seem to sell the best (else they could just as well churn out badass Guard games). It makes sense from an economical PoV, but I still dislike the trend for being sooooo horribly blaaaaand. One should assume that the market gets oversatuated by one and the same thing being repeated over and over, but it does not seem to be the case.

Kanluwen wrote:The Lascannon discussion is irrelevant, because as mentioned it isn't some kind of failure of canon. It's a different weapon that exists in the canon before Space Marine was in production.

Ehh, the RPG, just like any other licensed non-studio product, doesn't produce canon. Neither does this computer game.

Which lascannon are you referring to, anyways? The one from the Dark Heresy Core Rulebook - pictured here - does state it needs a separate power pack. Note the connectors on the underside. It's the exact same one that is used by the IG Heavy Weapon teams, hence the RPG saying it's usually crewed by two or more people. You are likely confusing it with the RPG's Hellguns that can have a backpack as well as internal power cells.

The computer game's lascannon has connectors too - of the sort that would normally lead to a power pack. Only the Marine doesn't have one!

Wouldn't make the game any less fun for me - but please, there's really no need to defend such an obvious mistake.

Lynata wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:There's a reason for that, which is a sad but true reason. Nobody outside of the 40k fanbase wants to play as a Tyranid, Necron, or Ork. There's no 'humanizing' element about those three, nor about Daemons for that matter. Space Marines, however, are something that people can get behind.

I know - and even within 40k, Space Marines seem to sell the best (else they could just as well churn out badass Guard games). It makes sense from an economical PoV, but I still dislike the trend for being sooooo horribly blaaaaand. One should assume that the market gets oversatuated by one and the same thing being repeated over and over, but it does not seem to be the case.

Yeah, because Marines are soooooooooo bland...

Wait a minute. They're only bland if you go in thinking they're bland. I think the Sisters are 'bland', but that doesn't mean they actually are.

Kanluwen wrote:The Lascannon discussion is irrelevant, because as mentioned it isn't some kind of failure of canon. It's a different weapon that exists in the canon before Space Marine was in production.

Ehh, the RPG, just like any other licensed non-studio product, doesn't produce canon. Neither does this computer game.

We've gone over this time and time again. The studio has involvement in the RPG. Thus, canon.

Which lascannon are you referring to, anyways? The one from the Dark Heresy Core Rulebook - pictured here - does state it needs a separate power pack. Note the connectors on the underside. It's the exact same one that is used by the IG Heavy Weapon teams, hence the RPG saying it's usually crewed by two or more people. You are likely confusing it with the RPG's Hellguns that can have a backpack as well as internal power cells.

No, not really. Lascannons, like any other weapon, can be made man-portable. It takes some tech, but it's doable. The Lascannon in question was pointed out by Melissia, in that it accepts power cells same way that a Plasma Gun does.

The computer game's lascannon has connectors too - of the sort that would normally lead to a power pack. Only the Marine doesn't have one!

Wouldn't make the game any less fun for me - but please, there's really no need to defend such an obvious mistake.

And there's no reason to continually call it a 'mistake' when it has been brought up and been discussed before. THQ showed the design awhile ago, and it doesn't have "connectors". Those are the power cells, inserted into the same slot that the power cabling usually would be. There was a clip of the Marine reloading it, and you see him actually put the clips in there.


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Oh hey there Man-Portable Lascannon.

Kanluwen wrote:Yeah, because Marines are soooooooooo bland...
Wait a minute. They're only bland if you go in thinking they're bland. I think the Sisters are 'bland', but that doesn't mean they actually are.

Personal perception or preferences are a factor, but not as big as you make it look like. It's a fact that Space Marines make up more than half of the extended material (meaning novels, games, and now even movies) produced for this franchise - if every 2nd meal you had would be cake, you'd probably like cake less after some time.

Hence me talking of oversatuation and variety. Did I mention my very first miniatures and Codex were Ultramarines?

Kanluwen wrote:We've gone over this time and time again. The studio has involvement in the RPG. Thus, canon.

Apparently we've not gone over it enough yet. The "studio" has no more involvement in the RPG than it has in Black Library, and we both know what kind of stuff can come from there. We also know that the RPG is deviating from established GW material, and I dispute the claim that it can simply override Codex material just like that.

Kanluwen wrote:No, not really. Lascannons, like any other weapon, can be made man-portable. It takes some tech, but it's doable. The Lascannon in question was pointed out by Melissia, in that it accepts power cells same way that a Plasma Gun does.

So where is it from, then? It's obviously not the one from the RPG (see description in the scan), and I don't recall ever having heard of such a weapon elsewhere. Frankly, this just looks like another invention showing up in a single instance in one of the many licensed non-studio products that, according to both GW as well as the authors writing said non-studio products, nobody else is in any way obliged to take seriously.

