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I recently got a bunch of Leman Russ tanks in trade adn some of em were in pretty rough shape. I decided to take one and turn it into an Apocalypse vehicle. Here is what it is equiped with -

Punisher Gattling Cannon Turret
Vulkan Mega Bolter in the Hull
2 Assault cannon sponsons

I need some help with the cost on this and I also want it to have a special rule where if it is stationary it fires everything forward the width of the tank 24" and any model in this area takes a S6 AP4 Hit with no cover saves - this represents the stupid amount of lead it can put out. I need a good way to word that and to figure out how many points it should cost. - Maybe reduce the S and increase the AP by one for every gun lost?


*edit* Changed the bold from armor save to cover save

So...

its AP4 but ignores armour and it increases the AP by one if it loses a gun...

So it could end up with a s3 ap- hit that ignores armour saves...?

That part of the rule makes NO sense. Good Idea and i like the thought behind it, but maybe make it so its just S6 ap3 and THEN the for every gun lost bit.

So i'm thinking about.... 500?
I dunno what the armour is yet but...

I'm not so sure about the "ignore armor saves part." Maybe it could fire everything twice? I know some super heavies have that. I would also think that that would be a good place to start points wise would be and then add more for what you add, remembet it is always better for it to cost more than less.

You could go along with something like the BA Baal Predator Datasheet whereby you place two markers 24" apart within range of the Vulcan, and anything in the line between them takes 2D6 S6 Ap3 Rending hits (same stats as the Vulcan, but 2D6 hits instead of the standard 15).

Oops. Meant no cover saves instead of no armor saves. I fixed it in the original post.

big_d wrote:Oops. Meant no cover saves instead of no armor saves. I fixed it in the original post.

Ok that makes alot more sense.

I am not sure if you can fit a Vulkan Mega Bolter on a LRMBT even by itself. The smallest tank its fitted too is the MACHARIUS, and that at least twice the size of a LRMBT. If your going to increase the size of the model, then never mind

Ok
lets just say that with your mega shoehorn of doom you DO actualy manage to fit a weapon system the size of your tank into its hull AND have another large system in the turret.
were does the ammunition go?
and for that matter the crew?
the reason its usually fitted into superheavy veihcles is because its ROF is so high it burns through ammo like nids through a fast food joint.
even these massive behmoths have to recycle the spent cases-its the only way to keep firing with it.
although the idea sounds nice its entirely immpossible.

Keep in mind that the punisher is already a LR option so adding something that requires more ammo (mega bolters) that I've seen only on super heavies seems like a stretch. Maybe with the punisher with a single assault cannon, but all four I would have to say it needs to be at least a Baneblade chasis.

Maybe taking out the entire front area,reduce it to a AV 12(to represent the delicate gun),and have the turret and sponsons as normal.Makke it so that the vulcan can be the Weapon for Lumbering Behemoth,but then the Turret can't fire or vice versa.If it remains stationary it can fire the Vulcan twice,but can't fire the other guns.

Seriosly-NO VULCAN
THE WEAPON SYSTEM IS THE SIZE OF THE LEMAN RUSSES CHASSIS
maybe twin assault cannon and a punisher but NOT a vulcan

Not even just taking a Vulcan,putting a set of tracks onto the side,and slapping a turret and sponsons on,like I suggested?

Or, if you put the guns themselves on the tank chassis, give it a trailer. Basically, another chassis, just for the ammunition, and make it so attacks can either target the LRBT chassis, or the Ammo trailer, making it effectively another SP- however, if it's destroyed, whether Wrecked or Exploded, it always explodes 2d6 inches (tons of ammo) and you lose the ability to do the special attack thing and/or the use of one of the big weapons.

That's a good idea- like a desperate imperial general who lost his Stormlord and salvaged the Vulcan by sticking it on a LR.

NO NO NO!!!
the weapon system is TOO BIG.

youd have to tow it and use it as a static gun position with an ammo trailer the size of a LANDRAIDER for just 1 turn of firing

its not feesible.

No, it's not "feesible". It is, however, possible.

master of ordinance wrote:NO NO NO!!!
the weapon system is TOO BIG.

youd have to tow it and use it as a static gun position with an ammo trailer the size of a LANDRAIDER for just 1 turn of firing

its not feesible.

