Best Dark Harliestar Load Out

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**Gordash**

Apologies if this has been covered... also, let's not get into whether it works rules wise- let's assume it does (because it does).

Im working out the best way to run the dark harliestar. Obviously, it needs 10 eldar harlequins and shadowseer, all with kisses, which comes to 250 pts.

You want Eldrad as well, to ensure that fortune stays up.

Dark Eldar wise you've got the Baron, Vect, or an Archon with a shadowfield and a huskblade (about 130pts)- Baron seems the most efficient, but what do you guys think? So far, we're looking at 600 to 700 pts.

Also, do you think this is best with Eldar/DE allies or DE/Eldar allies?

**Colin747**

I was under the impression you could no longer fortune DE?

**Gordash**

The Harlies in the army would be Eldar Harlies. You can fortune Eldar Harlies. You then attach a dark eldar I.C. to the unit.

My understanding is that the unit of Eldar Harlies + DE I.C. stays an Eldar Unit for the purposes of Fortune.

**JGrand**

The Harlies in the army would be Eldar Harlies. You can fortune Eldar Harlies. You then attach a dark eldar I.C. to the unit.

My understanding is that the unit of Eldar Harlies + DE I.C. stays an Eldar Unit for the purposes of Fortune.

Correct.

To answer the original question, it depends on how much you want to put into the unit.

On the cheap:

10 Harlies, Shadowseer, 10x kisses
Archon with Shadowfield, Venom Blade
Farseer with Fortune, Runes of Witnessing

Total: 440 points

You still have the destructive power of the Harlies, yet retain fleet. You aren't putting too many eggs in one basket as well.

Overkiller:

Vect
Eldrad
Fuegan/Maugen Ra
10 Harlies, Shadowseer, 10x kisses

Total: around 900 points

The benefit here is that you have three attached characters, two of which are very killy. In addition, you can Fortune twice in the event that you run into a Rune Priest or happen to fail. Vect's 4+ to Seize the Initiative means that you likely will not be alpha stuck. Finally, the ability to put a character at each corner of the unit gives much needed protection against Helldrakes.

The main consideration is that you are paying over 2x the cost.

**ALEXisAWESOME**

I acturally play dark haliestar and can vouche for it being BRUTAL! I run it on the cheap side at 1850 pts(5 halies w/ kisses, shadowseer, troupe leader powerspear, Archon and seer) and once you are past turn 1, you get that 2++ re-rollable going, its VERY hard to get ridoff. Archon gets the shadowfield(duh!), huskblade, V.blade (for when wounding is more important) and a soultrap. The idea is to throw it straight at the other army (through cover if at all possible) and what a stupid amount of firepower bounce off. When you hit there lines charge straight for the warlord (if beatable, so dont go for abbadon), leap frogging though units to get that warlord point, and more importantly str 6 for the archon. I have done this in at least half my games (str 10 a few times!) and then that unit becomes the center of ALL shooting possible. Laught as the rest of your army closes in for the kill.

The most important thing about haliestar is model placement. If running through cover, no point putting the archon in the frount, as he has the same save as a normal quin. ALWAYS have the shadowseer in the middle, followed closely by the seer (although she is a lot more survivable). Apart from that out of cover, always have the 2++ facing as much of the fire as humanly (eldarly?) possible. Peopel will bitch and whine and you will drink there tears.

P.S take out that vindicare assasin first turn. No exceptions.

**Gordash**

What do you think about Karandaras in the squad? Does he not do more of what the squad needs (more beats) than the other two?

**whplayer65**

Going to be trying out a harliestar unit for the first time tomorrow. Only problem is my opponent usually runs 2 heldrakes =(

**Gordash**

Has anyone tried it out with the Baron or does he not have enough synergy with the squad?

**Exergy**

Gordash wrote:
Has anyone tried it out with the Baron or does he not have enough synergy with the squad?

barons doesnt really offer much to a harly star. They already have hit and run, they already have grenades, they already have stealth. He is just a 2++ on a chump body. Your shadowfield archon is much much killier and costs just 15 points more.

**wuestenfux**

Vect
Eldrad
Fuegan/Maugen Ra
10 Harlies, Shadowseer, 10x kisses

Eldrad doesn't have FoF which can be a big drawback.

I have a different setup, with 10 Harlies on one hand and a Seer Council led by a Fortuneseer and Fuegan on the other. I played a 1500 pt game vs Tau and both units rocked the house killing almost the whole army in 5 turns.

**lizardwolf19**

Exergy wrote:
Gordash wrote:
Has anyone tried it out with the Baron or does he not have enough synergy with the squad?

barons doesnt really offer much to a harly star. They already have hit and run, they already have grenades, they already have stealth. He is just a 2++ on a chump body. Your shadowfield archon is much much killier and costs just 15 points more.

Where do the harlies get hit and run from if not the baron?

