Switch Theme:

Power Weapons -- Needlessly Differentiated?  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




Maybe Aspect Warriors could stay above average toughness on that end, but the regular Guardians should be the same as humans.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut







Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Maybe Aspect Warriors could stay above average toughness on that end, but the regular Guardians should be the same as humans.


But many (if not most, Ulthwe *cough*) regular Guardians are former aspect warriors
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






Elder fluff-to-game representation is all sorts of screwed up, that could easily be its own thread. Probably should be.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Duskweaver wrote:
 vipoid wrote:
I can't remember the precise lore description of Power Weapons offhand, but is it reasonable to suggest that they might work in a similar manner? i.e. the shape of the blade makes little difference because it's the power field that does the actual damage.

The original fluff of power weapons was that the energy field worked by disrupting the molecular bonds in the target, essentially making their armour (and flesh) more fragile so the weapon's blade or striking head could more easily deal damage. Sometimes the disruptor field was powerful enough to physically tear the target apart even before the weapon itself made contact (e.g. you could backhand someone with a lightning claw and shred them apart without the blades even having to physically touch their flesh).

Somewhere along the line, BL authors started describing power weapons as very hot, with the energy field working by vaporising the target's armour with intense heat, and power weapon wounds being self-cauterizing (like a lightsabre). But the original fluff never mentioned any heat being involved, just molecular disruption.
Not mutually exclusive though, as that sounds like a process which would generate a large amount of heat. It does certainly lead into the topic of how the shape of a power weapon actually affects its performance.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/16 19:14:50


Consider; Games Workshop rules not so much games but as toolboxes for players to craft an experience from, and open/narrative/matched play just examples of how things can be put together. 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Maybe Aspect Warriors could stay above average toughness on that end, but the regular Guardians should be the same as humans.


But many (if not most, Ulthwe *cough*) regular Guardians are former aspect warriors

I don't mind the occasional Craftworld specific unit like I would with Chapters, but keep in mind I'm trying to attribute it to the armor adding to said toughness.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Maybe Aspect Warriors could stay above average toughness on that end, but the regular Guardians should be the same as humans.


But many (if not most, Ulthwe *cough*) regular Guardians are former aspect warriors

I don't mind the occasional Craftworld specific unit like I would with Chapters, but keep in mind I'm trying to attribute it to the armor adding to said toughness.


Eldar are the primary reason that I think 40k desperately needs an evasion stat. It solves the issue of Eldar and similar units either being glass cannons, or immortal death machines, it's lore-accurate, and just plain more interesting..
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Question for fluffarians:

If they can make "power effect" generators small enough to fit in the hilt of a sword, or a mace, or even a dagger/knife, why isn't EVERYTHING made with this stuff? Why don't we use "power bullets" or "Power missiles", or "Power boots"?

Obviously Power weapon tech is neither rare or difficult to comeby, as seemingly every backwater world somehow has a Relic Powered weapon of a bygone age. once wielded by a mighty hero". Hive planets have rampant power mauls or powered weapons in the hands of Arbites.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut







FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Question for fluffarians:

If they can make "power effect" generators small enough to fit in the hilt of a sword, or a mace, or even a dagger/knife, why isn't EVERYTHING made with this stuff? Why don't we use "power bullets" or "Power missiles", or "Power boots"?

Obviously Power weapon tech is neither rare or difficult to comeby, as seemingly every backwater world somehow has a Relic Powered weapon of a bygone age. once wielded by a mighty hero". Hive planets have rampant power mauls or powered weapons in the hands of Arbites.


I was never under the impression the actual GENERATORS were in the blade, just the emitters. Tons of power weapons (e.g. the Imperial Guard Command squad power sword for both Cadian and Catachan command squads) have a wire going from the pommel to a generator stored elsewhere (in this case, the bionic limb of the wielder for the cadians or a wrist-mounted artifice of some kind, perhaps a battery, for the Catachans).

