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I was wondering how exactly shields work when you are using a two handed weapon. i know you cant claim the save bonus in close combat cuz he's too busy swinging his big weapon around but what about in shooting? can you claim the +1 for the shield even tho he's armed with a 2h?

Yes.
You can even choose not to use your greatweapons in HtH, and claim the +1 for shield and the +1 for hand weapon & shield- if your greatweapon unit was charged, for example.

It's assumed that the guy in question is pulling a Braveheart: holding up the shield while under fire, slinging it back when it's time to use the 2hander.

oh alright, makes sense!

thanks a lot for the help guys, i appreciate it

Can you use spears and shields? gaining the +1? Another thing. For example an empire swordsman. In close combat would he have a 5+ or 4+ save? And empire spearmen (using spears) in CC. Would they have a 5+ or 6+ save?

Posted By colonel584 on 10/14/2006 7:42 AM
Can you use spears and shields? gaining the +1?

Yes, you can use spears and shields.  No, the special +1 is for HAND WEAPONS only, no other type of weapon, magical or otherwise.

Shield 6+

Shield,Hand Weapon 5+

Light armor 6+

Light armor, Shield, Spear 5+

Light armor, Shield, Hand Weapon 4+

 

Remember that the HW+S bonus only operates in close combat and only on foot.

edit: and only against models attacking you from the front

Don't forget you can only use it to defend attacks coming from your front, and not attacks coming from your side or rear

So empire knights would have a 2+ save on charge (they're using lances) and then a 1+ save after that?

Posted By colonel584 on 10/14/2006 7:27 PM
So empire knights would have a 2+ save on charge (they're using lances) and then a 1+ save after that?

Quoted from further up the thread:

"Remember that the HW+S bonus only operates in close combat and only on foot."

So no, the knights don't get it.

So they'd have a permanent 2+ (FPA, Barded Steed)

What's the point of cavalry having shields then? Also, magic swords as said before, are you sure they don't count as hand weapons for the purpose of shields? Whats the difference though they're just hand weapons which have some historical enchanbtment? WTF is up with that?!

The point of cavalry having shields is that they get a +1 improvement to armor (plate is +4, horse is +1, shield is +1, for a 2+).

Magic weapons have enough benefit as it is. As for the justification, you can go for the fluff reason (the magic makes the weapon a full-time job to control) or game balance (it's part of the trade-off for having the benefits of having a magic weapon). Either way, that's the way it is.

So everyone but Empire and Chaos knights would have a 3+ (heavy armour, mounted, shield)?

Empire Knights and Chosen Chaos Knights always have a 1+ save: Full Plate/Chaos Armor (4+), Mounted (+1), Barding (+1), Shield (+1) = 1+ armor save in and out of close combat.

The HW/Shield combo is a +1 bonus in addition to the +1 for having the shield, assuming you meet the requirements (on foot, fighting to the front).

So, with nothing else, a model with a shield and a hand weapon on foot would have a 5+ save in combat: the shield by itself gives a 6+, and then the HW/Shield combo makes it a 5+.

U know the enchanted shield, does the extra +1 save (+2 in total) count in combat aswell? Would this mean a grand master could become really hard to kill with fpa, enchanted shield, barded warhorse, holy relic. This would give a 0+ armour save and 4+ ward?

Yes. But you have to ask yourself if that much magic equipment is worth the pts.

thats 60 pts of wargear. Still enough left (40) so you can buy a decent weapon.

If i had a captain with, Full plate, shield, 2h Would he have a 3+ save? Then if he wanted to use his hand weapon a 2+?

Posted By colonel584 on 10/15/2006 2:56 AM
If i had a captain with, Full plate, shield, 2h Would he have a 3+ save? Then if he wanted to use his hand weapon a 2+?

1 - Yes

2 - Yes, assuming the shield and weapon are both mundane (ie, not magical)

So pretty much give everyone able to take one, a shield?
For 3-6 points (lord or hero) a +1 armour save isn't bad.

Posted By colonel584 on 10/15/2006 6:02 PM
So pretty much give everyone able to take one, a shield?
For 3-6 points (lord or hero) a +1 armour save isn't bad.

Depends. Models/units that are equiped with two-handed weapons or two hand weapons can't use shields in close combat and may or may not have enough armor to make it worthwhile vs. missile fire. Plus, since combat characters are best inside a unit, and therefore are unlikely to be exposed to separate missle fire, it may be an unneeded point sink if he has a weapon precluding the use of the sheild in close combat.