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Played a 2000 point game last weekend and finally have some time to write down my thoughts.
I used some Legends units, the heavy mortar team and the quad mortar team to be precise. They were fun but their effect on the game can be replicated with other indirect fire units in our roster, and as they are legend units I wont really comment on them any further.

The mission was interesting: primary scoring was already possible round one (or we missed a rule) with a maximum of 10 points, and any unit with scout or infiltrate was therefore invaluable. Because of a twist, all objectives were set up in noman's land.
I went second. After deployment, one infantry squad with 2 autocannons, a platoon command squad and a primaris psycher was close enough to one objective, 2 scout sentinels to the other.
Terrain saved the sentinels.
Lesson 1: Primaris psycher is worth it
thanks to the 4+ invulnerable save (and the medic 6+ FNP), the infantry squad survived with the big guns remaining, and capable of scoring. But only having 1 CP really hampert my abilities to react. If the squad would have been killed, I wouldn't have enough CP to bring them back.
Lesson 2: taking Lord Solar Leontus basically required
he is just an Autotake with his three orders and extra CP. Everything else he brings to the table is just a bonus. Mordian Glory made a great video on how to use him and I believe joining him with a command squad is worth it. I have kitbashed him from an old project, I build some rough riders based on their 8th edition index rules but never got to complete them. He will be leading my forces next game.
Lesson 3: Chimeras are great but you don't need three
I played three infantry squads in a chimera each. The ability to order units from within the chimera by one officer was interesting, but the opportunity didn't come up during the game. The extra durability isn't that bad, but I wonder if a second infantry squad for basically the same price wouldn't be better in a lot of cases. But their firepower is surprisingly good, matching the output of the infantry squad. It redirects higher strength shots away from other targets, but they die really fast. Firing deck also allows the infantry squad inside to add some firepower, a neat little extra.
The mobility was great for the mission, but I believe 3 chimeras was one too many.
Lesson 4: more boots on the ground
or boys before toys if a heretical commander would ever copy tried and tested Ork strategies. Because a lot of my infantry (half, to be precise) was sitting in a transport, they couldn't provide the much more valuable duty of bubble wrapping and deep strike denial.
End of round 2, the Tyranids were in my deployment zone and eating my artillery. One less chimera and an extra infantry squad would have slowed them down enough. Maybe even two small squads is catachans for Frontline tarpitting and another backfield squad would have been better.
Lesson 5: Deathstrikes are fun
the Deathstrike has the unique ability to force the opponents movement like no other gun. It didn't fire in our game, but just sitting in it's corner and forcing my opponent to move away from certain points or straight up denying movement into certain regions on the board was absolutely invaluable. Maybe it's a bit to expensive for its output, but the potential is extremely scary for the opponent.
I will include one in any list for the time being.
Lesson 6: Tyranids hate the death mask
This enhancement is really great to ensure that an objective stays under imperial control. The Tyranids ability to force a battle shock Test has forced my to commit more resources onto an objective then necessary, and the death mask really mitigated the risk of just not controlling an objective. Cadian shock troops provide a similar result with their ability, but I wanted the heavy weapons the infantry squad provided. The result of the death mask was great, as a battle-shocked squad still controlled the objective, even though some Tyranid creatures had charged them (I believe some ravenors).

I lost the game because I got tied up in my deployment zone, unable to score primaries.
So, looking back, I believe that I should take more infantry. I overcommitted on small characters that didn't really do anything, and way to much artillery. Not every infantry squad needs an attached leader. If you believe you got enough infantry, get 2 extra squads.

Were you playing the leviathan mission pack? Because if you did think you did couple things wrong.

No objective primary can be scored turn 1 in any of the primary missions. Only primary you can score turn 1 is kill 1 and kill more in purge the foe.

Secondly no twist to remove objectives in deployment zones. One per each is mandatory(there's 2 secondaries that depend on those). Ways to alter objective positions:

a) primary mission that requires removing center of board one
b) primary mission that requires removing no man land ones EXCEPT the one in middle and you then create more to NML.
c) twist where you replace the middle one with 2 more.
d) twist that makes players put objectives but here specifically it requires 1(and only 1) in each deployment zone. Doesn't specify who puts where or when but if by the time 4th and 5th none has been placed in deployment zones then you have to put one per deployment zones.

