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Termagants will likely end up being this edition's Necron Warriors: You'd have to be mad to buy them on their own!

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Termagants will likely end up being this edition's Necron Warriors: You'd have to be mad to buy them on their own!

If terminators are the new assault intercessors I will probably end up with a good size pile of termagants.

Either/Or wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Termagants will likely end up being this edition's Necron Warriors: You'd have to be mad to buy them on their own!

If terminators are the new assault intercessors I will probably end up with a good size pile of termagants.

I rather doubt that the recruit starter will be 10 termigants vs 3-5 terminators, one with an assault cannon.

Did we see a terminator sergeant in the video? I cant recall.

Indomitus didn't include any Sisters of Battle, but they were key in the promotional video for that edition.

I wouldn't read too much into how many models are in a box or what's in the box based upon the video.

I enjoyed building the 2 ‘fexes I have. Fun kit, did not have any issues with it. Back in the day, when an army was a handfull of squads and something the size of a dread was a big deal, ‘fexes were something to be scared of. But scale creep happened. In a world of knights and super heavies, they struggle to find a role.

In the last few codexes they have had the wonderfully flexible ‘fex datasheet as well as bespoke ones for the screamer killer amd thornback. I’d love them to make a special throwback mini of the old classic SK, and keep that alongside the flex kit. Best of both worlds. And a monopose launch box SK would not be a bad place for it.

 Nevelon wrote:
Back in the day, when an army was a handfull of squads and something the size of a dread was a big deal, ‘fexes were something to be scared of. But scale creep happened. In a world of knights and super heavies, they struggle to find a role.

Maybe that new Combat Patrol mode would allow it to shine again? Assuming the new Nids CP box includes a Carnifex of course.

Tyel wrote:
I'd have thought the main reason to fear change is £££.

Surprised to see the love of the Carnifex kit. Never really rated it. Always felt it was too small and hunched - which guess reflects where the Carnifex has ended up in the wider hierarchy - versus its 2nd edition high days - but still.

But right now, you can buy 12 Termagants for £22.50. Do the new ones look better? Sure. Is that going to make up for being say £35~ for 10 (probably)? So 50-75% more expensive? You can debate it. Especially if Termagants were to say go back down to say 5 points and the rules are very much "bring 90 of these guys or nothing".

I think Gaunts will be initially cheap since Im convinced they will be included on the typical 3x 40k Starting boxsets. Ebay will make them affordable.
Not sure about how multipart they will be then or if they will release a different multipart sprue/box later on.
One thing that really works against the price per model is the current dual kit box sets for medium sized creatures, yes you can build two different breeds but the price per box is way to high because of that. Going forward that will potentially make them even more expensive.

I like the carnifex Kit specially the size of the old boy I think its ideal for large creatures, the problem is not the carni, the problem is that they made all these other ridiculous huge new kits, a pain to store, transport etc.

Looking at the 3 they have shown, I think the body and head are a single part, then legs and arms plug into the sides.

Tyel wrote:
Surprised to see the love of the Carnifex kit. Never really rated it. Always felt it was too small and hunched - which guess reflects where the Carnifex has ended up in the wider hierarchy - versus its 2nd edition high days - but still.

When I read something like this it just makes me wonder when the person started playing. There's no way you "always thought it was small" if you saw it when it came out in 2005, except in like a mind-palace way where marines were also too small. But nobody actually expected bigger models at that time, or had really seen them realized in GW plastic.

 NAVARRO wrote:

I think Gaunts will be initially cheap since Im convinced they will be included on the typical 3x 40k Starting boxsets. Ebay will make them affordable.
Not sure about how multipart they will be then or if they will release a different multipart sprue/box later on.
One thing that really works against the price per model is the current dual kit box sets for medium sized creatures, yes you can build two different breeds but the price per box is way to high because of that. Going forward that will potentially make them even more expensive.

We've seen that the combat patrol version of the termagant datasheet only has fleshborers listed, while the 'normal' datasheet has other weapon options. That could indicate there are two different sets of sprues for termagants, with the launch box & combat patrol getting a simpler pushfit version while a multipart version with build options is sold separately. That could be GW learning from Necron Warrior stock not selling separately because there are so many cheap sources of the models elsewhere.

I'm expecting a similar situation with the marine terminators as well. Those are more likely to be pushfit like the 9E Bladeguard & Eradicators, with a separate multipart kit later that covers all options.

 Shadow Walker wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
Back in the day, when an army was a handfull of squads and something the size of a dread was a big deal, ‘fexes were something to be scared of. But scale creep happened. In a world of knights and super heavies, they struggle to find a role.

Maybe that new Combat Patrol mode would allow it to shine again? Assuming the new Nids CP box includes a Carnifex of course.

