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Have recently switched over from playing Marines to Tau and under the new codex I find myself re-evaluating the way I do my army list and the tactics I use. In the past I've stayed clear of using Seeker Missiles and Markerlights as I didn't want to add complexity to the game of working out something extra.


So, I wanted to know that the ratio is of players who make use of them a lot, those that dabble with them and those like me who stay clear of them. Don't get me wrong, I can see their use in the game, but not sure if spending points on seeker missiles for Vehicles/models that could be easily lost with a single good shot and render the markerlights much less effective is worth it. The fact they can be used to improved the Balistic skill of firing models may be worth it? I don't know really which is why I'm after opinions on their use.

Don´t like markerlights? Don´t use Tau. Simple as that. Markerlights are the source of all the rage against the famous fishfaces and you want your source to flow.

The answer is yes. Everyone who plays Tau uses markerlights, the only question is how many and on which units.

I wonder how good of a list could be built without Markerlights... that's a very interesting way to mess with peoples target priority!

Ummm... Yes?
thats the whole point of Tau

It was theoretically possible to do Markerlightless Tau and still do well under the previous codex (especially once 6th Edition dropped and that Hard Wired Black Sun Filter was an amazing purchase) but with the demise of Targeting Arrays, to be effective, Tau need Markerlights.

On the plus side, those markerlights are crushingly effective now with some of the new guns they can guide around the table and their ability to modify snap-shots.

I use 2 5 man squads. In every list from 1500 - 2000. I should probably use more but it seems like a good amount to me. They sit on my skyshield and mainly target priority things. With Tau being the same BS as guard you might get away without using them but I can't imagine you not wanting to. 2 words 'negate cover' (and all that entails). So nightfighting, some fortifications, jink saves, wargear, universal rules etc...

Also think about other bonuses like overwatch markers to increase over watch bs (rare but possible).

I don't tend to do badly in my games with Tau without markers lights, but then again I've been putting my losses down to not being a great player vs my friends who are very good players in comparison.

 jifel wrote:
I wonder how good of a list could be built without Markerlights... that's a very interesting way to mess with peoples target priority!

Pretty decently actually, Toolbelt commander, crisis suits with twinlink+1 weapons, Triple tap ethereal bubble, long strike makes for some consistent dakka that is hard to deal with without marker lights.

I thorough enjoy attaching a toolbelt commander to a riptide with ions, for st 9 ap2 large blast ordnance with ignore cover and twinlinked. did that recently and took out an a ghost ark, triark stalker, and an annihilation barge in one shot.

 Desubot wrote:
Pretty decently actually, Toolbelt commander, crisis suits with twinlink+1 weapons, Triple tap ethereal bubble, long strike makes for some consistent dakka that is hard to deal with without marker lights.

And you know what would make that a lot better? Spending a few points on markerlights to make that ethereal bubble shoot at BS 5.

So maybe the trick would be to have a few markerlights and maybe a couple of seeker missiles?


Keeps the costs relatively low, and should the units holding them get destroyed or in a position they can't use them then at least you aren't having a tons of points wasted.

The alternative would be to go Seeker and Markerlight crazy so that no matter what you do you'll never be able to stop the Tau force from being able to use them against you. Though, that's going to cost.

Do tau use markerlights?
Is the pope catholic?

Who are Tau? I've never heard of them before.

Hang on, are they those extra guys you can take in Codex: Markerlight?

Why is your assumption that you must have seeker missiles everywhere if you have markerlights?

Markerlights' primary role should be the removal of cover & increasing BS for units firing @ the lit target. If you want seeker missiles, get a Skyray.

If you play Tau, you use markerlights. Theres no question here.

~Vryce

I dont really need many markerlights. i get a few from various sources. For example Shas'O Ralai, Sensor Tower, but i dont really need/use them very much. I go with overwhelming amount of shots vs more accurate shots. Same reason i dont use pathfinders. they just dont work for me. Ive seen plenty of people that use them. But its all about what works for you.