Note you might not be able to score primaries from home those in deployment zone but due to secondaries like capture enemy outpost you need the objectives anyway. And leaving them unguarded could turn out costly if opponent has fast fliers or teleports/deep strikes.

Thank you for the clarification. My opponent had the chore of dealing with the mission set up, but good to know some details! We had a secondary come up that we could not score as there were no objectives left in our deployment zone, we just allowed drawing a new card.

Leaving the backfield unguarded will always get punished. Tyranids can deep strike a monster (Trygon?) outside of 3", instead of 9", and I couldn't kill it because it was out of LOS of my heavy weapons.

There's also no free draw unscorable. Drew kill monster/vehicle and opponent has neither? Tough.

You can pay 1cp once in game for new secondary and throw away any or all secondaries(scoring 1 cp if you do) but apart from that no way to change them.

tneva82 wrote:
There's also no free draw unscorable. Drew kill monster/vehicle and opponent has neither? Tough.

Which only matters in a hardcore competitive tournament context. Anywhere else virtually everyone is using the obvious house rule that you redraw objectives that are impossible to complete.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Brickfix wrote:
]Lesson 1: Primaris psycher is worth it

Got to disagree here. The issue is the point cost, for the cost of a 4++ you can bring another infantry squad instead. Same durability increase, more firepower, and way more footprint and OC.

Lesson 3: Chimeras are great but you don't need three

Chimeras as transports are bad IMO. You can't get orders when you disembark, the firepower of the Chimera + squad is extremely underwhelming for the cost, and you aren't doing a very good job of scoring with them. I'd consider taking empty Chimeras (disembarking immediately at the start of the game) purely as gun platforms but even then I'm not sure it's worth having the passengers out of position.

Lesson 5: Deathstrikes are fun

Fun, but not effective. You do an average of 4.8 wounds per infantry target, 3.8 against anything T9 or better, and even less against anything with an invulnerable save or FNP. For the point cost that's just not good enough. A smart player will keep their units in place and eat the handful of wounds, at which point you've way overpaid for some minor damage and unless you have a bunch of other artillery you probably can't finish off the target soon enough to matter. It's a textbook seal clubbing weapon: great at improving your MoV against weaker players, very bad when you go up against someone who knows how to deal with it.

Regarding the Chimera: From a theoretical point of view I could see Chimeras with Heavy weapon squads being some kind of "Heavy weapons Squad +1"
=> 2 HWS cost 120 points
=> a HWS in a Chimera costs 130 for similar firepower (1 less heavy weapon, but + 1 heavy stubber, hunter killer and the lasgun array) but much better protection.

Edit: of course only relevant if one wanted to use HWS anyway

 Pyroalchi wrote:
Regarding the Chimera: From a theoretical point of view I could see Chimeras with Heavy weapon squads being some kind of "Heavy weapons Squad +1"
=> 2 HWS cost 120 points
=> a HWS in a Chimera costs 130 for similar firepower (1 less heavy weapon, but + 1 heavy stubber, hunter killer and the lasgun array) but much better protection.

Edit: of course only relevant if one wanted to use HWS anyway

Two less heavy weapons. The Chimera gets two heavy weapons from the fire points and its own two guns for a total of four, the two HWS get six heavy weapons. And the Chimera package is getting dangerously close to the point where you can buy a LRBT that comes with three heavy weapons and a main gun.

And that last part is key: HWS are bad except maybe with mortars if you need a cheap backfield objective camper and when they have mortars you don't need to worry about defense.

Ah, sorry. I don't know why I counted the combo as 5 heavy weapons.
Yeah, you are right.

 ThePaintingOwl wrote:

Brickfix wrote:
]Lesson 1: Primaris psycher is worth it

Got to disagree here. The issue is the point cost, for the cost of a 4++ you can bring another infantry squad instead. Same durability increase, more firepower, and way more footprint and OC.

This is correct for a 10 man squad - a 20 man squad with attached command squad is a different story.
Depending on the weapon shooting at the infantry squad, the psycher is worth more than the extra 10 bodies, in a different squad, with potentially no orders.

