Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Well, the relic affects scytheguard same as d-cannon wraithguard. And the stratagem is enhancing the Spiritseer's aura which already did nothing for scytheguard.

I'm pretty excited for Spiritseers in any kind of Eldar army. Whether or not Warlocks become worthwhile, a Primaris Psyker equivalent with 12 powers to choose from has got to be worth taking multiples of, and this makes it much easier to fill out detachments since index Eldar have a very hard time finding more than a couple of good HQs. You can always find a use for Conceal. And the new Empower is significantly better than Enhance for most units, since Eldar tend to hit on 3s and wound on 5s.

There are still 2 pairs of runes of battle powers that we don't know about. Maybe we'll even get +1/-1 to saves.

D3 S10 AP-4 auto-hits per model is pretty strong yeah, especially as a charge deterrent. There's little they're not good against and with 3" disembark, 5" move, D6" advance and 8" range they have a surprising threat range.

momerathe wrote:

xmbk wrote:
My first thought is that Iyanden may end up not being the best choice for Wraith units. Nice for vehicles, but the Craftworld buffs are underwhelming.

Look out for whichever craftworld gets the inevitable deepstrike stratagem..

Which will be Ulthwe and it will be called "Webway Assault", just like the 7th ed rules for Black Guardians. We will see in tomorrow's article, I guess

So we will end up with CW rules that make Wraiths best when not Iyanden and Windriders will be best when not Saim-Hann. Thanx GW

-

 Galef wrote:

momerathe wrote:

xmbk wrote:
My first thought is that Iyanden may end up not being the best choice for Wraith units. Nice for vehicles, but the Craftworld buffs are underwhelming.

Look out for whichever craftworld gets the inevitable deepstrike stratagem..

Which will be Ulthwe and it will be called "Webway Assault", just like the 7th ed rules for Black Guardians

So we will end up with CW rules that make Wraiths best when not Iyanden and Windriders will be best when not Saim-Hann. Thanx GW

-

So you've seen what all the craftworlds do? Please share!

 Cream Tea wrote:

Spoiler:

 Galef wrote:

momerathe wrote:

xmbk wrote:
My first thought is that Iyanden may end up not being the best choice for Wraith units. Nice for vehicles, but the Craftworld buffs are underwhelming.

Look out for whichever craftworld gets the inevitable deepstrike stratagem..

Which will be Ulthwe and it will be called "Webway Assault", just like the 7th ed rules for Black Guardians

So we will end up with CW rules that make Wraiths best when not Iyanden and Windriders will be best when not Saim-Hann. Thanx GW

-

So you've seen what all the craftworlds do? Please share!

No, just a fairly well informed guess based on
A) Black guardians are still on the Website. Since these are no different than their basic counterparts, it implies that <Black Gaurdians> will exist in the Codex.
B) The last bit in the Iyanden faction focus specifically says tomorrow will cover Ulthwe AND Black Guardians
C) "Drop in"/"Deep Strike" abilities are rampant across many armies right now....except Eldar....who have Webway portals in the fluff, particularly Ulthwe
D) The 7th ed Black Gaurdians from the Gathering Storm II had the ability to Deep Strike anyway on the board 9" away from enemies. So BGs had an 8E rule before 8E.
E) Space Marine White Scars are "the" biker Chapter, yet Bikes are better off using literally any other <Chapter Tactic>

-

I'm not at all convinced that there will be Black Guardians as their own unit, but I could certainly believe that GW will say they're representing Black Guardians by giving Ulthwe a stratagem that lets Guardians deep strike or whatever.

This would actually be very powerful. Guardians shoot very well for their cost. Being able to drop 20 of them in front of a horde would go a long way towards making them viable outside of a Serpent, and it'd be even nicer if they got a small price cut.

Dionysodorus wrote:
I'm not at all convinced that there will be Black Guardians as their own unit, but I could certainly believe that GW will say they're representing Black Guardians by giving Ulthwe a stratagem that lets Guardians deep strike or whatever.

This would actually be very powerful. Guardians shoot very well for their cost. Being able to drop 20 of them in front of a horde would go a long way towards making them viable outside of a Serpent, and it'd be even nicer if they got a small price cut.

