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Can an MC gain cover from intervening units. Example: Can a fex get cover from a brood of genestealers or even Reg space marine unit?

If I recall correctly, it requires 50% of its mass (core body + limbs) be obscured in a similar fashion to vehicles.

I assume if intervening troops do this they'd get cover.

Of course you're probably better waiting for someone who actually knows what they're on about. xD

Thats right - intervening units have to block more than 50% of the model to get cover. I'm not going to go pull my minis out, but I bet you can block more than 50% with a Tac Squad but I'm not sure. Really, it depends on the terrain, distance, etc. - there's no way to give a yes or no because there's so many possibilities.

It's possible, but given the height of the models and the design, I'd say it's unlikely, but it's something you have to see for yourself on the tabletop.

I don't have it in front of me, but I believe the BRB says a MC can never get cover from intervening infantry. Only vehicles and/or other MC.

Nope, MC's (like vehicles) must be 50% obscured to claim a cover save. Some MC's (i.e. Avatar of Khaine) are small enough that they would be able to get a cover save from say a group on intervening Tyranid Warriors.

Fireknife wrote:I don't have it in front of me, but I believe the BRB says a MC can never get cover from intervening infantry. Only vehicles and/or other MC.

Nope, no such rule. They simply have to be 50% obscured to count as in cover.

So as with most LOS questions, it depends entirely on the actual placement of the models on the table. The only way to answer the question is to bend down and have a look.

Fireknife wrote:I don't have it in front of me, but I believe the BRB says a MC can never get cover from intervening swarms.

Maybe this is what you meant?
From page 76.

Easier to get a fex cover with 50 percent obscured as opposed to wraithlords who have like 60 in just their dang head and shoulder weapons

This is where modelling for an advantage comes into play: a 'Fex lurking along the ground like it's stalking prey will be much easier to cover than one that is rearing up and looking majestic in a Godzilla-like pose.

Also, when accounting for cover only the main body, arms, legs are counted for LOS purposes, the rulebook states you wont be penalised for cool poses etc.

I miss when the models only existed within their base,

KamikazeCanuck wrote:I miss when the models only existed within their base,

Which game were you playing? Because that's never been the case in 40K, other than for those who played the 4th ed LOS rules incorrectly.

insaniak wrote:

KamikazeCanuck wrote:I miss when the models only existed within their base,

Which game were you playing? Because that's never been the case in 40K, other than for those who played the 4th ed LOS rules incorrectly.

Errr, back when they had size 1, 2 and 3.

KamikazeCanuck wrote:Errr, back when they had size 1, 2 and 3.

Yup, that was 4th edition. It used TLOS, just like every other edition has.

Models were assigned size categories, but these only became relevant when the LOS passed through area terrain or close combats.


And the area of the base has never had anything to do with LOS. It's purely used for measurement.

I seem to remember there being something about not penalizing ornately modelled....models. Curse you! Now I have to go look up obsolete rules.

Ovion wrote:Also, when accounting for cover only the main body, arms, legs are counted for LOS purposes, the rulebook states you wont be penalised for cool poses etc.

You can easily be "penalized" for cool poses. What the rulebook says is that wings, tails, weapons and similar non-body bits aren't counted, which helps keep cool models from being hurt too badly. But if you've posed or model with an upraised arm, or put him on a high scenic base or something (my Mephiston is posed on half a carnifex's head), that can certainly make him an easier target.

I agree. I think a Nidzilla list comprised entire of MCs that crawl along the ground on their bellies would have a significant advantage over a Nidzilla list wherein all the MCs are mounted atop perches, reaching towards the sky or otherwise just looking as big and impressive as can be.

It sucks when coolness and competitiveness come into conflict.

Mannahnin wrote:You can easily be "penalized" for cool poses. What the rulebook says is that wings, tails, weapons and similar non-body bits aren't counted, which helps keep cool models from being hurt too badly. But if you've posed or model with an upraised arm, or put him on a high scenic base or something (my Mephiston is posed on half a carnifex's head), that can certainly make him an easier target.

It's also worth noting that while wings or banners or the like may not count for LOS to the model, they still obscure LOS to models behind.

azazel the cat wrote:I agree. I think a Nidzilla list comprised entire of MCs that crawl along the ground on their bellies would have a significant advantage over a Nidzilla list wherein all the MCs are mounted atop perches, reaching towards the sky or otherwise just looking as big and impressive as can be.

It sucks when coolness and competitiveness come into conflict.

Thankfully, in 12 years of hardcore tournament gaming, I've only seen that done once.

I think the only nid models that can cover a fex or a tyrant are gargoyles just because they are so wide spread/modeled. They take up a lot of space visually and therefore creates an efficient enough "screen"

I love my trygon, but the fact that really it will never get cover because its so damn huge sorta irks me

Cryage wrote:I think the only nid models that can cover a fex or a tyrant are gargoyles just because they are so wide spread/modeled. They take up a lot of space visually and therefore creates an efficient enough "screen"

It really comes down to the position of the models in question. A single Gaunt could be sufficient to obscure half of a Carnifex, with the right placement.

What if you can just see the gangly arms of a deffdred?

Cryage wrote:I think the only nid models that can cover a fex or a tyrant are gargoyles just because they are so wide spread/modeled.

Even assuming you are leaving out Monstrous Creatures (e.g. Hive Tyrants give cover saves almost every time), and ignore models people need to mod (without the Swarm rule, skyslasher broods could give cover to anything), Warriors can give cover to a 'fex with very little issue, and hormagaunts can with some consistency, Lictors can but are never used. . .I could go on, but I want to say that, generally speaking, you are correct about the Trigon.

Cryage wrote:I think the only nid models that can cover a fex or a tyrant are gargoyles just because they are so wide spread/modeled. They take up a lot of space visually and therefore creates an efficient enough "screen"

I love my trygon, but the fact that really it will never get cover because its so damn huge sorta irks me

Belly flop that Trygon!

I've seen MCs given cover by clustered Hive Guard, Gargoyles, a combination of smaller bugs and terrain, etc.

Trygons have a harder time of it, of course, but I expect that's why GW gave them six wounds.

No they dont. Units dont give cover models do.
Thats a big difference. Trying to get cover for a M/C is almost impossible.

kryczek wrote:Trying to get cover for a M/C is almost impossible.

I read and hear this often enough, but it never seems true on the table.

If it's a unit of MCs (fexes, tomb spyders), you can attach ICs to it to take advantage of cover saves being applied to the unit as a whole if the MCs don't account for more than 50% of the unit.

kryczek wrote:Trying to get cover for a M/C is almost impossible.

So wrong it hurts. I've gotten cover on all my TMCs (no Trygons) and my opponent had cover saves on his Trygon (when it was hiding behind a building). (just the last couple games - I'm not 100% sure on any more than that)