Lesson 5: Deathstrikes are fun

Fun, but not effective. You do an average of 4.8 wounds per infantry target, 3.8 against anything T9 or better, and even less against anything with an invulnerable save or FNP. For the point cost that's just not good enough. A smart player will keep their units in place and eat the handful of wounds, at which point you've way overpaid for some minor damage and unless you have a bunch of other artillery you probably can't finish off the target soon enough to matter. It's a textbook seal clubbing weapon: great at improving your MoV against weaker players, very bad when you go up against someone who knows how to deal with it.

How are you all equipping your sentinels? I can see good arguments for almost all the options, and while I'm pretty sure the answer is "to support deficiencies in the rest of your army" there's still a lot of nuance.
For example, I played a list of 6x catachans in heavy flamer chimeras and supported with lascannon sentinels of both flavours as my answer to armour and even though I had a lot of success I still found myself wondering if some plasma would have been helpful on a few of them.
In a guard force that has less infantry killing potential than 60 catachans and 6 flameras, heavy flamer scouts sound like they'd be laugh. but I also find myself wondering if enough autocannons to force those saves could be a threat in their own right.

Note that this is purely theoryhammer with a great bit of gut feeling:
I assume the main task of Scout Sentinels is to run to take objectives early on and drop their bonus ability to improve shooting of other units. As that has much more priority than positioning them optimal for shooting any kills they make would (in my eyes) purely be a cherry on the top. Therefore my go to would be Autocannon or maybe Missile launcher if the enemy has lots of little gribblies (where blast might matter) paired with monsters/vehicles (where the Krak Missile might do something) like for example Tyranids. Both being "take all comers" options with big enough range that they should have a target of opportunity.

For the Armored Sentinels I tend to Lascannon+Hunter Killer missile for one surprisingly heavy anti-tank punch for such a relatively cheap unit. And I am optimistic that one should usually be able to position them in a way to get a shot at something worthwhile. Meanwhile they can't be braketed and might resurrect, so an opponent has to dedicate a bit of firepower to remove them before they fire their Hunter Killer salvo. With rerolling wounds they should be able to even hurt (super)heavies

But as mentioned: theoryhammer, not based on actual experience.

 Pyroalchi wrote:
Note that this is purely theoryhammer with a great bit of gut feeling:
I assume the main task of Scout Sentinels is to run to take objectives early on and drop their bonus ability to improve shooting of other units. As that has much more priority than positioning them optimal for shooting any kills they make would (in my eyes) purely be a cherry on the top. Therefore my go to would be Autocannon or maybe Missile launcher if the enemy has lots of little gribblies (where blast might matter) paired with monsters/vehicles (where the Krak Missile might do something) like for example Tyranids. Both being "take all comers" options with big enough range that they should have a target of opportunity.

This is how I have used scout sentinels. The autocannon is a great alrounder. The ability to resurrect them is great as well.

I'm thinking about catachans again. One 20 man squad with straken can move ahead together with the scout sentinels. I would like to try a second squad with an enginseer and supporting servitors. The second squad doesn't get to scout move, but adds a melee backup while strakens squad distracts the front line. If one of the sentinels goes down, the enginseer gets another buff. For 80 points, servitors and enginseer are more expensive, but their WS can be buffed to 3+ with the orders and mind lock ability. My understanding is that weapon skill can be improved my more than +1, while the role itself can only be modified to a maximum +1, is this correct?

Hey Guard enthusiasts, been kinda quiet here. Also lowkey gloomy lol. Anyways here is an all foot guard list that has been pretty successful in my local meta.

First the list then my thoughts

Creed
Straken

3x DKoK Marshals with Plasma Pistol and Power Weapon
1x Command Squad: Master Vox, Regimental Standard, Plasmagun, Medic, Warlord with Power Fist, Plasma Pistol and Grand Strategist
1x Command Squad: Master Vox, Regimental Standard, Plasmagun, Medic, Officer with Power Fist, and Plasma Pistol

2x Catachan Jungle Fighters: 20 models, 4x Flamers, 2x Vox
5x DKoK Infantry: 20 models, Sgts have Plasma Pistol and Power Weapon, 2x Melta, 2x Plasma, 2x Grenade Launcher, Medic
3x Infantry Squads: 20 Models, Sgts have Plasma pistols and power weapons, 2x Plasma, 2x Vox, 2x Lascannon

2x HWS with Mortars
2x Scions: Sgt with Power Fist and Plasma Pistol, 2x Hotshot Lasguns, 1x Melta, 1x Plasma
1x Scions: Sgt with Power Fist and Plasma Pistol, 5x Hotshot Lasguns, 2x Melta, 2x Plasma

To start, my meta is pretty average I guess. There are a couple of try hards running the current net lists of the month. Some long beards who are good because they've played the same army for 20 years lol, and then the average gamers or those, like me, who played in the past and are getting back into it. The try hards tend to run riot with their optimised net lists, but that's expected.

