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Can someone tell me what this actually means:

www.tabletopgamingnews.com/

Will GW really sell individual plastic components?

Huh?

GW is going to study BWB for a few months. Then, when they are fully convinced that they can effectively run their own bitz business, they will strike BWB down with great vengeance and furious anger. Some flecks of spittle will fly, but naught will come of it.

GW will then proceed with their own bitz business, which will be run in the fashion of a dog show staffed by chimpanzees.

Hmmm...

Probably closer to the truth than not.

I'd expect prices to go up on those bits, though!

(Ha! You knew it was coming!)

And really, how effective would they really be at running it?

Posted By Jester on 03/27/2007 7:41 PM
GW is going to study BWB for a few months. Then, when they are fully convinced that they can effectively run their own bitz business, they will strike BWB down with great vengeance and furious anger. Some flecks of spittle will fly, but naught will come of it.

GW will then proceed with their own bitz business, which will be run in the fashion of a dog show staffed by chimpanzees.

QFT!!!!

Is this the same GW that said they weren't offering separate bitz for many new models because it lost them money?

Just curious.

Well, the problem is that they can't make just one bit off of one sprue. That is their logic. It's flawed because it is apparent that even buying the full boxes at 45% off that a business can still run effectively selling the individual bits.

GW just wants you to buy the whole kits or at least the whole sprue and charge you a premium to boot. I am sure BWB has effected their sprue sales. I know I haven't ordered a single bit from GW since BWB came into existence and there are probably a lot of people like me.

I recall somebody noting that if BWBits goes under that would make total idiots of people like me who list them as a reason to like the new plastic Devs.

So, what does it mean if GW is now going to sell plastic bits off the sprue?

Posted By Phryxis on 03/27/2007 9:22 PM
I recall somebody noting that if BWBits goes under that would make total idiots of people like me who list them as a reason to like the new plastic Devs.

So, what does it mean if GW is now going to sell plastic bits off the sprue?

They can barely pack their regular merchandise correctly, how does anyone think they could run a plastic bitz service?

Posted By Phryxis on 03/27/2007 9:22 PM
I recall somebody noting that if BWBits goes under that would make total idiots of people like me who list them as a reason to like the new plastic Devs.

So, what does it mean if GW is now going to sell plastic bits off the sprue?

It means they'll be severely overpriced and will make a killing on shipping...

I don't know if GW will actually drive BWBitz into the ground... but I fear that there seems to be a tendency to do so.

I have to say, GW is doing an excellent job of sticking to their business model. Their goal is to cater to a small population that desires high quality miniatures, not market to the masses. An interesting philosophy that makes me question the long-term viability of the company. I read the GW group statements online and was... miffed.

http://investor.games-workshop.com/investor_relations/financial_results/Results2005/full_year/appendix1.htm
This is a link to their director describing GW's business model. I confess that it would make the forehead veins in my econ professor bulge a bit.


http://investor.games-workshop.com/investor_relations/financial_results/Results2006/full_year/businessreview.htm
For those with the patience to read, you'll see what I believe to be a prime example of a business entering a period of stagnation. The author doesn't sound worried, and his solutions to the problem are "make what we do a little better & we'll be good." I don't see innovative thinking in this article, and it troubles me.

I realize it's a bit off topic, but I feel it is crucial for us to read & understand GW's posted explanations for their actions. More often than not, they believe they are acting in accordance with their mission, though the groupthink phenomena make keep them from seeing what those outside the company perceive.

... well, I'm glad all my armies are current & customized thanks to BWbits... I don't know how long they'll last (hopefully as long as GW does), but I'm rootin for them. I can't say I loathe GW, but I am disappointed that the casual hobbyist isn't worth their time or effort, (read the first link--they basically say that in their no-advertising policy).

I am upset there is a bitz ninja instead of a bitz pirate.

Dice Monkey, I often smile at what you say or even chuckle, but do you ever say anything informative or useful? You sound a lot like the type of girls I hook up with.

Chuck

I'm not sure that GW will be offering individual plastic bits at all.

Maybe they will be selling the entire sprue?