I believe to not have markerlights is setting yourself up for failure, or very limiting in what kind of threats you can deal with - the challenge is using them effectively.

BS3 is terrible, and tau have limited amounts of low ap shots - so you need them to hit, and you need to get rid of cover saves.

Even the riptide, without marker support, is mediocre at best - if you look at railgun tanks or even rail pathfinders....the markers become even more essential.

Tau can field overwhelming numbers of S5, or dpending on build, s7 shots. But against heavy armor, or enemies with a lot of cover saves....those fail. They have very few S8/9/10 shots...and have to make every single one count.

Markerlights do this reliably.

When I take marker lights, I actually prefer to use Marker Drone squads over pathfinders. They might be more expensive and have a harder time putting marks on target, but the simple fact that they can jump-shoot-jump makes them more versatile.

The way Pathfinders are now, I only use them as special weapon teams... People have a hard time focusing fire on a 4 man squad even if it has a sting like the ion rifle and rail rifle.

tommse wrote:Don´t like markerlights? Don´t use Tau. Simple as that. Markerlights are the source of all the rage against the famous fishfaces and you want your source to flow.

I personally, do not.
I technically
I actually have 6-9 in my list, but they very rarely actually get used, being it's on my Sniper Drone Spotters, and the Spotters are hiding out of sight making my drones BS5, while the drones JSJ the day away.

jifel wrote:I wonder how good of a list could be built without Markerlights... that's a very interesting way to mess with peoples target priority!

I've found that without markerlights, they tend to shoot at the Riptide first, because it's big and scary, then they shoot at the drones (if possible), because they've started raping face... or maybe the Firewarriors, because 30 Str5 shots isn't really anything to sniff at.
I'm just waiting for these new Fortifications - whack an ethereal on a Punisher each, and start pumping out 64-112 Str5 shot from 2 squads a turn.

Peregrine wrote:The answer is yes. Everyone who plays Tau uses markerlights, the only question is how many and on which units.

If Spotters didn't have Markerlights, I'd be fine with it and at that point have no Markerlights at all in my army.

In some ways, I'm just too lazy to use them, in others its... I want the 72+ Firewarriors, 18+ Sniper Drones, 2 Ethereals and the Riptide and Longstrike I spent money on in the army, which doesn't leave many points.
I chose Battlesuits over Markersupport, and it's worked out fine.

You just need to find a goood place to place pathfinders, preferably in a ruin with good cover

 The Shadow wrote:
Who are Tau? I've never heard of them before.

Hang on, are they those extra guys you can take in Codex: Markerlight?

I think so, I think they wear things called battlesuits and have really good guns, but have trouble aiming them properly.
Or so I heard anyway.

Most Tau use markerlights.

MOST.

Some (myself included) don't take too many, if at all, and compensate by simply throwing more dice (having more guys with guns arond)

Not foolproof, and probably not the most efficient thing ever, but it is an option.

But hell, I'd still running a pair of railsides, so who am I to talk efficiency?

Tau is not as dependent on markerlights as they were in the previous edition, but they are still very handy but at the cost that they most likely will give away frist blood in the current usage of them ( small units of 4-6 ) and they draw away a bit of fire or the Mark`o commander with the markerlight drones which is a bit more expensive for 4+ JSJ markerlighs that can move and fire ( huzzah for jet pack infantry )

But all in all the 6th edition Tau allow for more flexibility than before i`d say and markerlights are not auto-take but still pretty damn useful if you use them right, and they can by utter waste depending on your local meta where most people might mini-tailor their lists to include some anti-pathfinder stuff in case they meet tau.

Pros:
- hits on 2+ or rerolls even
- remove cover
- Bs 5 seeker missiles

Cons:
- Often weak units that gives away frist blood
- Have to be smaller units to not waste markerligh shots
- Alternatives are either less cost effective, Forgeword or just meh

I tend to give my firewarrior shas'ui the ML and target lock upgrade and sometimes throw a ML drone into the squads.

I avoid pathfinders because they are fragile and get a bit pricey when you take 8+ (considering they are a support unit).

