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I have been curious about something for awhile. How do the eldar and the dark eldar feel about eachother? Also, are there any peices of fluff in either codex that mentions their feelings?

Darkness and light, oil and water, heat and cold. They get along like that: not at all, kill on sight, etc.

They are about as friendly as an Ork is to a Guardsman.

Warrior Coven is a great novel that explores the DE/E relationship.

I think E, as far as I can remember from the DE codex, think of them as the horrible things they CAN be if they give in to the taint of Slaanesh. Therefore the DE are those evil-magic-mirror versions of themselves made flesh, nothing quite so scary eh?

DE I think see Eldar as arrogant elitests who deny who and what they are, who strut around the universe pretending to be better than everyone else, but are a dying race who will slowly wither into nothingness.

Basically they hate each other's guts, two faces of the same coin (except one is really messed up >_< )

No no you got it all wrong its the star trek mirror universe theory here ( when kirk , sulu ,scottyand uhurla) get transported too the mirror universe, there just Mr spocks with goatees that are Into BDSM and are logical....LOL

What's really odd is thier the same race but have developed completey seperate weapons, transports, and societys really. They could have just made the DE a new race/army and no one would know better otherwise.

Well, they've had all the time since the Fall to diverge in all respects: mentally, socially, and technologically. In every way but basic genetics (and in some cases, even there), the two are completely different races.

Posted By Lemartes on 03/23/2007 11:39 AM
What's really odd is thier the same race but have developed completey seperate weapons, transports, and societys really. They could have just made the DE a new race/army and no one would know better otherwise.

As pointed out, they have had millions of years to develop past the fall of their single empire. Also, they do have some similar tech, though this is mainly shown in their bikes and weapons (splinter & Shruiken, Dark Lance and Bright Lance). Next, the DE codex does say that the version of DE shown in it are a raiding force, not a DE army. For all we know (or at least I know) they main DE battle tank my very well be a spiky falcon (spikalcons?) As for society, the bridge between them started before slaneesh, and when the eye of terror was created, they separated then.

Bringers of Death is a Black Library novel that has a short story that kind of shows how the Dark Eldar feel about the Eldar. I have also read a peice of fluff somewhere (Eldar Codex v3) I believe where a Farseer was discussing with a Warlock about how they where trying to seal webway portals off from the Dark Eldar. Other then those two instances, I don't think i've read anything about the two races and how they interact.

Hello all, first post here. I have gotten back recently into 40k and thus the lore so I'm probably a little behind. But the eldar codex suggests that the harlequins may be travelling through the webway to commoragh. I dont know if this suggests some kind of continuity with eldar culture or if its just one of the places the harlequins go in their travels

Posted By mef989 on 03/24/2007 4:30 AM

Posted By Lemartes on 03/23/2007 11:39 AM
What's really odd is thier the same race but have developed completey seperate weapons, transports, and societys really. They could have just made the DE a new race/army and no one would know better otherwise.

As pointed out, they have had millions of years to develop past the fall of their single empire. Also, they do have some similar tech, though this is mainly shown in their bikes and weapons (splinter & Shruiken, Dark Lance and Bright Lance). Next, the DE codex does say that the version of DE shown in it are a raiding force, not a DE army. For all we know (or at least I know) they main DE battle tank my very well be a spiky falcon (spikalcons?) As for society, the bridge between them started before slaneesh, and when the eye of terror was created, they separated then.

I dont have the DE codex, but I always thought that the fall of the eldar and the birth of slaanesh occured sometime in the M20 to M30 range, and coincided with the warp storms that isolated Terra.

As pointed out, they have had millions of years to develop past the fall of their single empire. Also, they do have some similar tech, though this is mainly shown in their bikes and weapons (splinter & Shruiken, Dark Lance and Bright Lance).

Actually, not millions, but more along the lines of 10 to 12 millennia.  Remember, it was the fall of the Eldar and the birth of Slaanesh that cleared away the warp storms and allowed the Emperor to leave a united Terra and begin the Great Crusade.  As to the differences, the Dark Eldar seem to be alot like the "pre-fall" Eldar.  The Craftworld Eldar are the Eldar that believed the predictions of doom and fled the Eldar homeworlds.  The Dark Eldar fled to the webway, hidden within it.  That is how they survived the fall.  The Eldar homeworlds are deep inside the Eye of Terror, formed when the psychic shock of the fall.