**Exergy**

lizardwolf19 wrote:
Exergy wrote:
Gordash wrote:
Has anyone tried it out with the Baron or does he not have enough synergy with the squad?

barons doesnt really offer much to a harly star. They already have hit and run, they already have grenades, they already have stealth. He is just a 2++ on a chump body. Your shadowfield archon is much much killier and costs just 15 points more.

Where do the harlies get hit and run from if not the baron?

i thought harlies had it. Dance of death or something

**lizardwolf19**

I don't believe that they do, page number? I don't have my 'dex with me ATM

**Exergy**

lizardwolf19 wrote:
I don't believe that they do, page number? I don't have my 'dex with me ATM

im at work, but i know they have a special rule that conferes them a bunch of other rules. I believe they get FC and Hit and Run from something the likes of Dance of Death. Will check when i get off.

**kitch102**

Craftworld codez says fleet of foot AND dance of death, with dod conferring furious assault and hit n run.

Can check de codex too if yiu want me too

**Gordash**

So unless you're bringing Vect, the best load out for the DE HQ is an Archon with a SF and... a huskblade? With a huskblade, you just challenge and destroy whatever comes your way.

My favourite part about this unit is that it not only revitalizes Harlies, but you can stick crazy things in it that you'd never bring in 5th.

**Exergy**

Gordash wrote:
So unless you're bringing Vect, the best load out for the DE HQ is an Archon with a SF and... a huskblade? With a huskblade, you just challenge and destroy whatever comes your way.

My favourite part about this unit is that it not only revitalizes Harlies, but you can stick crazy things in it that you'd never bring in 5th.

combat drugs and a soul trap arent terrible uses of 10 points.

**autopilot**

If you bring only an archon, isn't the lack of Fearless a problem?

How do you position once you reach CC so that you don't lose combat?

EDIT: Also, as for moving through cover, wouldn't you have to roll for the DE characters? Could end up screwing yourself with low movement rolls.

**Barrywise**

what about getting preferred enemy from Vect?

**Exergy**

autopilot wrote:
If you bring only an archon, isn't the lack of Fearless a problem?

How do you position once you reach CC so that you don't lose combat?

EDIT: Also, as for moving through cover, wouldn't you have to roll for the DE characters? Could end up screwing yourself with low movement rolls.

only if the DE characters are actually in cover

**felixcat**

[== Dark HarlieStar ==

HQ: Asdrubael Vect - 240 [DE]
HQ: Eldrad Ulthran - 210 [EL]
HQ: Fuegan, the Burning Lance 205 - [EL]

Elites: 7 Harlequins, 7 Kisses, 1 Shadowseer - 206 [EL]
Elites: 3 Truborn - 2 Dark Lances 86

Troop: 10 Warriors - 1 Dark Lances - 115 [DE]
Troop: 10 Warriors - Blaster, Sybarite Venom Blade - 120 [DE]
Troop: 3 Guardian Jetbikes, Shuriken Cannon - 76 [EL]
Troop: 3 Guardian Jetbikes, Shuriken Cannon - 76 [EL]
Troop: 3 Guardian Jetbikes, Shuriken Cannon - 76 [EL]

Heavy Support: 2 Warwalkers - Dual Scattrlasers - 120 [EL]
Heavy Support: 2 Warwalkers - Dual Scattrlasers - 120 [EL]

Fortification: Aegis Defense Line, Quad Autocannons - 100

TOTAL POINTS: 1750

To understand the whys of the list ...
1) You want Eldard double casting each turn. Believe it. Do not worry about fleet. Properly strung out the group will attack together. These guys almost have to get into cc by turn three - the big weakness
2) You want Vect's abilities in cc and prefered enemy is quite good
3) Eight Harlies are enough with the characters to multi-assault. This is the key. Ten is okay but unecessary.
4) AGL and truborn and warriors are really the backbone with the guardians coming in from reserve. They will pump our a fair amount of firepower. In 6ed five troop slots just cut it at 1750.
5) Warwalkers with dual scattters - the new hotness. Don't outflank these guys ever. Generally you will see three squads of walkers but with the four dark lances and the AGL two suffice.

The list is good. It is hardly OP but it can win it's share of games.

**shogun**

felixcat wrote:
[== Dark HarlieStar ==

HQ: Asdrubael Vect - 240 [DE]
HQ: Eldrad Ulthran - 210 [EL]
HQ: Fuegan, the Burning Lance 205 - [EL]

Elites: 8 Harlequins, 8 Kisses, 1 Shadowseer - 224 [EL]
Elites: 3 Truborn - 2 Dark Lances 86

Troop: 10 Warriors - 2 Dark Lances - 100 [DE]
Troop: 10 Warriors - Splinter Cannon, Sybarite Venom Blade - 115 [DE]
Troop: 3 Guardian Jetbikes, Shuriken Cannon - 76 [EL]
Troop: 3 Guardian Jetbikes, Shuriken Cannon - 76 [EL]
Troop: 3 Guardian Jetbikes, Shuriken Cannon - 76 [EL]

Heavy Support: 2 Warwalkers - Dual Scattrlasers - 120 [EL]
Heavy Support: 2 Warwalkers - Dual Scattrlasers - 120 [EL]