The "benefit" being, that they will finally offer ALL sprues?

(At horrible prices, of course. Well, horrible for us.)

Hmmm. I'm not sure where we're getting the assumption that GW will be starting a Bitz service of their own.

From the content of the letter, it seems like GW is satisfied with forcing Battlewagon to sell Bitz off the sprue via a less user-friendly sales model which complies with GW's intellectual property rights. They are also forcing them to "legitimize" both their bit and box businesses with a brick-and-mortar storefront -- again, perfectly within their rights.

There's no definite sign that GW wants to or has the capacity to sell its own bitz off the sprue -- but it does seem to want to force absolute consistency about how online retailers sell their items and use their intellectual property.

That said, forcing BWB to release a PDF catalog and use a phone line to do the EXACT SAME THING it does now is, while reasonable, also more asinine, aggravating, and ineffective as a rabid teacup poodle. Oh well.

-Adso

Alpharius' 'all' sprues for sale sounds more reasonable to me. Selling individual plastic bits would mean that they would have to take a picture of each item would it not - just so you know what you are getting.

Having the pictures up on their site would basically replace the pictures taken down from BWB would it not? Check the pics out on GW and then order from BWB (if they are still around by that time). Kind of defeats the purpose.

If GW starts selling bitz  (very unlikely), then the Spartans have already won.

Wait, terrorists?  Maoists? 

I can't keep up with the propoganda anymore.

Anyway, I think one thing that may be coming out of this is a big expansion of Battlewagon Bitz' service; they may carry more stock and get it at a bigger discount direct from GW.  There is the chance that, even though GW's douchebaggery is wrecking the online shopping cart, that we'll have more bitz to select from in the future.  Every turd has a silver lining, or whatever the saying is.

And I didn't see anywhere in there where GW was starting a plastic bitz service.  I really think that they'll just send you the whole sprue (for the right price, of course).

The best way to counter GWs unfair business tactics is to support the vendors they target. Support BWBitz and the Warstore. Buy from them and show GW that the market has a sense of loyalty worth winning back.

Posted By Tim on 03/28/2007 5:44 AM
The best way to counter GWs unfair business tactics is to support the vendors they target. Support BWBitz and the Warstore. Buy from them and show GW that the market has a sense of loyalty worth winning back.

Interestingly, by inforcing the same rules on BWB as they have on the Warstore, GW was being consistant in their rules. Letting BWB skip over the rules they enforce on Neal would have been unfair to the Warstore. As to who GW targets with this rule, It's all retailers, not just Warstore and BWB. People that shopped with BWB should continue to do so, nothing has changed, it just takes a phone call or email now.

On the subject of GW selling individual plastic bitz: I think someone jumped to a conclusion and everyone else is running with it. There is no indication they are planning to do that.

The changes in BWB were negotiated by the VP of GW's Trade Sales division, the people that deal with independent stores. They don't set policy for mail order. Mail order doesn't have the capability to sell individual bits off sprues. That change would have to come from the warehousing staff first, who would have to set up an entirely different system. The warehouse is run by the UK. They aren't going to change their system based on what US mailorder or Trade Sales decides.

Dunno if there's anything they could do to regain my loyalty.

Burning their upper management in effigy would be a good start.

Posted By Iorek on 03/28/2007 6:21 AM
Burning their upper management in effigy would be a good start.

Why in effigy?

That wouldn't solve things.

I'm pretty sure he meant   Effigy, Massechusetts. It's a small town north of Salem by 7 miles, and they still cling to the old ways of pumpkin eating contests, wooden shoes, and Witch Burnings. Because corporations are evil, any corporate officer is equated with a member of a witches coven, and thus fair game for a good old fashioned saturday night witch burning.

So lure Kirby there, and burn him in Effigy.

That's a good idea. It's a cool little town, too. Very fresh seafood. I went there and had some extremely tasty steamed clams last summer.

/me passes out torches and pitchforks

I expect that there will still be bits being sold on eBay. So far, GW hasn't been able to touch them.