The current Combat Patrol is not that old. But if they are making a major range revamp, it’s probably going away. Especially as we’ve seen the new gaunts and the CP come with 3 dozen of the little biters. Looking at the CPs now, it seems the biggest things tend to be medium tank/dread equivalents. Although there are some ringers in there. Like the Hive Tyrant in our current nid box. How they balance all those is its own thread though.

IMHO I think the carnifex should have the role of being a solid chunk of toughness and mean, mid-range flexible. Not as much offense or wounds as the big guys, but tough as a dread and able to fill gaps in the swarm. A hammer that can troubleshoot issues on the battlefield and crack them open. But not the hyperspecialized big monster bugs.

 Nevelon wrote:

 Shadow Walker wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
Back in the day, when an army was a handfull of squads and something the size of a dread was a big deal, ‘fexes were something to be scared of. But scale creep happened. In a world of knights and super heavies, they struggle to find a role.

Maybe that new Combat Patrol mode would allow it to shine again? Assuming the new Nids CP box includes a Carnifex of course.

The current Combat Patrol is not that old. But if they are making a major range revamp, it’s probably going away. Especially as we’ve seen the new gaunts and the CP come with 3 dozen of the little biters. Looking at the CPs now, it seems the biggest things tend to be medium tank/dread equivalents. Although there are some ringers in there. Like the Hive Tyrant in our current nid box. How they balance all those is its own thread though.

IMHO I think the carnifex should have the role of being a solid chunk of toughness and mean, mid-range flexible. Not as much offense or wounds as the big guys, but tough as a dread and able to fill gaps in the swarm. A hammer that can troubleshoot issues on the battlefield and crack them open. But not the hyperspecialized big monster bugs.

From how i see it, GW currently does not like generalists and flexibility anymore, instead going for hyper-specialized niche units. That may or may not be due to the tendency of removing options and making options free: it's much harder to 'break' a one-trick pony by finding a degenerately powerful combination of stuff than it is to do the same with a 'generalist' unit that can potentially bring everything and the kitchen sink.

 Nevelon wrote:
I enjoyed building the 2 ‘fexes I have. Fun kit, did not have any issues with it. Back in the day, when an army was a handfull of squads and something the size of a dread was a big deal, ‘fexes were something to be scared of. But scale creep happened. In a world of knights and super heavies, they struggle to find a role.

In the last few codexes they have had the wonderfully flexible ‘fex datasheet as well as bespoke ones for the screamer killer amd thornback. I’d love them to make a special throwback mini of the old classic SK, and keep that alongside the flex kit. Best of both worlds. And a monopose launch box SK would not be a bad place for it.

Yeah I love the Fex kit [although I've had problems aligning the back chimneys ] and I really like where it sits now as a bio-dread type build. I've always thought that at that scale there is potential for other monsters too. I'm guessing the new screamer killer and probably the feeder beast sit into the size but perform other roles. From listening to the reveal stream I'm guessing the feeder beast might act as a force multiplier on surrounding units which is something I like the sound of.

Also the scuttling melee attackers look to be something new rather than hormagaunts - they are squatter,with short tails and seem to have heavy jaws.Valrak said maybe 3 types of gaunts - maybe these are hypergaunts ?

I'm liking that it looks like a lot of the newer beasties are going to be in the medium category for size. A lot of the newer additions to Tyranids have been massive monsters and they are awesome, but they are also massive, which presents issues for transporting and such.

So I'm totally fine with GW perhaps splitting some Carnifex variations into their own sculpts and then having a potentially revised core fex kit along with other options in that middleweight category.

One thing we might see happen is we might see the Carnifex lose some options but have those options parcelled out to other models. Eg the Screamerkiller is likely going to replace the concept of a fex with 4 scything talons outright as a model. Now chances are you can still use an old fex with talons as a counts as, but the intention moving forward is that you'd use the new kit.

The "downside" here is that those who have modular fex's with magnets might find that its not as variable as it once was and those with fixed builds it might be more like a model upgrade visually.
The upside is that it might well increase model visual diversity without bloating the army options itself.

The Fex on its own does a lot, heck its intention was to be a jack of all trades in terms of options to build with.

They could add more/different biomorphs to a revised Fex kit- there is a lot of room on those sprues as is- or they could set them up as pairs on the sprue.
I have just built and painted two screamer killers.. temped to replace one set of arms now..but no rush.

I also hope we will get the odd random ripper/organism on different kits as well similar to grots/nurglings/cherubs..

Historically we've always had Rippers on random Tyranid Sprue and it would be awesome for that to continue or even get other variations - winged rippers would be cool to see in plastic

 Overread wrote:
Historically we've always had Rippers on random Tyranid Sprue and it would be awesome for that to continue or even get other variations - winged rippers would be cool to see in plastic

From the article on Warhammer Community :

And don’t worry, they still come with a Ripper Swarm!