Thanks for the info about the clip with the Marine reloading it, though. Doesn't make the weapon per se less weird, but it'll at least look better.

Kanluwen wrote:
Oh hey there Man-Portable Lascannon.

I hope you realize that this is just another image for the same MP Lascannon I posted above?
Different edition of the Core Rulebook.

Lynata wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Yeah, because Marines are soooooooooo bland...
Wait a minute. They're only bland if you go in thinking they're bland. I think the Sisters are 'bland', but that doesn't mean they actually are.

Personal perception or preferences are a factor, but not as big as you make it look like. It's a fact that Space Marines make up more than half of the extended material (meaning novels, games, and now even movies) produced for this franchise - if every 2nd meal you had would be cake, you'd probably like cake less after some time.

Hence me talking of oversatuation and variety. Did I mention my very first miniatures and Codex were Ultramarines?

Kanluwen wrote:We've gone over this time and time again. The studio has involvement in the RPG. Thus, canon.

Apparently we've not gone over it enough yet. The "studio" has no more involvement in the RPG than it has in Black Library, and we both know what kind of stuff can come from there. We also know that the RPG is deviating from established GW material, and I dispute the claim that it can simply override Codex material just like that.

Dark Heresy, before FFG picked it up, was developed by members of the GW studio and published by Black Industry.

/thread.

Kanluwen wrote:No, not really. Lascannons, like any other weapon, can be made man-portable. It takes some tech, but it's doable. The Lascannon in question was pointed out by Melissia, in that it accepts power cells same way that a Plasma Gun does.

So where is it from, then? It's obviously not the one from the RPG (see description in the scan), and I don't recall ever having heard of such a weapon elsewhere. Frankly, this just looks like another invention showing up in a single instance in one of the many licensed non-studio products that, according to both GW as well as the authors writing said non-studio products, nobody else is in any way obliged to take seriously.

Thanks for the info about the clip with the Marine reloading it, though. Doesn't make the weapon per se less weird, but it'll at least look better.

Kanluwen wrote:
Oh hey there Man-Portable Lascannon.

I hope you realize that this is just another image for the same MP Lascannon I posted above?
Different edition of the Core Rulebook.

Psst.

I think you just proved my point. Manportable Lascannon, just without the mounting for a tripod...which makes more sense for a "Manportable" Lascannon.

Kanluwen wrote:Dark Heresy, before FFG picked it up, was developed by members of the GW studio and published by Black Industry.

So the difference between the RPG and Black Library is ... what exactly?

Individual members (actually, they're EX-members, aren't they?) are not the studio. Gav Thorpe also writes his own BL books nowadays and he himself has said that GW doesn't care about what some novel says.

Kanluwen wrote:I think you just proved my point. Manportable Lascannon, just without the mounting for a tripod...which makes more sense for a "Manportable" Lascannon.

I believe you don't realize that it's still the very same description - including the part about separate power packs and about usually being operated by two people or more.

See, I can do bold text, too.

And I think you're overestimating what the term "portable" means.

Lynata wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Dark Heresy, before FFG picked it up, was developed by members of the GW studio and published by Black Industry.

So the difference between the RPG and Black Library is ... what exactly?

Individual members (actually, they're EX-members, aren't they?) are not the studio.

When they're actively employed by the studio as developers at the time of publication, they are the studio.

Gav Thorpe also writes his own BL books nowadays and he himself has said that GW doesn't care about what some novel says.

This is such a mindbogglingly ignorant statement I don't know where to begin, so I'm not going to dignify it with any reply other than wasting your time by making you read this lengthy statement to the end of this sentence.

Kanluwen wrote:I think you just proved my point. Manportable Lascannon, just without the mounting for a tripod...which makes more sense for a "Manportable" Lascannon.

I believe you don't realize that it's still the very same description - including the part about separate power packs and about usually being operated by two people or more.

See, I can do bold text, too.

And I think you're overestimating what the term "portable" means.

So we're in agreement then. You're wrong, because yours is the copy/paste description of a standard Lascannon from the Imperial Infantryman's Uplifting Primer/Munitorum Manuals, complete with the same image.

Kanluwen wrote:When they're actively employed by the studio as developers at the time of publication, they are the studio.

Black Industries isn't Games Workshop, just like Black Library isn't.

Kanluwen wrote:So we're in agreement then. You're wrong, because yours is the copy/paste description of a standard Lascannon from the Imperial Infantryman's Uplifting Primer/Munitorum Manuals, complete with the same image.

Huh? Mine is a weapon of the exact same name with the exact same description like the one you posted, the only difference is that one edition of the RPG uses a different picture.

We were talking about how it's totally "canon" that the Space Marine computer game lascannon doesn't need an external power pack. Both descriptions of the RPG - which is supposedly your source for the claim that it's fine - says the MP Lascannon does need one. So why are you still argueing? What is your current source when I have just terminated it by posting the actual description from the RPG?