Dude, were talking about a universe where i can fit 10 Space marines into a Rhino and i can fit 10 dark eldar warriors onto a radier...

Things aren't often "Feesible" and yet, we don't give a damn cus at the end of the day, this fellow wants to play a friendly apocalypse game where he has found a smaller version of a Vulcan Mega Bolter thing on a distant planet and his legion of guard have taken it and stuck it onto a tank of their own design.

So to conclude. Deal with it.

Bloodhorror wrote:

master of ordinance wrote:NO NO NO!!!
the weapon system is TOO BIG.

youd have to tow it and use it as a static gun position with an ammo trailer the size of a LANDRAIDER for just 1 turn of firing

its not feesible.

Dude, were talking about a universe where i can fit 10 Space marines into a Rhino and i can fit 10 dark eldar warriors onto a radier...

Things aren't often "Feesible" and yet, we don't give a damn cus at the end of the day, this fellow wants to play a friendly apocalypse game where he has found a smaller version of a Vulcan Mega Bolter thing on a distant planet and his legion of guard have taken it and stuck it onto a tank of their own design.

So to conclude. Deal with it.

There's already a smaller Vulcan Mega-Bolter. It's called an assault cannon.

Well a more compact Vulcan that packs the same punch and fire the same shots.

I dunno

Bloodhorror wrote:

master of ordinance wrote:NO NO NO!!!
the weapon system is TOO BIG.

youd have to tow it and use it as a static gun position with an ammo trailer the size of a LANDRAIDER for just 1 turn of firing

its not feesible.

Dude, were talking about a universe where i can fit 10 Space marines into a Rhino and i can fit 10 dark eldar warriors onto a radier...

Things aren't often "Feesible" and yet, we don't give a damn cus at the end of the day, this fellow wants to play a friendly apocalypse game where he has found a smaller version of a Vulcan Mega Bolter thing on a distant planet and his legion of guard have taken it and stuck it onto a tank of their own design.

So to conclude. Deal with it.

Sigh
10 marines CAN feasibly fit in a rhino. its just a little cramped.

and besides 10 marines arnt the size of a rhino whilst a vulcan bolter is actualy the same size as a leman russ chassis.

so yeah nice idea but no.

on the other hand a towed vulcan would be awsome.... course it would need a ST load of Ammo-atleast 4 land raiders worth...

if you seriously want a gatlng tank then take a punisher in the turret another in the hull and assault cannon sponsons.

Energy Weapon? like a laser version of the Vulcan. So it wouldn't need a a truck full of ammo, just power cells.

If you put the vulcan weapion itself on tracks, slap a punisher and sponsons on, simple.

Trolled

There. ive just trolled this thread.

now. were do you propose all the ammo goes. im still waiting for an explanation.

An explanation?

All you did was use a bunch of bold text, capital letters and create a temporary meme, "feesible", which was propogated by the other users of this thread in order to point out that you are being unimaginative for a teenage vampkid.

Who demands an hastened explanation in the same post he asked the question in? Someone employing a rhetorical device - that's who.

Work on your spelling and punctuation and maybe that knowledge of what-guns-fit-where will be put to good use by an educated person rather than scribbled on the back of an unemployment application.

Where does the ammo go? At the baddies!

The proposed rule screams 'kustom mekjob' - Orky rules tend to uphold that 'impossible is possible'.

master of ordinance wrote:Trolled

There. ive just trolled this thread.

now. were do you propose all the ammo goes. im still waiting for an explanation.

I'm sorry but i'm done with this thread now...

You simply anger me ¬¬

Arctik_Firangi wrote:Orky rules tend to uphold that 'impossible is possible'.

Eureka. Orks amke the impossible, possible.


If we make it an Ork vehicle, mader from a scanvenged LR, then the Guard can take it as an Apoc ally, because that is how Apoc works. that is of coarse, assuming this is for Apoc. In standard, this vehicle would annihilater anything except a pure Mech army. Swarms and footsloggers would be ended by this one tank.

Swarms and footsloggers are so much dead mush in Apoc games anyway - it's not unbalanced at all.

If it is an Apoc tank only, then no. But in standard games, this will anhilate most armies that can't field an unreal number of vehicles. So anything that is not guard, SM or Tau. Even DE vehciles are useless vs this thing.