Old-Four-Arms wrote:

 Overread wrote:
Historically we've always had Rippers on random Tyranid Sprue and it would be awesome for that to continue or even get other variations - winged rippers would be cool to see in plastic

From the article on Warhammer Community :

And don’t worry, they still come with a Ripper Swarm!

Which does not guarantee that they will continue to be splashed into other kits.

Currently if you build your swarms with just the options in the termagant kit it gets very same-y fast. You have 2 different rippers, the one on the the main sprue and one from the upgrades sprue in a 4:3 ratio. Even just splashing in the one different ripper from the genestealer kit helps makes things a little more interesting.

I’d love to see unique rippers on every sprue, so we can mix and match to make wildly diverse swarms.

Fingers crossed.

I'm actually expecting the Rippers to evolve (hah !), same as the Necron Scarabs did (old vs. new model)

https://brushandboltgun.com/2020/09/09/video-how-to-paint-necron-scarabs-new-and-old/

Carnifex discussion made me think about the Warriors. Even though I love the current kit I am also one of the few (judging by the internet nids talks) who liked the look of the 2nd edition ones. Together with SC and Hormas (I am really keen to see their newest minis) from that time they were one of the reasons that sold me on the bugs army. If the GW is, based on the video's SC, going closer to modernized 2nd edition look of the Tyranids, it may also mean that kits like Warriors, and possibly HT could see a reimagination in the near future toward that style.

 Shadow Walker wrote:
Carnifex discussion made me think about the Warriors. Even though I love the current kit I am also one of the few (judging by the internet nids talks) who liked the look of the 2nd edition ones. Together with SC and Hormas (I am really keen to see their newest minis) from that time they were one of the reasons that sold me on the bugs army. If the GW is, based on the video's SC, going closer to modernized 2nd edition look of the Tyranids, it may also mean that kits like Warriors, and possibly HT could see a reimagination in the near future toward that style.

Having just got wrapped up in the hype and bought a unit of warriors, after assembling them I kinda feel they have too many options at this point? I last touched nids late 4th so it's not totally foreign but having 4 melee options and 3 ranged for each warrior feels a bit much. Especially when all 3 guns are fundamentally anti-infantry to one degree or another. They could almost go to heavy melee, melee, standard gun and 1 in 3 heavy gun and I don't feel much would be lost, but I am out of touch.

Too many options? For real?

Nids have a lot of options, but the design space they have to work in in a bit small. So instead of different guns shining in different roles, you can just take the option that maths out to the best call 95% of the time. Same with melee options.

Which is not a unique problem. Most armies have similar issues.

Looking again at the Norn Emissary (or whatever it will be called), and I think it could be a Silent King style miniature with his two floating servants.

 Shadow Walker wrote:
Looking again at the Norn Emissary (or whatever it will be called), and I think it could be a Silent King style miniature with his two floating servants.

My question there is if it’s just going to be one base/statline, or if those are going to be like tau drones with their own rules separate from the big brain bug.

 Shadow Walker wrote:
Looking again at the Norn Emissary (or whatever it will be called), and I think it could be a Silent King style miniature with his two floating servants.

I think that's the idea.

I just hope it's not a special character.

Nevelon wrote:
My question there is if it’s just going to be one base/statline, or if those are going to be like tau drones with their own rules separate from the big brain bug.

I think that the smaller ones are some kind of psychic amplifiers which would give various bonuses to both psychic tests and stats etc., and could have a separate statline so you could target them, and therefore be able to reduce the effectiveness of the big brain bug.

H.B.M.C. wrote:
I just hope it's not a special character.

Yeah, me too.

H.B.M.C. wrote:Too many options? For real?

Is answered by:

Nevelon wrote:Nids have a lot of options, but the design space they have to work in in a bit small. So instead of different guns shining in different roles, you can just take the option that maths out to the best call 95% of the time. Same with melee options.

Which is not a unique problem. Most armies have similar issues.

I can't see why you'd ever want the spinefists? Devourer vs deathspitter is basically down to "can you spare 5 pts" given one is better against nearly any target than the other. In melee, is there a reason dual swords and sword + whip needs to be different rules other than legacy at this point? Rending claws > scything talons to the point they might as well not exist and having multiple weapons seems a bit pointless, i.e. what is the benefit of 4 scytals despite being an option, or 4 rending claws?

There's customisation for customisations sakes.

Back when we had templates, Deathspitter was using small blast one, and it made it different enough from the Devourer. So yeah, they could do much better job to make weapons different enough now when the templates are gone.

Also one of the legacies of Tyranids having lots of multi weapon options was having a smaller model roster at the time.

We didn't have 5 different tanks, we have 1 Carnifex kit which did all those roles in one depending on the weapons you gave it.

Warriors were much the same.


I can agree that as time has passed its got harder to fit all these weapons in when the range has been growing and gaining more and more model diversity.

That said spinefists have always been rather boring. They are the "you take these because they are cheap" weapon and nothing more to help you really bolster out an army that was focusing on swarming.