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too true same here^^

or as said in wow: gz for your tacs^^

vik

dont know the valks measurements...

'Coz I'm getting from amera plastic mouldings:
2 Trench (short) sections.
1 trench (end) section.
1 trench bunker section.
1 trench (T-junction) section.
1 bastion stonghold.
1 landing pad.

But before I get that lot:
1x CH JP's £11
1x 30cm 2mm plasticard rod £3.36
1x razorback £20
1x DKoK commissar £10
1x Engineer squad £20
1x Hades breaching drill £26
1x Cadian battleforce £50
3x pig iron "kolony militia covered helmet head sprues" £13.50
1x pig iron "kolony HQ head sprue" £4.50
3x cadian shock troop squads- £45
1x assault squad £18.50

So by that time I'll have 5 infrantry squads (blob), a PCS, general-commissar, 5 engineers, a hades breaching drill, a sentinel, 3 heavy weapons teams, 5 assault marines, a rhino, lots of silencers and a finished sanguinary guard squad. This'll mean that my BA army will be 90% finished and my DKoK army will be 90% finished. 50 guardsmen will be able to fill a 4' trenchworks, wouldn't it?

Oh yeah- 3 tactical marines and sarge built. These guys are for the 5-man squad, who have silencers and scopes- the snipers of my army. Even the sarge's bolt pistol has a silencer.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
My BA army (after I build my other 11 marines and buy the razorback, assault squad and falchion) will hit 3000pts by april-currently at 1880.
My DKoK army will hit 2000pts by summer- currently at 960pts.
Then with the trenchworks it'll be filled with infrantry squads and heavy weapons teams, while the CCS are in the bastion behind and are backed up by the two attached super-heavies and a veteran squad from the steel legion accompanied by yarrick. BA tactical squad pushing down the right in a rhino, sternguard and SM CCS in the ursus pushing down the left. Sanguinary guard and vanguard veterans swoop in and the remaining 5-man "sniper" squad take up positions in the bunker alongside the PCS. With a pair of LR's either side of the bastion. The two sentinels will attract fire down the middle, bodyguarding 3 cyclops demolition vehicles.

i am lost do you mix your DKOK with your BA SMs? in what kind of game exept a Apoc game would that work? or do i miss something important here?

by the way i hope you have enough storage room to yourself for that mass of plastics on you...^^

and by the way how much would be 4` in cm? and boy your in deep trouble to ahve to do 50 IGs to paint, that will take ages or are you going the armypainter road for them?

and couldyou link the heads you mentioned before? i think i know them but i am not sure...if i am right they might be the nongoodlooking ones tho...

vik

okay- apoc. allied DKoK & SM.
about 120cm in 4'.
maybe a spraygun.
swapping the normal cadian heads for pig iron heads.
CCS/PCS/sergeants- http://www.pig-iron-productions.com/hd12-kolony-hq-head-sprues-p-20.html
others- http://www.pig-iron-productions.com/hd10-kolony-militia-covered-helmet-head-sprues-p-19.html
If I haven't got the storge...*dramatic pause*...I'll make storage. ^^
I've seen the PI heads on cadians- they look good.

yep i see you got yourself some good looking ones. though i as myself why you go the full distance and keep buying GW stuff with those heads and not go instead on buying some boxes of wargames factory stormtroopers like shaso has in his thread, they come way cheaper...

and i guess 50 could work...but i guess you cant say here that on average you have at each 2.2 cm a trooper, you will get some nasty beg gaps there, dont you think so? i would think about adding a few more footsloggers more...if you want to fill the gaps...

