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Its only tons of fun when you do it to people who rely way too much on lv2 and 3 tech. not a lot of good players where I come from. The good ones moved to 40k and blood bowl (im still not sure why). If I get beat then Ill come back with a 3050 medium. If I get beat again Ill come back with a Viper. If I get beat again I complement a superior player(or a luckier one).

I always played on hex maps, and while some guys (myself included) enjoyed painting our favorite mechs, we didn't make much of a big deal about it. FASA never incorporated any kind of WYSIWYG back in the origional box set (they weren't so hung up on constantly updating rules either, just a pick of a few tech levels... that's why FASA went out of business...)

But I digress. The point is, Btech is much more of a math problem to be solved and real number crunching of probability, with no ambiguities involved. This makes it much harder to be 'good' at it. It takes a very mathematical mind to excell at this game, far beyond what they call 'Mathhammer' (which is ambiguous and then some).

Btech players would scoff at so-called mathhammer. That is why people don't play it much any more, or play the dumbed down 'new' battletech instead, which is marketted more like a collectable miniatures game and as such will likely not go bankrupt like its predecessor. Last I saw they would sell Mechs in the same way old Magic Card decks were doled out, with a random mix of some rare stuff, some common stuff. Far better marketing than giving out cardboard counters and hex maps in an all-in-one boxed set.

Lets face it, giant killer robots are just cool and a fun idea in the first place, but the game is less 'shove toys around and roll dice' kind of fun and more 'lets determiine probability curves' kind of fun, just using giant killer robots as the medium for said fun. Now I find playing around with complex probability to be fun. I imagine it is not as appealing to a young crowd who grow up thinking battletech is a video game. That is why our numbers are dwindling.

Hmmmm, 3025 Company with no repeats. Guess it would be:

Assault/Command/Combat Lance
Awesome
Battlemaster
Hunchback
Grasshopper

A PPC monster, good solid general mech, 'zone of death' mech and my favorite laser skirmisher of the era.

Fire Support Lance
Catapult
Archer
Griffin
Panther

Good LRM output for when making good probability shots. PPC's for added support and for long shots and lots of close range firepower still.

Recon/Skirmish/Pursuit Lance

Cicada
Jenner
Spider
Assassin

I just like speed as a means of defense, going for the rear armour shots etc.

Wow that pursuit lance is wicked fast. You guys already know my opinion of Cicadas though, but I don't think (other than their Locust cousin) there are any more mechs over 6/9 that I can recall. I have noticed that everyone takes an Awesome in their lists. That's cool. Hence the name. Grasshopper seems to be appearing a lot too. I guess we all think alike about these guys.

*cough* No Awesome in mine.

Ok 3025 multi-role company straight from the original book

Command Lance
Four heavy bruiser mechs, group speed 3/5, emphasis on long range through to short range closing fire with some flanking support from the Hunchback when ranges close.

Banshee -S reduced engine, extra weaponry: 3/5 speed, 21 heat sinks, 2x PPCn 4x M Laser, 2x S Laser, SRM6, AC10
Stalker a favourite dual range mech, exellent long or short range punch with low heat in bracket
Thunderbolt solid armament excellent all rounder
Hunchback AC/20 on legs

Support Lance
Four slow jump capable mechs, group speed 4/6/4. variety of engagement ranges, opposide of the Command klance the heaviest mech is the flanking or point force. This entire lance can act as a hammer to the Command lances anvil because the heavier designs are split between the two.

Victor point fighter, weight, armour, AC/20, jump jets, reasonable speed
Grasshopper good firepower mobility and heat curve
Catapult archtypical fire support mech, can switch to laser infighter too
Panther no frill cheap support mech, makes up the numbers and stays out of the way

Scout Lance
Split into three elements. The Quickdraw and Jenner are counterscout units and an ambushing force. TheVulcan is a rearguard and anti vehicle/infantry mech with ecclectic armament for odd usage. The Locust is a speed machine to get in scout and out. Technically the Vulcan and Locust are paired together. I could replace the Locust with an Assassin but that would be too easy.

Quickdraw heavy for a scout, not to fast but jumpable and a real bully of enemy scouts
Jenner direct support for the Quickdraw, good firepower on a fast chassis
Vulcan infantry swatter and rearguard
Locust fast cheap scout mech

Man this is tempting me to break out the old starter set and give it a go.