Well I'm not sure how they always feel about each other but I remember reading a short story between the eldar and dark eldar. An imperial outpost was set up on one of the eldar home worlds. A small craftworld sent a delegation to the planet telling the imperials that it was a holy ground and asked them to leave. The governor had the small delegation killed and carved their spirit stones into jewelry for him and his family. The craftworld, suitably pissed off, sent a call out through the webway asking for help in cleansing the planet of humans. Ulthwe and Bel Tan showed up to help and began the assault, but then the Dark Eldar showed up too - halfway through the battle. They had heard about what the humans had done to the spirit stones and viewed that act as so barbaric that it could not be overlooked. And so, for a short time the Eldar and their Dark brothers and sisters worked together in blowing the gak out of the planet. They found the governor and reclaimed the spirit stones before handing him and his family over to the dark eldar for their 'punishment.' Then everybody parted company.

I vaguely remember some fluff, though please don't ask me any details about it, that implies the harlequins view the craftworlders, dark eldar, and exodites as one big extended family and want to help bring them all closer together.

Dark eldar are eldar as they were before the fall. A extreme combination of cultist, Evil Genius, and sports enthusiast. They care only for their own pleasure and excitement, and staving off the leeching effects of Slaneesh on their souls. Unlike the Crafworld and Exodite cousins, they have no protection against the draining of their souls and must reinvigour themselves by consuming the souls of others. They see the craftworld and exodite eldar as conservative dullards, like antiquated quakers.

The Craftworld Eldar see this as a frightening exsistance. They must deny and channel their emotions and minds on the eldar path, otherwise they will be consumed at death or denied the purgatory of the infinity circuit. The harlequins see the dark eldar as wayward kin, swooping in to rescue the few they can but stopping those who further the cause of chaos.

The eldar all have roughly the same level of technology, they just choose to utilize it differently. No DE would use unfeeling wraith constructs, let alone become one, but they will use the same technology powered by the souls of captives. Unlike the CE, who make every weapon in a ritualistic fashion, the DE customize everything to suit the bearer. Inevitably that means adding spikes, blades and chains to enable them to enact their various fetishes on the battlefield. No Banshee Exarch would bother to skin the dead and wear it, but DE can and do.

The three can work together or be deadly enemies depending entirely on the circumstances. DE can be just as prideful and arrogant as CE, and some times this makes them allies, but it is always short lived. Even the risk of the 13th black crusade and the invasion of the webway was not enough to deter some DE from their goal of killing CE.

I like what you said except one thing Dark eldar do not worry about chaos. In fact the witch cults even worship/utilize chaos. They feel they are superior and utilize chaos to there will.
Eldar also still utilize chaos so how worried are they really? An ancient race thats that intelligent may find other problems but would not make the same mistake twice. Now its more about survival and destruction or at least "balance" with chaos.

The wytches have alway been portrayed as using chaos to further their own ends. They believe they can get the better of the "deal" because they are superior, and because they enjoy the same fetishes as Slannesh. They don't worship the chaos powers the way Chaos Space Marines do, nor do they attempt to become demons in their own right. They treat demons and chaos just like psychers, playthings to be used for their own amusement and pleasure.

Harlies and CE don't share that view, and thus fear most demons outside the ritually approved Avatar, and the psudo-demon Phoenix lords. CE are also in the process of creating their own "god" to combat Slannesh, so they clearly maintain a level of demonic knowledge. Again, the two just use it in a different way.

Where's this info about the wyches using chaos? Not that I don't believe you, I've just never seen it.

The plot of one of the Ordo Xenos novels, Warrior Coven, deals with the Dark eldar making a pact with a slaneesh demonprince in exchange for power. The exact deal is unknown, but the DE aided the demons in breaching realspace. Lealith freqently comments how she can toy with the demons for her own gain, while at the same time enjoying the temptations of daemonettes. Even though CS Goto is pretty poor in his over all knowledge of the fluff, this portrayal is consistant with the DE codex and the portrayals in the older eldar codexes.