I agree that it will be a Stratagem. I also think it will only apply to units with the <Guardian> keyword, thus being able to be used on Windriders too (and possibly War Walkers and Vypers? I don't have my Index handy to check)

In any case, I think the most competitive Eldar lists will most likely have several Detachments, each form a different CW, to maximize effectiveness on units.

-

 ph34r wrote:
Are scythe wraith guard considered best at this time?

Pretty much. For an extra 5 points, they are only slightly weaker against large single targets and better against anything that comes in squads. They also have the scariest Overwatch in the game and can give a nasty shock to any fliers that make the mistake of getting too close (they won't do it again ).

The only thing that would make me consider Cannon Guard would be a Stratagem allowing me to DS a unit 9" away from the enemy since by definition that would be useless on Scytheguard. They would be useful for an alpha strike against a large target.

Just hoping that they keep their "Implacable" rule from the Index.

There's no unit in the index with the <GUARDIAN> keyword. Not even Guardians, as they either have <GUARDIAN DEFENDERS> or <STORM GUARDIANS>.

 Redemption wrote:
There's no unit in the index with the <GUARDIAN> keyword. Not even Guardians, as they either have <GUARDIAN DEFENDERS> or <STORM GUARDIANS>.

True. that's a memory fail on my part.
But still, the Stratagem could call out Windriders, Guardians (both kinds), War Walkers and Vypers. The important thing is that it isn't <Ulthwe Infantry> as not only would that make 3/4 of the Black Guardian sets on the website redundant (arguably they are already, but that is beside the point), but it would also be WAAAAAAAY too powerful.
Imagine Wraithguard (with cannons), Fire Dragons or other Aspect units using this Stratagem. I cannot imagine any other CW trait/stratagem being even close to this. Suddenly every Eldar list will be from Ulthwe.

-

I mean, Fire Dragons that deep strike would just be a slightly more expensive version of Scion Command Squads with melta guns. Guardians actually do strike me as the infantry unit (other than maybe FW Shadow Spectres) that benefits most from a deep strike stratagem. With the others you don't feel too bad about paying for a Wave Serpent to get them where you want them, but this feels wasteful for Guardians, and you could then take a bigger squad to get more for your CP.

Dionysodorus wrote:
I mean, Fire Dragons that deep strike would just be a slightly more expensive version of Scion Command Squads with melta guns. Guardians actually do strike me as the infantry unit (other than maybe FW Shadow Spectres) that benefits most from a deep strike stratagem. With the others you don't feel too bad about paying for a Wave Serpent to get them where you want them, but this feels wasteful for Guardians, and you could then take a bigger squad to get more for your CP.

Particularly as their may be a recycling stratagem like chaos and IG have. Webway Reinforcements, or something. Guardian squad is removed and returns on a table edge. Have a big Guardian squad, with Iyanden morale durability, and the ability to recycle. Might be a pretty tough and annoying little unit. May even make guardians worth taking.

I wonder if they will do anything to make Dire Avengers worth taking.

 Galef wrote:

 Cream Tea wrote:

Spoiler:

 Galef wrote:

momerathe wrote:

xmbk wrote:
My first thought is that Iyanden may end up not being the best choice for Wraith units. Nice for vehicles, but the Craftworld buffs are underwhelming.

Look out for whichever craftworld gets the inevitable deepstrike stratagem..

Which will be Ulthwe and it will be called "Webway Assault", just like the 7th ed rules for Black Guardians

So we will end up with CW rules that make Wraiths best when not Iyanden and Windriders will be best when not Saim-Hann. Thanx GW

-

So you've seen what all the craftworlds do? Please share!

No, just a fairly well informed guess based on
A) Black guardians are still on the Website. Since these are no different than their basic counterparts, it implies that <Black Gaurdians> will exist in the Codex.
B) The last bit in the Iyanden faction focus specifically says tomorrow will cover Ulthwe AND Black Guardians
C) "Drop in"/"Deep Strike" abilities are rampant across many armies right now....except Eldar....who have Webway portals in the fluff, particularly Ulthwe
D) The 7th ed Black Gaurdians from the Gathering Storm II had the ability to Deep Strike anyway on the board 9" away from enemies. So BGs had an 8E rule before 8E.
E) Space Marine White Scars are "the" biker Chapter, yet Bikes are better off using literally any other <Chapter Tactic>

-

Pretty much spot on, also we'll probably see army wide spotlights based on craftworld rules on the same way they told those for the guard.