and i dont know about a spray gun, i worked only with brushes for now, so if you do your bettern me^^

vik

But I think the spraygun's a bit pricey- It's like £40 just for it and one paint pot.
There are about 40" worth of inner trench, but If we count the 4 corner (about 3" worth for 2), then we have 46", then the extra bit for the T-junction, then you have about 54" worth. Since a base is 1", we have it covered. Since the trench's width is 2", that still leaves room for models to maneuvre and run around in, without having to move other units.
where the models (SM and DKoK) will go:
CCS- bastion behind the trenches to issue orders but be safe.
PCS- bunker in the trenches to issue orders but be safe.
infrantry- filling in the trenches.
"sniper" SM squad- in another bunker to have a good view and be safe. This will be next to the bunker/behind it, I haven't decided.
cyclops- in front of the trenches, next to the bunker.
operators- in the bunker with the PCS.
heavy weapons- in the T-junction leading to the bunker.
LR's- either side of the bastion.
sentinels- diagonally to the cyclops to bodyguard them.

This army will be around 5,000pts with probably a minefield in front of the trenches. I have modelled into the board a small trenchworks measuring around 12", with another 12" line behind it. This also has a bunker modelled into it. maybe a devastator squad and infrantry squad can go there, backed up by yarrick and his veterans.

Not to be a downer or anything, but you might want to read these threads before investing in cheap death korps, it really reflects people's experiences when building budget great coats.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/332401.page#2220704.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/337675.page

Fafnir wrote:Don't do it. Make a different army. You can make greatcoat guard, that's fine, but don't try to call them Krieg. That will just end up with them always being compared to better models (because, let's face it, Krieg are some of the best models GW/FW ever released). As harsh as it sounds, you will only find failure if you try to be cheap about Krieg.

WFG models apparently don't work for kreig.
buying the DKoK gorgon guys requires GS skills to split up.
The best method I've found for cheap DKoK is PI heads on cadians. All the others wither don't look like them or are too big.

Well, the point of the threads was that non krieg models will never be krieg models, so before wasting money on gas mask troops and calling them krieg may be a bit dissapointing.

Just wanted to give you this heads up before blowing a whole load of money on things you expect to be krieg, but will never be krieg.

I'll try and get some kreig models, but since I get £5 a week, blowing £175 on a blob guard unit is a bit much.
I'm gonna buy one cadian box and one PI head sprue and try it out. If I like it, I'll do it. If I don't, I'll ask a friend if he can split a DKoK gorgon troop lot into individuals.

hmm. Shall I give my chaplain an assault cannon? That'd be so cool...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Moving away from cheap alternatives for DKoK and my trench board, Here are the rules for my 5-man sniper team:
Sniper squad- 175pts.
Marine- WS4 BS5 S4 T4 W1 I4 A1 Ld8 Sv 3+
Sergeant- WS5 BS5 S4 T4 I4 A2 Ld9 Sv 3+

Unit composition- 4 marines with bolt-rifles, one sergeant with chainsword and modified bolt pistol.
SPECIAL RULES:
stealth
assassins- when shooting, the controlling player allocates the wounds.
infiltrate
move through cover

WARGEAR:
Bolt pistols
bolt-rifles- S4, AP4, Range 36", type- rapid fire, rending.
bolt pistol MOD- S4, AP4, Range 18", type- pistol, rending.

OPTIONS- Sergeant may replace chainsword and/or bolt pistol MOD for:
Power sword- 15pts
Lightning claw- 15pts
Power fist- 30pts
plasma pistol- 5pts
may take meltabombs- 5pts
locator beacon- 20pts

Mine's gonna have a power weapon.

Vanilla scouts have the Scout rule and your's dont? and a sniper rifle is better than a Bolt Rifle IMO, it always wounds on a 4+. I'd stick with normal sniper rifles.

basically it's a sternguard squad (125), with kraken bolts but can't change it (105), rending (115), move through cover (120), stealth (130), +6" range (kraken has 30")(140), infiltrate (150), +1BS (165), allocate wounds (175).
max- 0-3 per army.

DATASHEET TIME!!!
Raven hunters- 50pts + models
1 lycaeus falchion
1-3 sniper squads
2-5 scout squads

tank hunters- all models in this datasheet have the tank hunters special rule, prefered enemy and meltabombs.

Death korps seige masters- 500pts + models.
2-5 infrantry squads
1-3 engineer squads
1 CCS
1 PCS

seige masters- the controlling player gains the bunkers and minefields strategic assets. This must be taken in place of the player's normal strategic asset.
fortify- controlling player gains the bolster defences special rule.
trench warfare- If the controlling player possesses the scenery he may organise a trenchworks in his deployment zone. This may be as large as (s)he likes, so long as he has enough trenches.

thoughts to the new stuff?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Nulipuli2 wrote:Vanilla scouts have the Scout rule and your's dont? and a sniper rifle is better than a Bolt Rifle IMO, it always wounds on a 4+. I'd stick with normal sniper rifles.

they aren't technically scouts- just scouts that never grew up .
should I make it always wound on a 4+ and make it AP5?
and the reason behind no snipers is:
If I wanted sniper units, I'd take scouts with snipers.
The models are bolters with silencers and scopes. They don't look as sleek as snipers.

you just gave them Uber-Angelus Bolters, make 'em wound on a 4+ or give them special ammunition... although then they'll be exactly like sternguard. Also, has it come to your mind to give them old 3rd edition targeters?

to the Datasheets:
Raven Hunters seem fine
Death korps of krieg siege masters cost way too much points and make the Trench system so it has a limit on how big it can be, nobody likes his enemy deploy in a 3+ cover trench...
just my thoughts.

ah, yeah. I meant the bolster to be on a bunker. Does a trench count as a building?
Revised snipers:
WS4 BS5 S4 T4 A1 I4 W1 Ld8 Sv3+
Sarge WS5 BS5 S4 T4 A2 I4 W1 Ld9 Sv3+

Stealth
move through cover
Infiltrate
Scouts
Crack shots- the controlling player allocates wounds dealt at range by the squad.

MOD bolter- S4, AP5, 36" range, rapid fire, sniper.
MOD bolt pistol- S4 AP5 18" range, pistol, sniper.

Sergeant has MOD bolt pistol and chainsword, marines have MOD boltguns and MOD bolt pistols.

Options- Power sword- 15pts
Plasma pistol- 10pts
Power fist- 25pts
Teleport homer- 10pts
Locator beacon- 20pts

No, a trench doesnt count as a building.
The Sniper squad looks fairly good now, although 175 points for 5 marines? over-costed much? 25 more points and you get 5 Terminators

IIRC bolstered defence works only on ruins.

I'll make this one +1 cover save on a building.
150pts for 5?
tac. squad- 90pts
+wound allocation- 100pts
+sniper rule- 115pts
+12" range- 125pts
move through cover- 130pts
stealth- 140pts
scout/infiltrate (can only do one)- 150pts

they could work with 150.
Lower the points cost on the Siege Master Formation and everythings good to go.

shrike wrote:Death korps seige masters- 300pts + models.
2-5 infrantry squads
1-3 engineer squads
1 CCS
1 PCS

seige masters- the controlling player gains the bunkers and minefields strategic assets. This must be taken in place of the player's normal strategic asset.
fortify- controlling player gains the bolster defences special rule.
trench warfare- If the controlling player possesses the scenery he may organise a trenchworks in his deployment zone. This may be as large as (s)he likes, so long as he has enough trenches.

well, if you have 250pts less than your opponent, you get an asset. Here you get two assets in one, so 500pts-250pts=250pts. The trenchworks is 50pts.

everything needs a litte bit of cheese shrike, around 300-400 points is ok.

Trench warfare is a litte bit OP, i was more thinking along the lines of something close to the Capillery towers, and Planetary digestion (or whatever its called) Tyranid Asset. IIRC theres a formation with storm troopers and valkyries that gives you an asset and 2 special rules, for only 125+ models.