No duplicates? OK. Level 1 Company:

Command: Four PPCs and an LRM20 to keep the opposition honest. One jump capable mech acting as a bodyguard if things get too personal.
Atlas
Awesome
Battlemaster
Grasshopper

Support: Three out of four are jump capable. LRMs + PPCs is the name of the game
Archer
Catapult
Griffin
Vindicator

Recon: Everybody jumps. Long range firepower is limited to a single LLAS, but this is a recon lance after all.
Phoenix Hawk
Jenner
Firestarter
(Fire )Javelin

I tried to avoid the more "esoteric" and rare possibilities. This decision dropped things like Highlanders and Thugs from the selection.

Guitardian wrote:Wow that pursuit lance is wicked fast. You guys already know my opinion of Cicadas though, but I don't think (other than their Locust cousin) there are any more mechs over 6/9 that I can recall. I have noticed that everyone takes an Awesome in their lists. That's cool. Hence the name. Grasshopper seems to be appearing a lot too. I guess we all think alike about these guys.

At 3025 tech there's only so many designs that are worthwhile if you want to make a really strong lance. The ideal tech level, I think, is 3050 IS, because you have more options, and the presence of Endo Steel and FerroFibrous makes light mechs able to do so much more. Once you hit Clan tech it becomes too easy, and every Mech can do everything too well.

A solid 3025 company? I can do that pretty easily. With a bit of good ol' Kurita flair:

Light Lance:
Jenner
Jenner
Panther
Clint

Strike Lance:
Whitworth
Shadow Hawk-K
Grand Dragon
Phoenix Hawk-K

Assault Lance:
Catapult-K
Archer
Warhammer
Orion

Highly mobile, long range, and very supportive of each other. A great company NOT using the best designs of the time.

Pssst...No duplicate mechs

skyth wrote:Pssst...No duplicate mechs

I'll just use both Jenner variants.

Just for fun I was looking up some old pics on Sarna.net and getting nostalgiac... I figured I would put together the Company (3025 style... origional 2H/1M/1L format) lances of the WORST mechs I could think of. Just for fun I tried out a couple of variations but here's what I ended up with:

Banshee (way underarmed for its hugeness)
Jagermech (armor issues and AC2s)
Hermes II (stupid weapons choices, AC/5 on 40 tons?)
Stinger (machineguns on a 20 tonner? I'd rather have a bit more armor and an extra ML

Cyclops (too little armor for its size)
Quickdraw (actually not bad, but it does have heat issues and armor issues)
Cicada (just a big heavy locust)
Ostscout (1 medium laser won't do squat no matter how fast you are)

Charger (yeah... um... duh)
Rifleman (heat and armor and ammo problems)
Vulcan (really stupid for fighting other mechs. flamer and AC/2?? oh dear..)
Urbanmech (urbanwreck)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Now imagine being put in charge of any one of those lances and having to square against this:

Awesome
Grasshopper
Griffin
Panther

Even if they get all 6/4 pilots and you get all 4/3 what a nightmare. The worst lance ever versus the worst pilots ever challenge. I have half a mind to run that mechwar simulation program to see how it turns out.

Here are two of my Companies in 3025 tech

House Kurita

Command/Fire Lance
-Archer ARC-2S
-Warhammer [PPC x2, MG x7, 22 HS]
-Thunderbolt TDR-5S
-Rifleman RFL-3N

Medium/Recon Lance
-Panther PNT-9R
-Wolverine
-Vulcan VL-2T
-Jenner [ML x4, LRM-5]

Striker/Recon Lance
-Grand Dragon DRG-1G
-Charger CGR-1A1
-Centurion CN9-AH
-Locust LCT-1M-A [LRM-5 x2, +1 Ton Armor]

I know that there is supposed to be no duplicates, but my alternate Striker Lance is the 3 of the LRM Jenners and the Vulcan

My Pro-Davion Mercenaries

Command Lance
-Alliance ALI-1A
-Recon Battlemaster [PPC x1, ML x6, SRM-6, Heat Sinks x17, Jump Jets x3]
-Goliath [3/5 Move, AC/20, LRM-10 x2, MG x8]
-Catapult [LRM-15 x1, SRM-6 x1, ML x6, SL x2, MG x2]

Heavy Combat Lance
-Marauder MAD-3R
-Warhammer WHM-6R
-Rifleman RFL-3N
-Blackjack BJ-1

Recon Lance
-Phoenix Hawk LAM [PPC x1, ML x2]
-Assassin ASN-101 [Usually armed with Infernos]
-Commando [ML x1, SL x10]
-Locust LCT-1S [Usually armed with Infernos]

No offense, but that heavy combat lance is actually pretty bad. Horrible heat issues, horrible armor issues, and pretty much identical combat ranges.

