TSA go from airport security to Polizei?

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**Frazzled**

Random searches statewide. Do you have your papers?

http://www.newschannel5.com/story/15725035/officials-claim-tennessee-becomes-first-state-to-deploy-vipr-statewide

Tennessee Becomes First State To Fight Terrorism Statewide
Posted: Oct 18, 2011 5:34 PM CDT
Updated: Oct 18, 2011 5:54 PM CDT

By Adam Ghassemi

PORTLAND, Tenn. – You're probably use to seeing TSA's signature blue uniforms at the airport, but now agents are hitting the interstates to fight terrorism with Visible Intermodal Prevention and Response (VIPR).

"Where is a terrorist more apt to be found? Not these days on an airplane more likely on the interstate," said Tennessee Department of Safety & Homeland Security Commissioner Bill Gibbons.

Tuesday Tennessee was first to deploy VIPR simultaneously at five weigh stations and two bus stations across the state.

Agents are recruiting truck drivers, like Rudy Gonzales, into the First Observer Highway Security Program to say something if they see something.

"Not only truck drivers, but cars, everybody should be aware of what's going on, on the road," said Gonzales.

It's all meant to urge every driver to call authorities if they see something suspicious.

"Somebody sees something somewhere and we want them to be responsible citizens, report that and let us work it through our processes to abet the concern that they had when they saw something suspicious," said Paul Armes, TSA Federal Security Director for Nashville International Airport.

The Tennessee Highway Patrol checked trucks with drug and bomb sniffing dogs during random inspections.

"The bottom line is this: if you see something suspicious say something about it," Gibbons said Tuesday.

The random inspections really aren't any more thorough normal, according to Tennessee Highway Patrol Colonel Tracy Trott who says paying attention to details can make a difference. Trott pointed out it was an Oklahoma state trooper who stopped Timothy McVay for not having a license plate after the Oklahoma City bombing in the early 1990s.

Tuesday's statewide "VIPR" operation isn't in response to any particular threat, according to officials.

Armes said intelligence indicates law enforcement should focus on the highways as well as the airports.

Email: aghassemi@newschannel5.com
Facebook: facebook.com/NC5AdamGhassemi
Twitter: twitter.com/NC5_AGhassemi

From the Gestapo er TSA website:

Visible Intermodal Protection and Response (VIPR) teams consist of a combination of STSIs, Federal Air Marshals, explosive-detection canine teams, Aviation Security Inspectors, and Transportation Security Officers. The teams provide a random, announced, high-visibility surge into a transit agency, in addition to enhancing agency resources during special events. More than 50 mass transit deployments have occurred since the program was initiated in December 2005. Regional planning and execution is increasing the frequency of deployments and enhancing local expertise, thereby increasing the terrorism deterrent effect. Recent examples include VIPR deployments at the Massachusetts Bay Transportation Authority (MBTA) system in Boston, at Amtrak facilities in Boston, upstate New York, Philadelphia and Washington DC, and at the Niagara Frontier Transportation Authority and Amtrak facilities in Buffalo, New York. In March 2007, the New York Metropolitan Transportation Authority and TSA announced a joint initiative under which VIPR teams will supplement security operations on the Metro North commuter rail system and the Long Island Railroad.

**Phanatik** · It's January 5, 1984.

It's January 5, 1984.

**Melissia**

Goddamnit TSA.

"WE ARE RECRUITING CITIZENS TO WATCH THEIR NEIGHBORS!"

**daedalus**

C'mon guys, things aren't so bad. I've never felt safer. I mean, obviously they're doing a good job. We haven't had a terrorist attack for YEARS now.

Besides, things used to be much worse. Remember back before they increased the weekly chocorat from 30 grams to 25 grams? Those were dark days...

**Lint**

Seems to have been the trend for the last decade. Big Brother is finding it easier to just have us do his watching for him.

**Phanatik**

daedalus wrote:...they increased the weekly chocorat from 30 grams to 25 grams?

doubleplusgood

**mattyrm**

TSA piss me off as well, I dont know why the feth they have absolutely no sense of humour at all, I musta flew into the US about 20 times, and I think I've had good experiences about twice.

One time the bloke behind the passport control counter told me he was in the airforce and did it for extra cash at weekends? Though I suspect he was national guard or something as that sounds an odd thing for a serving soldier to be doing. He was cool though, then he said "Thank you for serving!" after he saw my military stamps (asked me why id been to Kuwait and Dubai) and then I said "I was doing pro-for with the commando unit at Kajaki, I wouldn't be here if it wasn't for the close air support you guys gave us, so thank you as well" and then we did a bro fist and I strolled on through.