I last played in 6th ed. I still have my foot guard army I played in 5th, and there is some surprising similarities between 5th and 10th. The meta is once again about metal boxes, or big stompy monsters. Everyone seems to be in an arms race to have armor and/or enough AT to counter their opponents armor. So I decided that it's time to be counter meta once again.

This list takes horrible losses. Like 80% and that's with my recursion. I'm constantly picking up dead guardsmen and sending new units to take their place. I 100% win on attrition, holding objectives with my superior OC and just outlasting my opponent. As for how fast I play, well I've played horde lists for years, so Im fast enough that it wouldnt be an issue in a tournament. With movement trays its remarkably easy to move, and since my units are simple it doesn't take nearly as long as you'd think to shoot and melee with them.

Any one else have any luck with foot guard?

What are people's thoughts on the Exterminator? Decided to take one in my latest Crusade just for the hell of it, it's turned out to be absolutely lethal. Loaded up with Multi-Meltas and a Lascannon it's killed over twice its points in a number of games, the Ap bonus it gives makes it even sweeter.

Honestly, it seems to be capable of work on it's own while the +1 AP buff can be really strong. I wouldn't spam them, but splashing one into a list seems like a nice utility piece that also spits some firepower.

Anyone had a chance to play since the balance dataslate dropped? I can't imagine that the changes we got had any appreciable effect unless one was spamming Manticores or ran a fair amount of Scions/Mechanized Infantry, but I'm still curious.

Funnily enough, it would have made a change in my last game, this weekend I will see how it pans out ...

I know this sounds like a really dumb question, but I don't really grasp how mixed imperial armies work currently.

If I have an almost pure Guard list and want to sprinkle in, say, a retributor squad from the Adepta Sororitas and/or some Pteraxis from the Adeptus Mechanicus... How? Can I just bring the models and play them without their army rules, or do they sabotage the Guard part of the army by being there?

You simply can't. Only imperial agents and imperial knights have rules to be taken as allies.

https://www.goonhammer.com/competitive-innovations-in-10th-silver-tide-pt-2/

earlier today i was reading a goonhammer competitive article and amongst all the normal and reasonable stuff in the article, this stood out to me

5th – Alexander Tepe – Astra Militarum: Double Tank Commanders, 18 Bullgryn, and a whole bunch of artillery.

my girlfriend plays IG so i'm familiar with the state of the army already, and i knew that bullgryns were one of the better things in the army, but it's really interesting to hear that playing so many is a competitively viable strategy

I can report on my last game. Very close game, ultimately lost with a 4pts difference.
My opponent played Tyranids and all is important monsters had 4++ saves, and he barely failed any of them.
My list contained Lord Solar in a death Korps Squad with platoon command, two 10 man infantry squads with mortar to cover my flanks, as well as another 10 man death Korps Squad.
Additionally, I took a Shadowsword, a Leman Russ Exterminator and two Demolishers, and two chimeras transporting more Death Korps infantry and two scout sentinels.
Our deployment was hammer and anvil, mission was very basic (max 10pts from objectives, 15 after the last round), and vox static.
So Leontus stayed back together with all infantry not in transports to control the corners and back field (we always play the random objectives, never fixed). Shadowsword provided extra cover. The other tanks and infantry carefully push forward.
Each round saw the death of one Leman Russ and a bit of infantry, but the Shadowsword was basically untouched in the end. Tyranids have trouble dealing witha lot of armor. I forgot to mention two squad of scions, they didn't really do anything besides clearing some chaff from the center objective in turn three.
The Shadowsword is awesome firepower, but either it completely annihilated what ever it looked at or didn't do anything because 4++ saves can really carry through the low number of shots. I didn't get to use the new order mechanics. My biggest issue is still forgetting half the abilities and losing out in the Boni. I need to prepare a check list or something ...