Fortification: Aegis Defense Line, Quad Autocannons - 100

TOTAL POINTS: 1748

To understand the whys of the list ...
1) You want Eldard double casting each turn. Believe it. Do not worry about fleet. Properly strung out the group will attack together. These guys almost have to get into cc by turn three - the big weakness
2) You want Vect's abilities in cc and prefered enemy is quite good
3) Eight Harlies are enough with the four characters to multi-assault. This is the key. Ten is okay but unecessary - seven or eight are possible in smaller games.
4) AGL and truborn and warriors are really the backbone with the guardians coming in from reserve. They will pump our a fair amount of firepower. In 6ed five troop slots just cut it at 1750.
5) Warwalkers with dual scattters - the new hotness. Don't outflank these guys ever. Generally you will see three squads of walkers but with the four dark lances and the AGL two suffice.

The list is good. It is hardly OP but it can win it's share of games.

Nice setup but i believe that the beastmaster unit makes a better deathstar. Harlies dont got the speed and lose their close combat potential fast after a few wounds.

I also believe you cannot get 2 dark lances with only 10 warriors (1 for every 10 right?) typo, I believe?
why do you pick Fuegan for this list? i think its a lot of points to get a 2+ save in your harlie-unit..

**felixcat**

Yes. A typo - written quickly from notes on a game played. I've corrected it. A beastmaster unit is a fantastic deathstar. No question about it. Pick your poison.
Fuegan is AP2 at I7 and has FNP base. And a STr8 and tank hunters. You could use Karandras for more attacks but really do you need them? Fuegan will tank nearly anything.

**Gordash**

I don't see how the beastmasters make a better deathstar. Sure, you put a fast character with a shadowfield, but there are no rerolls and a savvy player will get around him and put the wounds on the unit. The lack of Fortune and the abundance of anti-infantry weapons make the beastmasters squad worse than in 5th. Unless I'm missing something, which could be the case!

I think the best deathstar that the Eldar/DE combo can put together is the Harliestar- although it certainly isn't the cheapest!

**Exergy**

Gordash wrote:
I don't see how the beastmasters make a better deathstar. Sure, you put a fast character with a shadowfield, but there are no rerolls and a savvy player will get around him and put the wounds on the unit. The lack of Fortune and the abundance of anti-infantry weapons make the beastmasters squad worse than in 5th. Unless I'm missing something, which could be the case!

I think the best deathstar that the Eldar/DE combo can put together is the Harliestar- although it certainly isn't the cheapest!

they are fast,
they have a ton of wounds and rending attacks
with invis they still have the 2+ cover save
they are cheap

**D6Damager**

Gordash wrote:
I don't see how the beastmasters make a better deathstar. Sure, you put a fast character with a shadowfield, but there are no rerolls and a savvy player will get around him and put the wounds on the unit. The lack of Fortune and the abundance of anti-infantry weapons make the beastmasters squad worse than in 5th. Unless I'm missing something, which could be the case!

I think the best deathstar that the Eldar/DE combo can put together is the Harliestar- although it certainly isn't the cheapest!

The beastmaster squad survives flamer template attacks better and can get into assault faster and is cheaper.

**JGrand**

I've actually just written an article discussing the four main types of Eldar/DE deathstars (Seer Council, Harlies, Beastpack, Grotesques), and the pros, cons, and builds of each if anyone is interested:

http://rhetorical40k.wordpress.com/2013/02/22/army-building-eldardark-eldar-deathstars/

I actually think that the Seer Council is best, but as posters have mentioned in the thread, the other choices can work too. It's hard to argue with a durable unit that can bring the pain. The key is attaching the correct characters and psykers to each.

**Exergy**

D6Damager wrote:
Gordash wrote:
I don't see how the beastmasters make a better deathstar. Sure, you put a fast character with a shadowfield, but there are no rerolls and a savvy player will get around him and put the wounds on the unit. The lack of Fortune and the abundance of anti-infantry weapons make the beastmasters squad worse than in 5th. Unless I'm missing something, which could be the case!

I think the best deathstar that the Eldar/DE combo can put together is the Harliestar- although it certainly isn't the cheapest!

The beastmaster squad survives flamer template attacks better and can get into assault faster and is cheaper.

well and having 5 wounds per base means that even if you get each and every model covered by 5 templates you are likely to survive

**Gordash**

I see the merits of the beast unit and don't disagree on the merits.

I like the rerollable save that fortune allows, so I'd still go with the seer council/harliestar. Having read some more about it, I'm a bit less enthusiastic, especially given the helldrake situation.

I've seen a lot of argument for Fuegan, anyone use Jain or Karandras or the other lords? What about the Avatar (or is that too ridiculous?)

**beltenebros**

what about adding:
Farseer w/ RoWarding, RoWitnessing, Spirit Stones, Fortune, Doom
3 warlocks w/Conceal, Enhance, Embolden
9 Harlies and 1 Shadowseer
Karandras

they get 2++ in the open, with karandras they get infiltrate, all are FoF.