Most of the time they are super miserable for no reason at all, some bark at you, some really raise their voice for no reason, and after I told one woman I was a RM she said "Do you have any weapons with you?" "and I said "Of course not, I didnt come straight from Iraq or anything!" and she looked very annoyed with me, so I said "Im a green beret, my hands are deadly weapons!" and then she looked even more annoyed and put her hands under the desk and I thought "Ok she is going to shoot me"

So now I never crack jokes, or call them "mate" or do anything other than follow all orders and then tell all of the missus family how much I hate TSA.

It really is needless aggression. You can have safety and security without being a fething lunatic about it.

**daedalus**

mattyrm wrote:

It really is needless aggression. You can have safety and security without being a fething lunatic about it.

It's ABSOLUTELY necessary. The fear is important. Vital, really.

**Melissia**

It's not fear, it's just annoyance.

Well on our part anyway.

**Cyporiean**

Its called Viper? What is Cobra running the TSA now?

**Frazzled**

Melissia wrote:It's not fear, it's just annoyance.

Well on our part anyway.

Indeed. Its pretty much the DMV or local county assessor office, except they have guns.

**daedalus**

For you, sure, for me, sure. There's a lot of people out there though who genuinely believe that we're under constant threat of 'terrorists'.

**Melissia**

The DMV is far more pleasant...

**daedalus**

Frazzled wrote:
Indeed. Its pretty much the DMV or local county assessor office, except they have guns.

Actually, that would be enough to cause fear.

**Melissia**

daedalus wrote:For you, sure, for me, sure. There's a lot of people out there though who genuinely believe that we're under constant threat of 'terrorists'.

Yes, there's loonies everywhere.

**Frazzled**

daedalus wrote:For you, sure, for me, sure. There's a lot of people out there though who genuinely believe that we're under constant threat of 'terrorists'.

We are. The TSA doesn't help.

the thought of them randomly wandering a state, harassing people at truck stops, and buses is just not sane. I'm sure somewhere its legal but seriously? They should just start calling themselves NKVD LITE or something.

**kronk**

mattyrm wrote: One time the bloke behind the passport control counter told me he was in the airforce and did it for extra cash at weekends? Though I suspect he was national guard or something as that sounds an odd thing for a serving soldier to be doing.

Off-Topic: Probably Air Force Reserves. Two days a month service. You work a day job the rest of the month. You can get called up to full active duty, depending on your competencies and such.

On Topic: Meh. Cops are already doing random stops on Highway 59 North of Houston to find drug smugglers. I couldn't care less.

**Melissia**

Yes, but even if one holds that opinion... the cops are competently trained most of the time.

The TSA isn't.

**Nocturn**

He could be active duty. I am and I do airport security on the weekends. It's not TSA but it's every bit as fun, cause I'm not stuck at a checkpoint.

Personally, I think it's a good idea. It creates some new jobs, and works to further reduce the threat of terrorism.

**Kanluwen**

Good on 'em.

You would not believe how many terrorist attacks have been preceded by routine traffic stops that were not necessarily followed up on.

2002: Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigade Suicide Bombers were stopped en route to a mission by the Israeli National Police.
2001: THREE of the 9/11 hijackers were stopped for speednig or various moving violations. Zaid Jarah, Mohammed Atta(who had a bench warrant for his arrest issued), and Hani Hanjour.
1999: Ahmed Ressam was stopped by U.S. Customs along a route which did not require him to go through Victoria, British Columbia. He was also known as the Millennium Bomber.
1994: Timothy McVeigh was stopped for no license plates, having a copy of The Turner Diaries, carrying a weapon, and wearing a shirt that quoted "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants".
1988: Yu Kikumura was stopped by the New Jersey State Police. He was a Japanese Red Army bomber, the vehicle was stopped for a routine violation...and they discovered bomb materials within his car.

It might sound silly, but there's a reason terrorists will use rental or stolen cars with unmatching registration.

**juraigamer**

Aw comon guys, it's just Tennessee wanting some attention. Don't give it too them, ignore them, and it will all go awa...

HEY DON'T FEED Tennessee BREAD! YEA YOU!

**Phanatik**

I forget...

Is the TSA at war with Oceania or Eurasia?

**dogma**

Frazzled wrote:
We are. The TSA doesn't help.

I don't see how additional security cannot be considered to be helping in terms of threat mitigation.

Frazzled wrote:
the thought of them randomly wandering a state, harassing people at truck stops, and buses is just not sane. I'm sure somewhere its legal but seriously? They should just start calling themselves NKVD LITE or something.

Because they check trucks at weigh stations that are already used for inspections?

**daedalus**

Kanluwen wrote:Good on 'em.

You would not believe how many terrorist attacks have been preceded by routine traffic stops that were not necessarily followed up on.

What reason was there FOR them to be followed up on? Are you saying that every routine traffic stop should be treated as through it could be a potential terrorist attack? I'm asking out of ignorance, not trying to put words in your mouth. I mean, I don't know much about the situations you mentioned, but...