This thing puts out

15 Str 6, AP3 shots
20, Str 5, AP-, rending shots
12, Str 6, AP 4, rending shots.


Just wait for those nids/orks to attempt to get past. DE will need to really on Flat out. Eldar have a small chance, but they have so little compared to a guard army it doesn't matter. Necrons are pretty much dead anyway.


In a decent sized game, Vanilla SM can take 4 LRs. 3 for HS, 1 for a Termy squad, 1 for Assault Termies. If I am not mistaken, SW can take 4, 1 for Wolf Guard. GK can take 3, and BA can take am lot, because they are transports.

Guard can put out LOTS of vehicles, including a lot of Russes.

Tau have the firepower to take this down, and mobility to fight back.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Just to make the WAAC players happier, imagine Pask inside.

Arctik_Firangi wrote:An explanation?

All you did was use a bunch of bold text, capital letters and create a temporary meme, "feesible", which was propogated by the other users of this thread in order to point out that you are being unimaginative for a teenage vampkid.

Who demands an hastened explanation in the same post he asked the question in? Someone employing a rhetorical device - that's who.

Work on your spelling and punctuation and maybe that knowledge of what-guns-fit-where will be put to good use by an educated person rather than scribbled on the back of an unemployment application.

Where does the ammo go? At the baddies!

The proposed rule screams 'kustom mekjob' - Orky rules tend to uphold that 'impossible is possible'.

I hope this wasnt discriminating against my culture. for your sake
and this isnt proposed for orks. its being proposed for guard.

Deadshot wrote:If it is an Apoc tank only, then no. But in standard games, this will anhilate most armies that can't field an unreal number of vehicles. So anything that is not guard, SM or Tau. Even DE vehciles are useless vs this thing.

This thing puts out

15 Str 6, AP3 shots
20, Str 5, AP-, rending shots
12, Str 6, AP 4, rending shots.


Just wait for those nids/orks to attempt to get past. DE will need to really on Flat out. Eldar have a small chance, but they have so little compared to a guard army it doesn't matter. Necrons are pretty much dead anyway.


In a decent sized game, Vanilla SM can take 4 LRs. 3 for HS, 1 for a Termy squad, 1 for Assault Termies. If I am not mistaken, SW can take 4, 1 for Wolf Guard. GK can take 3, and BA can take am lot, because they are transports.

Guard can put out LOTS of vehicles, including a lot of Russes.

Tau have the firepower to take this down, and mobility to fight back.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Just to make the WAAC players happier, imagine Pask inside.

thanks.
hadnt realised just how OP it was.

hope this places you on my side

Oh yeah.

Deadshot wrote:Maybe taking out the entire front area,reduce it to a AV 12(to represent the delicate gun),and have the turret and sponsons as normal.Makke it so that the vulcan can be the Weapon for Lumbering Behemoth,but then the Turret can't fire or vice versa.If it remains stationary it can fire the Vulcan twice,but can't fire the other guns.

I was just thinking a Vulcan with guns on the side, mounted on like a set of tracks.

Deadshot wrote:If it is an Apoc tank only, then no. But in standard games, this will anhilate most armies that can't field an unreal number of vehicles. So anything that is not guard, SM or Tau. Even DE vehciles are useless vs this thing.

This thing puts out

15 Str 6, AP3 shots
20, Str 5, AP-, rending shots
12, Str 6, AP 4, rending shots.


Just wait for those nids/orks to attempt to get past. DE will need to really on Flat out. Eldar have a small chance, but they have so little compared to a guard army it doesn't matter. Necrons are pretty much dead anyway.


In a decent sized game, Vanilla SM can take 4 LRs. 3 for HS, 1 for a Termy squad, 1 for Assault Termies. If I am not mistaken, SW can take 4, 1 for Wolf Guard. GK can take 3, and BA can take am lot, because they are transports.

Guard can put out LOTS of vehicles, including a lot of Russes.

Tau have the firepower to take this down, and mobility to fight back.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Just to make the WAAC players happier, imagine Pask inside.

You apparently haven't played many Battlewagon Bash lists. Orks can get 8 FAV14 vehicles into a decent sized normal game, all covered with KFF giving them 4+ cover.