Posted By NAVARRO on 03/28/2007 4:30 AM

means GW spotted Batllewagon. after this they will hunt down costumers that post their minis painted on internet without saying specificaly in capital words their from GW... then a mass strip to check if you have a gw related tattoo on your arse witout their permission.

Really by Copyright law they would never be allowed to do this, the instant you start modifying or slapping paint on it, it becomes your own art work.  And thus can be sold.  It's how someone can sell a piece of artwork that is a collage of magazine clippings.  It's there own modification, and becomes the work of the artist not the orginal source.

And granted it has been a nice service, but really GW has had up there anti deep discount and anti net shopping cart policy for a long time now, this really shouldn't be that big of a suprise to anyone.  Just be happy BW lasted as long as it did.

Posted By NAVARRO on 03/28/2007 8:01 AM

Posted By Fleeing Monkey on 03/28/2007 7:36 AM

Posted By NAVARRO on 03/28/2007 4:30 AM

means GW spotted Batllewagon. after this they will hunt down costumers that post their minis painted on internet without saying specificaly in capital words their from GW... then a mass strip to check if you have a gw related tattoo on your arse witout their permission.

Really by Copyright law they would never be allowed to do this, the instant you start modifying or slapping paint on it, it becomes your own art work.  And thus can be sold.  It's how someone can sell a piece of artwork that is a collage of magazine clippings.  It's there own modification, and becomes the work of the artist not the orginal source.

And granted it has been a nice service, but really GW has had up there anti deep discount and anti net shopping cart policy for a long time now, this really shouldn't be that big of a suprise to anyone.  Just be happy BW lasted as long as it did.

even if i was being sarcastic its not far from the truth...
go check at GW site the IP rules of use and have a blast mate!

heres one example:

<strong class="smallheader">"Photos of Painted Models[/b]

We encourage fellow hobbyists to show off their painting skills by taking photos of their miniatures and putting the on the site. Please remember to correctly credit the IP - "miniature © Games Workshop Ltd 2003-2005. All rights reserved. Used without permission - model painted by xxxxxxx"

and

 

<strong class="smallheader">"T-shirts, Clothes, Tatoos and the Like[/b]

As always, we cannot allow third parties to obtain money from our intellectual property.

This effectively means that you would either have to buy Games Workshop T-shirts or clothes or make them yourself. You would not be able to sell any t-shirts or clothes that you make.

This also means that we cannot allow tattoos as an acceptable use of our IP as a third party necessarily has to perform the "service." "

So  who made that tatoo of a space marine on your butt is doomed >

for full nonsense ridiculous ip rules go check it.

Correct because you are ripping off their trademarked and coyright items.  It's in their right by the laws, just like making a Superman T-Shirt and selling it.  Or getting a Superman Tattoo, Technically the tattoo shops are not allowed to do this unless they get permission from the company/person that holds the rights.

And again they are in full right to request you place a copyright on images even if you painted it, they own the rights of the sculpting, you own the rights of the painting.

This is all just simple copyright law, they have every legal right to do that.  Hell if I caught someone tattooing a logo I designed, and I did not sell the rights to that tattoo shop I would be all over them.  This is why Media/Art have there own set of laws, to protect it's orginal creator, and give correct credit when due.

So does this mean that I could have a painted space marine tattoed on my arse - but I'd also have to have "copyright of games workshop" tattoed on the other cheek?

Oh trust me GW probably has run through a bunch of law suits, stop and desist orders and such from other companies and persons, mostly all of it handled quietly as it's usally done.  Some things fall into Public Domain from it's common use.  (Such as Xerox is not a trademarked name anymore due to the fact of common use from people saying "can you xerox this for me"   And other things they purchase the rights to use.  Heck I have had to slap my own Stop and Desist orders on some people myself.

This is what happens in this type of Law.  Nothing to do with paranoia.

 

And for a comical note, if GW was ripping off J.R.R. Tolkien you would see Dwarves with Bows in their fantasy line...

Yeah, isnt it great telling people how to take your money?

"Can I buy that?"

"Well fill out form S and sign under subsection B..."

"Fack off, nevermind"