Swap the Rifleman for a Crusader. Then you get some indirect support. If you are pro-Davion, take the Davion Warhammer. Armor and heat sinks are good. And take pretty much any variant of the Marauder over the 3R. Let us combine a poorly armored torso with a SINGLE crit of ammo. Good plan, 'Mech designers...

I have won for 2 decades with that combination. Besides I do better with the Rifleman than the Crusader, I even beat a Zues in a one on one duel with the 3N

By the way, did you ever test that Card initiative system again?

Ive played with it and it works best when we all know what we are playing in advance.
We have also played using the 40k system and I want to try it with the Battlefield: Evolution System

Seemed to work well when we tried it, just too bad I had to leave for work before we could finish the game.

The only battletech mini's I still own are a lance of Pheonix Hawk LAM.

Lovely units and great fun. Guess I am dating myself a bit though.

Dating yourself is owning a copy of BattleDroids

Ahh, yes, Battledroids. Ten mech designs... all of which now are 'unseen.' Just one Autocannon. Not AC/5, just Autocannon. But most of the rules there are still used in the modern version. A remarkably stable game, all said and done.

Well let's see here is what I'd take for a company.

Command/Fire Lance

BattleMaster BLR-1G
Zeus ZEU-6T
Thunderbolt TDR-5S
Warhammer WHM-6D

Heavy Calvary

Griffin GRG-1S
Shadow Hawk SHD-2H
Wolverine WVR-6K
Trebuchet TBT-5N

Light Calvary

Wolfhound WLF-1
Phoenix Hawk PXH-1D
Jenner JR7-D
Spider SDR-5V

Ah the Wolfie possibly my favorite mech...

Vulcan wrote:Ahh, yes, Battledroids. Ten mech designs... all of which now are 'unseen.' Just one Autocannon. Not AC/5, just Autocannon. But most of the rules there are still used in the modern version. A remarkably stable game, all said and done.

The original Battletech game only had an Autocannon also.

dragonfire wrote:
Ah the Wolfie possibly my favorite mech...

Would that be the Wolverine or the Wolfhound?

Wolfhound, I'm sure. Great little mech there Definitely one of my favorites.

The wolfhound is a solid anti-scout mech.

Wolverine is a heck of a mech too.

Battle tech is so stable that mech designs in the original box set are still legal and playable.

I'd say he was talking about the Wolfhound as well as design wise I find it to be a far better design than the Wolverine IMO (though I find that one solid as well) but hey, some people are wild about Urban Mechs!

There was a wolverine that switched out the kinda-dumb AC/5 for a LL and some sinks that seriously kicked some butt. I think it was the Marik one, but my book is long gone.

Here's another fun one: make a company out of the origional 14 Mechs from the 1st ed after Battle droids...
Battlemaster
Marauder
Warhammer
Archer
Thunderbolt
Crusader
Rifleman
Shadowhawk
Griffin
Wolverine
Phoenix Hawk
Wasp
Stinger
Locust

Now according to origional rules, each lance consists of 1 light, 1 medium, and 2 heavy, totalling 6 heavy, 3 mid, 3 light. That was considered standard comapny format. These were the most fun games we played back when I was in middle school, but its better to reconfigure the lances as to purpose...

So I got this one:
ASSAULT
Marauder
Battlemaster
Warhammer
Thunderbolt

FIRE
Archer
Crusader
Rifleman
Locust

AUX

Griffin
Wolverine
Wasp
Stinger

I played this off on mechwar simulater (sarna.net) against a star of various sized clan omnimech and it actually won.

Guitardian wrote:Now according to origional rules, each lance consists of 1 light, 1 medium, and 2 heavy.

I thought it was 1 light, 2 medium and 1 heavy. The medium class mech is the workhorse of the inner sphere. Granted, I've long ago misplaced my original copy....