We know Wraiths got extra T with Iyanden maybe tomorrow we'll know another army wide buff based on guardians, bikes and grav tanks ones with Saim -Hann , Aspects one with Biel Tan spotlights as example.

Lord Perversor wrote:

 Galef wrote:

 Cream Tea wrote:

Spoiler:

 Galef wrote:

momerathe wrote:

xmbk wrote:
My first thought is that Iyanden may end up not being the best choice for Wraith units. Nice for vehicles, but the Craftworld buffs are underwhelming.

Look out for whichever craftworld gets the inevitable deepstrike stratagem..

Which will be Ulthwe and it will be called "Webway Assault", just like the 7th ed rules for Black Guardians

So we will end up with CW rules that make Wraiths best when not Iyanden and Windriders will be best when not Saim-Hann. Thanx GW

-

So you've seen what all the craftworlds do? Please share!

No, just a fairly well informed guess based on
A) Black guardians are still on the Website. Since these are no different than their basic counterparts, it implies that <Black Gaurdians> will exist in the Codex.
B) The last bit in the Iyanden faction focus specifically says tomorrow will cover Ulthwe AND Black Guardians
C) "Drop in"/"Deep Strike" abilities are rampant across many armies right now....except Eldar....who have Webway portals in the fluff, particularly Ulthwe
D) The 7th ed Black Gaurdians from the Gathering Storm II had the ability to Deep Strike anyway on the board 9" away from enemies. So BGs had an 8E rule before 8E.
E) Space Marine White Scars are "the" biker Chapter, yet Bikes are better off using literally any other <Chapter Tactic>

-

Pretty much spot on, also we'll probably see army wide spotlights based on craftworld rules on the same way they told those for the guard.

We know Wraiths got extra T with Iyanden maybe tomorrow we'll know another army wide buff based on guardians, bikes and grav tanks ones with Saim -Hann , Aspects one with Biel Tan spotlights as example.

I read it as Wraiths got an extra T in general not just with Iyanden. Which would be much better in my opinion.

Yeah, about WS, my buddy has SW and we both agree it needs to be re-worked... its terrible.

But i cant wait to see the next CWE info, i want WWP/DS stuff.

pm713 wrote:

I read it as Wraiths got an extra T in general not just with Iyanden. Which would be much better in my opinion.

It was pretty clear that they got extra toughness in general.

If they made the difference between Iyanden and non-Iyanden wraiths too big, either one would be overpowered or the other would be underpowered. I'd prefer wraiths were viable with any craftworld, but better with Iyanden without being broken.

Yes it is clear... it says "the New codex gets xyz changes" not Iyanden.

 Galef wrote:

 Redemption wrote:
There's no unit in the index with the <GUARDIAN> keyword. Not even Guardians, as they either have <GUARDIAN DEFENDERS> or <STORM GUARDIANS>.

True. that's a memory fail on my part.

At the risk of being one on mine, however, don't the relevant units all share WARHOST? Although I'm not sure if that doesn't also include the tanks...

Pilum wrote:

 Galef wrote:

 Redemption wrote:
There's no unit in the index with the <GUARDIAN> keyword. Not even Guardians, as they either have <GUARDIAN DEFENDERS> or <STORM GUARDIANS>.

True. that's a memory fail on my part.

At the risk of being one on mine, however, don't the relevant units all share WARHOST? Although I'm not sure if that doesn't also include the tanks...

Warhost it's common to all units like guardians and tanks, while Spirit host it's for wraith units.

The biggest issue it's that the sneak peek on Iyanden relic shows a whole new Keyword (Wraith construct) wich is brand new, so we can't be fully sure how much of current others remain unchanged.

Ulthwe is up: Community

Kinda meh, but the stratagems look strong. They're pushing guardians quite a lot.