Pics for reference.
Spoiler:





Presumably those are too large for bullets. Powerfield technology as far as larger weapons may already have been applied (convenient that a krak missile has the same AP capability as a power sword) and power boots absolutely could exist and were, hilariously, part of the Angry Marine fandex. The impracticality of dissolving the ground you're walking on if you leave it on might have something to do with it though.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/16 20:54:36


 
   
Made in at
Been Around the Block




Also they are probably very resource intensive to get - power weapons can last for centuries, even millennia so they’re worth the investment. Power bullets (and with even more miniaturisation at that) would last for seconds...

Also Arbites ‘power mauls’ are more properly shock mauls - they work through delivering a powerful electric shock that stuns the target rather than using a disruption field like a normal power weapon.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/16 21:03:11


 
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut




The hydraphur style arbites mauls very much have a constant power field, and can break a female nobles face with just a small tap. And on full power setting are able to damage combat servitors and crack carapace armour.

If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain. 
   
Made in se
Member of the Malleus





We do have some examples of primarily space marine power weapons without the energy cord to the power pack thing. Keep in mind though that the SM gear is simply bigger. Maybe it can hold a bigger battery or something?

His pattern of returning alive after being declared dead occurred often enough during Cain's career that the Munitorum made a special ruling that Ciaphas Cain is to never be considered dead, despite evidence to the contrary. 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Commissars regularly use Power swords (Raine with her sword) and inquisitors do as well (Eisenhorn with Barbarisata), with no cables. From the fluff I read it's primarily based in the hilt.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/17 13:24:46


 
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Nerak wrote:
We do have some examples of primarily space marine power weapons without the energy cord to the power pack thing. Keep in mind though that the SM gear is simply bigger. Maybe it can hold a bigger battery or something?


It was an arbites weapon though. And was used by a female without any cybernetic augmentation or power armour.

The cables and outside power source seem to be more a thing for lenght of use, when you can't put the sword in to a recharge station. Or when the power unit for it would make the weapon too hard to use for a human, like an IG sized powerfist used without any extra augmentation.

If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain. 
   
Made in se
Member of the Malleus





Karol wrote:
 Nerak wrote:
We do have some examples of primarily space marine power weapons without the energy cord to the power pack thing. Keep in mind though that the SM gear is simply bigger. Maybe it can hold a bigger battery or something?


It was an arbites weapon though. And was used by a female without any cybernetic augmentation or power armour.

The cables and outside power source seem to be more a thing for lenght of use, when you can't put the sword in to a recharge station. Or when the power unit for it would make the weapon too hard to use for a human, like an IG sized powerfist used without any extra augmentation.

Apologies for not looking into it properly. Could you post a picture? Arbites are known for their shock mauls and rarely, if ever, use power weapons.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/17 14:08:47


His pattern of returning alive after being declared dead occurred often enough during Cain's career that the Munitorum made a special ruling that Ciaphas Cain is to never be considered dead, despite evidence to the contrary. 
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut




I only have the book in pdf form. And I am not even sure if it is okey to say I do have it on the forum. It gets used in the first two books by Shira Calpurnia, maybe in the 3ed on too, but I haven't gotten there yet.

Ah and I ment the different type of power maul, and explained the difference between one and the other. Where one has a guard and can be used to do fencing manuvers and only zap the opponents on contact. while the other is a solid slab of metal with power field with an off or on option, used to crush armour, bone and muscle.

If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain. 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Look if we can make power knives and power daggers, we can make power anything basically. I want Power Epees, and power Rapiers!

Power Katanas and Estocs!
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





Since deciding to develop our own rules since 5th Ed., our group had this discussion on differentiating power weapons. Although there was a certain appeal to the minutiae, we didn't feel that creating different classes of power weapons was necessary or even desirable in an already somewhat convoluted melee system. We retained the rules for double strength attacks for certain weapon types, but other abilities could be better represented by simply giving weapon A a +1 strength or weapon B a +1 initiative and so on (we still use initiative).

To us, power weapons represent a technology similar in capability to the ubiquitous light sabre, so it didn't matter what armor an opponent had - the power weapon would go through it. Better armor was still represented by an invulnerable save (including power armor which we gave an invulnerable save of 6++), but we did give all power weapons a rending capability which makes them better against armor on vehicles (yes, we also still use AV and facings).

In summary, we feel the more binary system of power weapons defeating all personal armor is better.
   
 
Forum Index » 40K General Discussion
Go to: