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He's a Manager of a shop. Handling customers is *kinda* important. If he's bad at that, there's not much going for him, especially if such positions are basically "register jockeys".

GW customer service has been one of the best I've seen. Personally if not for their high prices the company is actually pretty good. Large bit of the flames come from the fact that GW use to be a hobby-centric company back around the era of 4th edition, which compensated somewhat for their prices, but now largely seems to wanna move products, just that their products are more expensive than everyone else.

Kanluwen wrote:He's bad at handling customers. That doesn't make him a bad manager. What with the fact that he's managing a business like...y'know, a business.

He's got a crummy attitude, if what Erudog says is true and someone needs to bring that up to him so he can work on it.

It certianly means he's lacking a pretty crucial skill, especially at a GW shop where the "managers" are also sales reps. I wouldn't hire a great financier that's bad with numbers to do my taxes. You need customer service skills to run a good GW.

Considering most of the people here complain that GW staff are pushy and jerky...yeah, I find it a good example.

Well, but do people say they are bad at their jobs? it's a big difference

That's not true. Most people feel that GW has excellent customer service--when they're replacing products. Not in actually dealing with the customers.

But... isn't this a quesiton about replacing product? Yeah, it can be annoying to game at a GW store when you're badgered to buy what's new, but the fact that they try to hard to, you know, produce customers is actually in line with good customer service.

You've got to seperate the compalints that GW stores are terrible places for vets to treat as a clubhouse, and that GW staff provide poor customer service.

Erudog wrote:Okay, I feel I need to throw my 2 cents in.

I know the manager that the OP talking about, I go to that store from time to time. In fact, I knew the manager he was talking about within the first 2 paragraphs his first post, without the OP even giving any identifying info. I knew it was the same guy, because everything he's said is absolutely true about him.

On that note, I get along really well with him, and he's given me great service there. My only real complaint is that he does not know what he's talking about sometimes when giving advice.

BUT - what the OP said about his attitude/demeanor is absolutely true.

Also, to finally put to rest all the questions on whether he's a bad manager...he has told me himself he has a dozen or so years of managing experience. That's why he was hired in the first place, given that he does not know much, if anything, about the hobby itself. His selling point to GW when they hired him was that he in fact HAS years of experience as a manager. So given all that, is it alright to dismiss this as inexperience and a learning process in the realm of customer service?

this tones it down somewhat, but TBH, he shouldn't be a manager if he doesn't know much.

Kanluwen wrote:

shrike wrote:I think even Kan would agree that chasing them out with a shotgun might possibly be a teeny bit on the harsh side...maybe...
he is bad at managing the store, thus he is a BAD MANAGER.
Are we agreed that he didn't handle things well?
Are we agreed that because of him, the OP will no longer be going to that store?

Yeah, no.

He's bad at handling customers. That doesn't make him a bad manager. What with the fact that he's managing a business like...y'know, a business.

that's half the job- managers need to be:
-friendly
-be able to answer lots of questions (AKA have knowledge of the game).
-be good at running a business.
as far as I can tell, he has little in the way of knowledge and has poor people skills.

Polonius wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:He's bad at handling customers. That doesn't make him a bad manager. What with the fact that he's managing a business like...y'know, a business.

He's got a crummy attitude, if what Erudog says is true and someone needs to bring that up to him so he can work on it.

It certianly means he's lacking a pretty crucial skill, especially at a GW shop where the "managers" are also sales reps. I wouldn't hire a great financier that's bad with numbers to do my taxes. You need customer service skills to run a good GW.

Maybe they got good references from his previous employers? Who knows.

Considering most of the people here complain that GW staff are pushy and jerky...yeah, I find it a good example.

Well, but do people say they are bad at their jobs? it's a big difference

Some do, yeah

That's not true. Most people feel that GW has excellent customer service--when they're replacing products. Not in actually dealing with the customers.

But... isn't this a question about replacing product? Yeah, it can be annoying to game at a GW store when you're badgered to buy what's new, but the fact that they try to hard to, you know, produce customers is actually in line with good customer service.

This is a mixed bag I think. I don't think most people here who need to replace their products, do it in store or lack the receipts/register info or whatever.

You've got to separate the complaints that GW stores are terrible places for vets to treat as a clubhouse, and that GW staff provide poor customer service.

I do, but a lot of people here don't when they make their complaints about the GW staff.
GW "providing poor customer service" doesn't mean 'they asked me to leave because I was just hanging around the shop sitting down with my army case in the car'. You're not a 'customer' in any sense there, at least not to me. You're loitering.

Kanluwen wrote:I do, but a lot of people here don't when they make their complaints about the GW staff.
GW "providing poor customer service" doesn't mean 'they asked me to leave because I was just hanging around the shop sitting down with my army case in the car'. You're not a 'customer' in any sense there, at least not to me. You're loitering.

That's not a complaint I heara lot, or if I do it's usually in a context of waiting for a game or talking about the hobby. Maybe there are threads were people complain about that stuff, but I've not experienced it. I wouldn't dare accuse you of making a straw man argument to try to keep an argument going, so I'll just assume that there are threads full of that behavior that I don't read.

It's hard for you to argue that a genuine response to this, from people that think that GW has bad customer service, would be "yeah, that happens all the time." Or "that's why I don't game at a GW store."

When people keep pointing out how GW is almost always better than that, it's really hard to tag the complaint as anti-GW bias.

Polonius wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:I do, but a lot of people here don't when they make their complaints about the GW staff.
GW "providing poor customer service" doesn't mean 'they asked me to leave because I was just hanging around the shop sitting down with my army case in the car'. You're not a 'customer' in any sense there, at least not to me. You're loitering.

That's not a complaint I heara lot, or if I do it's usually in a context of waiting for a game or talking about the hobby. Maybe there are threads were people complain about that stuff, but I've not experienced it. I wouldn't dare accuse you of making a straw man argument to try to keep an argument going, so I'll just assume that there are threads full of that behavior that I don't read.

It's not that they usually start the threads, if that makes sense. It's people every so often who bring it up whenever someone else says they've had a bad experience at GW owned shops.

It's hard for you to argue that a genuine response to this, from people that think that GW has bad customer service, would be "yeah, that happens all the time." Or "that's why I don't game at a GW store."

When people keep pointing out how GW is almost always better than that, it's really hard to tag the complaint as anti-GW bias.

I rarely see people actually say "GW is better than that"--or at least if I do, it's the same people over and over who say it.

Most just say "This is why I play with my group of friends at home!" or "This is why I only go to my FLGS!".

Again, I must reiterate that my experience with this guy has been fine, for the most part.

I was pretty annoyed when I was getting into the game that I could not refer to him for questions or anything helpful like that, but he has given me good service with some stuff I've purchased there and replaced stuff, etc. We are on a pretty friendly/casual basis though. One thing he told me that really irked me though, "bring your money/wallet here." or something like "if you got money, bring it here."

Not very customer service like to tell someone to bring their money here.

One thing that you must consider though in a job like this: sometimes you end up being a babysitter. Many parents drop their kids off hours at a time here, and it essentially becomes a babysitting job where you're telling kids not to leave drinks/food around, not to cuss, etc, and just plain babysitting really. That can get annoying, and in the case of this store, this is commonplace. So I kind of feel for him in a way, but at the same time, you shouldn't be treating paying customers like that.

Again, he hasn't done wrong by me yet. I have warmed up to him and like going somewhere where I feel welcome everytime (probably because I take my cash there ). But there are a lot of stuff he can improve, including his customer service and especially his knowledge of the hobby. I know he's working on it though. (I think)

Kanluwen wrote:It's not that they usually start the threads, if that makes sense. It's people every so often who bring it up whenever someone else says they've had a bad experience at GW owned shops.

So... "people", every so often, bring this up, which shows the rampant anti-GW shop bias lurking behind this thread.

It's hard for you to argue that a genuine response to this, from people that think that GW has bad customer service, would be "yeah, that happens all the time." Or "that's why I don't game at a GW store."

When people keep pointing out how GW is almost always better than that, it's really hard to tag the complaint as anti-GW bias.

I rarely see people actually say "GW is better than that"--or at least if I do, it's the same people over and over who say it.
Most just say "This is why I play with my group of friends at home!" or "This is why I only go to my FLGS!".

To be fair, I did have to go all the way to the first page of this thread to find the following, so I understand if you haven't read them:

Flashman wrote:No, GW Southampton guy is cool.

Phototoxin wrote:Yes the Southampton guy (aka 'wolverene' due to the awesome hair) is pretty cool

DarkCorsair wrote:Hmm. Probably should call customer service and let them know about this guy. I'm sure this isn't a thing with all GW stores, the guy here in Sterling is awesome.

Murdock129 wrote:GW Guildford, all staff are great and I've personally never had a problem with anyone, same with several others I've been into though Guildford's my main one

Seems you just got it rough by getting a useless idiotic witch in charge of your GW store

chowderhead13 wrote:I was in a GW for about 2 years, and the staff was amazing. 4 tables, at least 1 guy at the ready to help newbie, 1 guy painting, and one guy just helping people with whatever they needed. The manager was a 4-time GD winner, and had some of his amazing pieces on display. He was very humble about it, and was the nicest guy ever.

We were allowed to take covered drinks into the store, which was awesome, as there was a Baskin Robbins (A frappe shop) right next to the place.

Sucks that GW canned the place. It was always packed.

Trickstick wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Except the GW policy does have a time limit within it for an exchange. Replacement parts even have a relative timeframe.

This is probably true but does not match my experience. I once traded a pack of special weapon kasrkin about 1-2 years after I bought them. They had a backpack missing and I left them in a draw for a while.

MechaEmperor7000 wrote:Personally the guy's just being a douche in my books. The two managers I knew in Toronto (the one in Scarborough town center and Neil from Fairview mall, now closed) both gave you at least store credit.
Generally, if the higher ups at Customer Service gave you the green light, there's nothing the store Manager can say. If he "didnt" recieve this email, then you should call Customer Service again, as well as mention the behaviour of this particular manager. Business management or not, he's going against company policy now. His mass email should also be flagged as a sort of harassment.

However let the situation play out a bit. New GW employees tend to have this view, as it seems to be a policy unique to GW. I've had a similar problem once. I bought a box of Bloodletters and they didnt come with the round bases, so I called up the store and the new clerk answered. He flat out told me he and GW would not give me free items, no matter what, and I should just suck it up. One phone call to GW later I never saw that clerk again, as well as getting a pack of the bases I missed ( as well as two GW Nametags/dogtags. Dont know what they're called, but it's an oval shaped piece of plastic with the Aquilla molded on one side, and a paper card that slips into the clear plastic casing on the other side), all of it free.

*stares at thread in disbelief*

[movie trailer voice]

For three pages he defended them.
For three pages he supported them.
Against all odds.
Against all logic.
Against all common sense.
This summer.
A man.
A Kan.
A forum.

Dakka Dakka - The Movie.

He'll rise to their defence, and never ever, ever back down...

[/movie trailer voice]


It must be pathological. It's the only explanation.

Kanluwen wrote:Except the GW policy does have a time limit within it for an exchange. Replacement parts even have a relative timeframe.

Quote and/or link please - their T&Cs do not have a time limit for return of faulty goods.

Scott-S6 wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Except the GW policy does have a time limit within it for an exchange. Replacement parts even have a relative timeframe.

Quote and/or link please - their T&Cs do not have a time limit for return of faulty goods.

It's not my job to find you facts to try to prove me wrong.

Do your own research.

Please try and show one another a little more respect. Keep in mind that the people you're arguing with love the same things you love, for example. Also keep in mind that being polite is our Rule Number One and violating that rule will lead to suspensions.

H.B.M.C. wrote:*stares at thread in disbelief*

[movie trailer voice]

For three pages he defended them.
For three pages he supported them.
Against all odds.
Against all logic.
Against all common sense.
This summer.
A man.
A Kan.
A forum.

Dakka Dakka - The Movie.

He'll rise to their defence, and never ever, ever back down...

[/movie trailer voice]


It must be pathological. It's the only explanation.

+1000 internets for you, H.M.B.C. I give you my 3rd dakka high-five.

Kanluwen wrote:

Scott-S6 wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Except the GW policy does have a time limit within it for an exchange. Replacement parts even have a relative timeframe.

Quote and/or link please - their T&Cs do not have a time limit for return of faulty goods.

It's not my job to find you facts to try to prove me wrong.

Do your own research.