The misconception that many people have is that you must have markerlights or you will miss all your shots and get thwarted by cover saves.

It is much more valuable to use your points on units that can actually do damage.

A build based on marker lights will crumble if you damage dealing units get destroyed. Alternatively, a build based on markerlights will crumble if your source of markerlights get destroyed.

Include a few markerlights and be happy when they help out, but don't become too dependent on them.

 Krellnus wrote:

 The Shadow wrote:
Who are Tau? I've never heard of them before.

Hang on, are they those extra guys you can take in Codex: Markerlight?

I think so, I think they wear things called battlesuits and have really good guns, but have trouble aiming them properly.
Or so I heard anyway.

Yeah, that's ringing some bells. And something about a Ripcurl? Ripsuit? Something like that.

If you run a farsight bomb you don't need markerlights. Weapons being tl'd and ignoring cover means markerlights lose some value.

Other than that you are going to want to have markerlights. If you have a crisis commander it is not hard to take a drone controller and 2-3 marker drones, allowing a group of firewarriors to finish of a unit your crisis suits damaged. Sniper drone marksmen are much more durable than pathfinders and bs5 is pretty good for marker lights. Skyrays can unload their missiles turn one and then go around as a av 13 marker light and sms shooter.

Pathfinders and not the only way to get markerlights and you should incorporate markerlights in your list some how. I plan that my pathfinders will be dead by turn 2 but they are so useful for that turn 1 alpha strike to insure your opponent's most powerful thing is off the board and you have first blood.

With the exception of farsight bombs since your shots already are TL'd and ignore cover (TL BS3 is pretty damn good odds to hit anyway), you should always have markerlights.

Obvious reason is ignore cover. Tau have decent shooting without marker support, but they lack the numbers to go along without them entirely. FOC restrictions, not points. Crisis teams are actually not that pricy, but you cant get more than 9 without using bodyguards and THOSE are expensive.
Another reason is bullet magnets. Drones are mobile as hell so they tend to draw long-range shots since theyre never in range for short range infantry guns, and Pathfinders are always hiding in cover so both are decently difficult to take out without a massive blob of infantry within 18" or so. My opponents usually make a b-line for my marker squads, giving me 1-2 turns of extra dakka in most situations since im just running the markers around.

Even if i was running a backfield gunline with ionheads, riptides, and missilesides/missilesuits, i'd want markerlights. And thats probably the least effective they'd be in any tau list (outside the bomb)

Hi, im desubot and im a markoholic

Im finding that lately my opponents REALLY want to kill my pathfinders lately even if they only get a few hits per turn.
they completely ignore all of my other threats barreling down. whats with the hate?

anyone else run into this?

 Desubot wrote:
Hi, im desubot and im a markoholic

Im finding that lately my opponents REALLY want to kill my pathfinders lately even if they only get a few hits per turn.
they completely ignore all of my other threats barreling down. whats with the hate?

anyone else run into this?

That is what the interweb is saying to do. Look on any "how to beat tau" thread and the first thing people say is kill the pathfinders. Killing pathfinders is a good idea but if other models present themselves to you, go for those other models. Denying tau first blood is usually more important than killing pathfinders, because tau lacks the objective grabbing power and usually relies on winning with fire blood, line breaker and slay the warlord. So if you can wipe out a unit of firewarriors easier than pathfinders go for the firewarriors. On a similar note, pathfinders on their own are not that scary, if you have a bunch of transports focusing on the broadsides might be more important than focusing on the pathfinders. My point is, 40k is a very dynamic game but people seem to treat it very linearly with target selection planned in advance rather than adapting to what is on the table.

I've found the opposite to be true. Too many times I've had opponents focused on the threats I present to them, instead of the subtle threat provided by markerlights. When a Riptide or two is advancing forward it's easy to forget about a couple Markerdrones. The trick is getting them to focus on the targets you want them to focus on. Had they kept a clear head and thought linearly with a specific goal in mind, my weaponry would become far less effective.

New tau player ... I definitely use them.