2002: Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigade Suicide Bombers were stopped en route to a mission by the Israeli National Police.

Were they wearing shirts confessing their intentions? Did they have the bombs sitting in the passenger seat right next to them?

2001: THREE of the 9/11 hijackers were stopped for speednig or various moving violations. Zaid Jarah, Mohammed Atta(who had a bench warrant for his arrest issued), and Hani Hanjour.

Again, was there anything out of the ordinary?

1999: Ahmed Ressam was stopped by U.S. Customs along a route which did not require him to go through Victoria, British Columbia. He was also known as the Millennium Bomber.

Is bypassing Victoria out of the ordinary? I've never been.

1994: Timothy McVeigh was stopped for no license plates, having a copy of The Turner Diaries, carrying a weapon, and wearing a shirt that quoted "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants".

God, I'd hate to see how people judge the way I'm dressed when I'm not at work, especially if I have my copy of The Prince on me at the time. Hitler read that, you know. What weapon did he have on him? Was it legal in that jurisdiction?

1988: Yu Kikumura was stopped by the New Jersey State Police. He was a Japanese Red Army bomber, the vehicle was stopped for a routine violation...and they discovered bomb materials within his car.

What kind of 'bomb materials'? Again, not challenging you, just curious.

It might sound silly, but there's a reason terrorists will use rental or stolen cars with unmatching registration.

Were the above doing that? Using a stolen car with bogus registration is definitely a crime, and should be prosecuted as such to the fullest extent of the law. I don't think that should should be suspected of terrorism due to it though.

Makes about as much sense as me saying that "there's a reason terrorists will inhale oxygen and drink water". Sure, they absolutely do. Problem is that there's even more people who don't.

15,000 Cars were stolen in Missouri in 2010. How many of those were stolen by terrorists?
http://blogs.riverfronttimes.com/dailyrft/2011/04/stolen_cars_missouri_2010.php

Automatically Appended Next Post:

dogma wrote:
I don't see how additional security cannot be considered to be helping in terms of threat mitigation.

For starters, I think there's a particular amount of cost-benefit ratio to consider. I have little use for absolute security at any cost. How much does the TSA cost us a year? How many terrorists have they caught? I can't find a reported value, and I've found plenty of places that report that the TSA considers that a "state secret". I would expect that if there HAVE been times they've successfully caught a terrorist, then they would at least publish the numbers, if not the names and plots, just to do something to validate their further existence.

Frankly, I'm more afraid of spontaneous combustion than I am of terrorism.

**Frazzled**

Nocturn wrote:He could be active duty. I am and I do airport security on the weekends. It's not TSA but it's every bit as fun, cause I'm not stuck at a checkpoint.

Personally, I think it's a good idea. It creates some new jobs, and works to further reduce the threat of terrorism.

I think its treasonous against the intent of the Founding Fathers (that whole live free or die thing rearing its ugly head). I think if they were alive they would be shooting at you in rebellion. Unfortunately for them they would be using muskets which are no match for a deer rifle, let alone the incredibly overpriced

the military buys.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Phanatik wrote:I forget...

Is the TSA at war with Oceania or Eurasia?

What week is it?

**kronk**

Phanatik wrote:I forget...

Is the TSA at war with Oceania or Eurasia?

Judging from my last trip from Chicago, the TSA is at war with my junk and the baggage handlers REALLY (like x2) hate my bags...

**dogma**

daedalus wrote:
For starters, I think there's a particular amount of cost-benefit ratio to consider. I have little use for absolute security at any cost. How much does the TSA cost us a year? How many terrorists have they caught? I can't find a reported value, and I've found plenty of places that report that the TSA considers that a "state secret". I would expect that if there HAVE been times they've successfully caught a terrorist, then they would at least publish the numbers, if not the names and plots, just to do something to validate their further existence.

Frankly, I'm more afraid of spontaneous combustion than I am of terrorism.

I'm not objecting to any of that, I'm objecting to the idea that increased security does not mitigate threat.

I'm not particularly afraid of terrorism either, as its statistically unlikely to impact my life, even as someone who plans on spending most of it in and around DC, or American embassies.

As far as publish terrorist statistics, I imagine that they try and avoid doing that because it might hurt the case for their existence as much as it helps them. I mean, as we're seeing in this thread, many people consider state security measures to be intrusive, and undesirable.

**Melissia**

I consider an expansion of said measures to be undesirable, yes. It's the job of the FBI and CIA to keep track of things on the ground, they're trained for it... the TSA isn't. It'd be like if you rounded up air force pilots and sent them off to fight with M16s in place of the Marines...

... except taht comparison is unfair to the air force pilots really. They're more competent than the average TSA employee.

**dogma**

I imagine that the training for the VIPR groups differs from that of the training for the guy standing by the scanners at the airport.

**Melissia**

That doesn't necessarily mean it's better.