I have done. Neither their return policy or terms and conditions state any limit for return of faulty goods.

So you are wrong. I was giving you an opportunity to back up your point but I guess you don't have anything to back it up with?

Scott-S6 wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

Scott-S6 wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Except the GW policy does have a time limit within it for an exchange. Replacement parts even have a relative timeframe.

Quote and/or link please - their T&Cs do not have a time limit for return of faulty goods.

It's not my job to find you facts to try to prove me wrong.

Do your own research.

I have done. Neither their return policy or terms and conditions state any limit for return of faulty goods.

So you are wrong. I was giving you an opportunity to back up your point but I guess you don't have anything to back it up with?

Other than my own experience that I put forward in this thread and having dealt with GW Nottingham's customer service?

Nope, nothing at all to back it up with.

Kanluwen wrote:

Scott-S6 wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

Scott-S6 wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Except the GW policy does have a time limit within it for an exchange. Replacement parts even have a relative timeframe.

Quote and/or link please - their T&Cs do not have a time limit for return of faulty goods.

It's not my job to find you facts to try to prove me wrong.

Do your own research.

I have done. Neither their return policy or terms and conditions state any limit for return of faulty goods.

So you are wrong. I was giving you an opportunity to back up your point but I guess you don't have anything to back it up with?

Other than my own experience that I put forward in this thread and having dealt with GW Nottingham's customer service?

Nope, nothing at all to back it up with.

but you did say that anyone can say anything on the internet...
prove it.

shrike wrote:but you did say that anyone can say anything on the internet...
prove it.

Let's stay on-topic, please.

LOL, on the forum index it had 'worst manager of all time? Manchu'. The manager described in the OP just seems like a guy thats bad his job...

Perkustin wrote:LOL, on the forum index it had 'worst manager of all time? Manchu'.

I second this. One of the more reasonable aspects in this thread.

I'm only an assistant manager.

H.B.M.C. wrote:*stares at thread in disbelief*

[movie trailer voice]

For three pages he defended them.
For three pages he supported them.
Against all odds.
Against all logic.
Against all common sense.
This summer.
A man.
A Kan.
A forum.

Dakka Dakka - The Movie.

He'll rise to their defence, and never ever, ever back down...

[/movie trailer voice]


It must be pathological. It's the only explanation.

+40k!

Also, I must point out that in an argument, if you assert something that can only be proven right, you MUST provide the proof yourself. if you submit something that can only be proven wrong, then the responsibility of finding said proof falls upon your opponents. In this case, Kan, you must submit the actual location of where it says the limited time frame, otherwise we're just going on your word, which is not reliable to say the least.

Back on topic: The title of "worst manager" might be a bit harshly applied to this guy, despite his shortcomings. He's no more bullheaded then any TFG (some members of DakkaDakka have proved to be even more bullheaded, and no I'm not refering to Kan. Take a look on any YMDC topic with more than one page). I've certainly seen worse, both in person and from other online tales (while not a manager, one stockboy once threw my stuff on the ground because "only GW items are allowed on the table!". A few middle fingers his way and everything else was fine again, and he brought out the glue to fix my models. No joke, he actually got into a flying rage because of it).

Worst manager for me is a FLGS owner. Nice guy awesome customer service when I am in the store.

The thing that bugs me is the fact that I have shopped there for three years now and he never remembers me. I have dropped thousands of dollars in his store and he always greats me like it’s my first time there. Other than that he is really polite and knows his stuff but after having answered the question of “What do you play?” of newcomers about a thousand times I have chosen to go to a different store more often.

Sorry, but that makes him "worst manager"?

You said yourself he's a nice guy with awesome customer service. He's forgetful to the extreme, yes. But worst manager?

Hey I said worst manager for me not for the whole world. Sorry if thats not what the thread asks. Also I still shop at his store but not as often.

Sorry, I wasn't being snide or anything, I was simply genuinely surprised you'd consider him eligible for "worst manager"...

Sorry I'll just add my 2 cent to this matter.

Both parties are correct in most cases.

OP is correct that the manager in question should need further training in terms of customer service skills and handling situations like exchange of products.

BUT.