Mind war still looks situational and likely not as good as smite, but it could be clutch in certain match ups.

No webway assault is surprising.

Colgado wrote:
No webway assault is surprising.

They didn't mention it in the article, but on the facebook page someone asked about the webway assault. The response from the warhammer team was "We're on Twitch talking about the Codex on Friday, with some exclusive new content about the Codex (quite possibly including Webway portal)."

Interesting. Could be an Alaitoc stratagem, I find it unlikely (but not impossible) it would be an army wide strat.

Also, I noticed they mentioned the Autarch's path of command ability has been reworked. Maybe re-roll 1 to wound?

The more I think about it, 20 man guardian squads look pretty dangerous. The 4+ invulnerable is strong, with Iyanden for morale, or Ulthwe for 6+ fnp and the +1 hit guardians suddenly got a lot more durable/potent. Conceal from warlocks and other psychic buffs help too.

Colgado wrote:
Also, I noticed they mentioned the Autarch's path of command ability has been reworked. Maybe re-roll 1 to wound?

I think it was left out initially, because I missed it too, but there is a picture of the ability now. It's re roll 1s to hit still, but also you can get CP back on a roll of 6.

Told ya Wraithguard wouldn't be Iyanden.


Mind War and Celestial Shield are both nice.

Not seeing anything that would make me want to take Craftworld over Ynnair yet, assuming that Ynnari loose the Craftworld traits.

Anyone else notic they talked about hemlocks giving -2 ld? That would be pretty great.
Glad guardians got a boost. Hitting on 2s out of wave serpents and 4+ inv in a pinch are both useful.
Free spirit stones for everyone is pretty rad as well. Saves a chunk of points on mech eldar and will make some units super annoying to shift. Tho kind of makes fortune redundant.
Plus a point reduction on eldrad is nice.

Moosatronic Warrior wrote:
Not seeing anything that would make me want to take Craftworld over Ynnair yet, assuming that Ynnari loose the Craftworld traits.

Agreed. Unless they are playing pretty close to the chest with some very cool stratagems, the Craftworld attributes are pretty yawnworthy. And they specifically mention the Ulthwe one being the "most versatile"...which makes me think the other three will be hyper specific to one kind of unit, much like Iyanden with wraiths. Honestly I'm just super disappointed Altansar didn't make the cut, especially considering their role in the whole Gathering Storm/Ynnead plot. I mean Guard got rules for a bunch of regiments...some that there aren't even model support for...sigh.

Overall if Craftworlds don't get some sort of webway/deepstrike ability I can't see them being used over Ynnari in a competitive setting, and for me not so much in a fluffy or fun one either. I'll just run my Altansar guys and gals as Ynnari and call it a day. But we'll see what the next previews bring...

Disappointing the ignore wound role cannot be used in addition to Spirit Stones etc. Means a Wraithfighter currently has to pay 10 points for Spirit Stones it gains no benefit from.

It's possible, although I won't hold my breath, that Webway portals become a Stratagem for all Aeldari, albeit in the form of separate stratagems for each faction.
For example, CWE could get Webway Assault, DE could get Webway Portals or some such.
If these are faction wide, I would be incredibly happy. I thought for sure the Ulthwe would get it as a stratagem, but unless they are getting several and not revealing them all, it does not look like it.

Several armies have received deployment shenanigans and I would be severely disappointed if Eldar, the army that has always had unique ways to deploy, do not. Especially since this edition in particular seems to highly favor this tactic.

Drake003 wrote:
Disappointing the ignore wound role cannot be used in addition to Spirit Stones etc. Means a Wraithfighter currently has to pay 10 points for Spirit Stones it gains no benefit from.

The easy fix here is to take all your Hemlocks in a Flyer detachment that is Iyanden, or Alaitoc, and the rest of you army as Ulthwe.

-

Galef, that would mean having to take 3 flyers though. Unless they get a points reduction I won't be getting a 3rd due to that being a nigh on 3rd of my points on flyers, which due to boots on the ground rule, is not where I want to be.

So far 2 Hemlocks has worked well for me.

Appreciate the thought though, have to see how things pan out.. so far, other than Eldrad himself, I am not sold on Ulthwe..