I is confuseded.
So there's a battle formation of an asset and 2 SR's for 125pts, so it should be cheap, but 300-400pts is good?
say the trenchworks is 100pts, go 350 in the middle?
BTW I'll build 5 more marines tomorrow (I would do 10, but I gotta go to a family outing).
My shopping list (in order):
CH JP's
Plasticard rod
razorback
commissar
engineers
hades breaching drill
cadian battleforce
3 pig iron head sprues
cadian shock troops
cadian shock troops
pig iron head sprue
cadian shock troops
engineers
cyclops demolition vehicle
cyclops demo vehicle
cyclops demo vehicle
"cadians" (5 men)
CCS
2 short trench straight sections
bastion
4 trench corner sections
trench T-junction section
trench bunker
libby dread (when it's released)
Falchion (when it's released)
Stormraven (when it's released)
Landing pad (If the stormraven's the right size).


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So over a year's work there.
hmm.
well, my BA army will be up to decent size by february.
So far:
5 sanguinary guards
sanguinary preist
5 devastators
5 "snipers"
10 tac. marines
5 scouts
ursus assault rhino
6 sternguard (inc. Validus)
Lenore
Audax
Praxis
command squad

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m2620180_Imperial_Guard_Datasheet_-_Storm_Trooper_Strike_Force.pdf

nevermind, it costs 150 has an asset and a SR. Still pretty cheap. Yours should cost around 250 maybe.

That SR sounds really cool. I can imagine them rapelling down on ropes, shooting as they go, charging foward, diving head-first into a building and killing it's occpants.
hmm....since I'm getting a general-commissar (lord commissar), a PCS and more than 2 infrantry squads, should I buy a deathstrike and get this:
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1230511a_NEW!_Imperial_Guard_Datasheet_-_Deathstrike_Vortex_Missile
only £30 for filling a 300-point gap! And it's pretty damn good!
Imagine that landing on something like a company of SM's...ouch...

with a 10" blast you'll bound to hit something... and kill it lol.
yea buy the Deathstrike, that vortex will be pretty annoying when its on the enemies side.

Do you reckon I'm making too many rules and SC's?
In this BA army I've made Lenore, Praxis, the "snipers" (name pending), and a sergeant replacement. Am I going OTT?

Oh and these are all of my rules creations:
sergeant Validus
Lenore
Praxis
"snipers"
Chief librarian
chapter master
apoc. datasheet- the raven's talons (basically 4-10 captains, 1 chapter master, 0-1 cheif librarian, 0-3 librarians, 0-1 master of sanctity (rules not complete), 0-3 chaplains.)
apoc. datasheet- the DKoK one.
apoc. datasheet- The raven hunters (maybe shadow hunters?)

its not OTT, i sure wouldnt mind playing them, it adds a little bit of flavour to the game.

re-revised snipers:
WS4 BS5 S4 T4 A1 I4 W1 Ld8 Sv3+
Sarge WS5 BS5 S4 T4 A2 I4 W1 Ld9 Sv3+

Stealth
move through cover
Infiltrate
Scouts
Night vision
Crack shots- the controlling player allocates wounds dealt at range by the squad.

MOD bolter- S4, AP5, 36" range, rapid fire, sniper.
MOD bolt pistol- S4 AP5 18" range, pistol, sniper.

Sergeant has MOD bolt pistol and chainsword, marines have MOD boltguns and MOD bolt pistols.

Options- Power sword- 15pts
lightning claw- 15pts
Plasma pistol- 10pts
Power fist- 25pts
Teleport homer- 10pts
Locator beacon- 20pts

BTW if I fortify a building and a unit with stealth is inside, do I get 2+ cover save?
normal 4+, stealth 3+, bolster 2+?

on a side note how about a sargent either SM or IG with the name Croaks?

that would sound cool...to me at least^^

vik

Yea the guys inside the building would have a 2+ save

Well- my snipers will be in a bolstered bunker then.
pinning, rending, 36" range 4+ to wound boltguns with 2+ cover!
Bunker A (Trench)- PCS, cyclops operators
Bunker B (Homemade trench)- Devastators
Bunker C (out of trench)- Snipers
Bastion- CCS
trenches- 4 infrantry squads, 3 heavy weapons teams
homemade trenches- infrantry squad

what, no more updates?