Remember that GW at the end of the day is a business, and what businesses does not protect themselves and make profit. I agree with how the manager asked for proof of purchase before exchange take place, like seriously even i would raise a eye brow to someone who comes in and wants to exchange goods without any proof of purchase. It's not personal but it's just business usually.
Here are few reasons why they may not exchange:
1- Could be obtained by illicit means
2- Could be an older product which they no longer stock
3- Obtained via ebay or any other discounted means, hence they lose money if ie. you buy a box of marine for $35 and take it into store to exchange for "equal" value item which the box of marine costs $50 in store normally, so you "gain" $15
4- New Store policy could be they will replace any damaged or mismoulded product bought in store, but not exchanges.
5- Exchanged products is usually a lose for the store because you have to "write off" a product to give it and when stock take comes it will show negatives in certain products and exceed the amount of other product kept for other products.

Thats my 2 cent on the matter, correct me if i'm wrong thanks.

bluedestiny wrote:Remember that GW at the end of the day is a business, and what businesses does not protect themselves and make profit. I agree with how the manager asked for proof of purchase before exchange take place, like seriously even i would raise a eye brow to someone who comes in and wants to exchange goods without any proof of purchase. It's not personal but it's just business usually.

It's really not. It's extremely common for stores, particularly ones run by larger companies, to offer exchanges without proof of purchase. It's good for keeping customers happy, and is a negligible cost to the company.

1- Could be obtained by illicit means

Which makes practically no difference to the store if the item is exchanged for something of equal or lesser value. In fact, the only way this makes any difference to the store is if the item is a slow seller and is being echanged for something that is more popular, as it removes a popular item from the shelf and replaces it with something else. In the case of chain stores where slow-moving stock is just sent back to head office and redistributed as necessary, that's not even an issue.

2- Could be an older product which they no longer stock

That one is potentially an issue... but for a company like GW where even the old stuff will generally still sell or can be used for demo material, not a huge one.

3- Obtained via ebay or any other discounted means, hence they lose money if ie. you buy a box of marine for $35 and take it into store to exchange for "equal" value item which the box of marine costs $50 in store normally, so you "gain" $15

You technically made $15, yes... assuming you couldn't have bought the box you exhanged for at the same place and for the same discount as you bought the original marines... in which case you have just given yourself some legwork for no actual gain.

The store, however, lost nothing, because they just exchanged what is, to them, a $50 item for another $50 item.
GW as a whole likewise lose nothing, as the product was still sold by them at wholesale rates in the first place anyway.

4- New Store policy could be they will replace any damaged or mismoulded product bought in store, but not exchanges.

It could be... but we've had several people so far point out that this isn't the case.

5- Exchanged products is usually a lose for the store because you have to "write off" a product to give it and when stock take comes it will show negatives in certain products and exceed the amount of other product kept for other products.

If the product is written off, it doesn't produce a negative at stocktake... that's the whole point of writing it off. And dollar wise, the product you replace it with balances out the loss on the written off item.

That's assuming they don't put it through as a refund on the returned item and a sale of the new item, which would be the far more common way of doing it as the returned item has to be added to inventory.

At the end of the day I see how a lot of people have pointed out the he is new and probably doesn't know all of GW's policies (the exchange and return policies do seem a bit out there for any other retailer).
I figure I'll go in and maybe talk to him about it just so this whole thing doesn't leave any bad impressions either way.

Pen≥Sword wrote:At the end of the day I see how a lot of people have pointed out the he is new and probably doesn't know all of GW's policies (the exchange and return policies do seem a bit out there for any other retailer).
I figure I'll go in and maybe talk to him about it just so this whole thing doesn't leave any bad impressions either way.

That, my friend, is the biggest and most responsible way to handle situations like these.

While it's great and all to vent anonymously online, people can't learn from their mistakes if noone informs them they made a mistake

Kanluwen wrote:

Pen≥Sword wrote:At the end of the day I see how a lot of people have pointed out the he is new and probably doesn't know all of GW's policies (the exchange and return policies do seem a bit out there for any other retailer).
I figure I'll go in and maybe talk to him about it just so this whole thing doesn't leave any bad impressions either way.

That, my friend, is the biggest and most responsible way to handle situations like these.

While it's great and all to vent anonymously online, people can't learn from their mistakes if noone informs them they made a mistake

You mean apart from the part where the manger has accused him of stealing?