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Which is better against infantry units, the shoota or slugga and choppa equipped ork.

Depends really. If you are planning to waagh/warp across the board, lots of CC is good. If you aren't planning on on getting into CC, go with a shoota.

Sluggas are pistols, go with the choppas.

Shootas are guns, replace the pistol+choppa combo.

slugga boys in vehicles.

shoota boyz on foot.

yeah, slugga boyz could go in a warphead list too, but warpheads are unreliable and shootas might still be better.

I have not thoroughly read the ork codex. question- the nob in a squad of shoota can or cannot take a powerclaw.

rcm2216 wrote:I have not thoroughly read the ork codex. question- the nob in a squad of shoota can or cannot take a powerclaw.

The long answer: read the huge poll thread on this subject in the YMDC forum.


The short answer: Yes. The rules are a bit ambiguous, but the fact that they have pictures in the codex showing a Shoota mob with a Nob with a powerklaw will (right or wrong) make it so that everyone will start playing that way regardless of what the RAW say or don't say.

Shoota boyz and Slugga boyz compliment each other on the table top. Take both.

Yakface: It wouldn't be the first time a GW publication has had an illegal configuration in a picture. I would tend to believe the rules over the colour section. Though, if my opponent was playing the other way, I wouldn't stop them. I'll just be sticking to sluggas until they clear up the issue.

Da Boss wrote:Yakface: It wouldn't be the first time a GW publication has had an illegal configuration in a picture. I would tend to believe the rules over the colour section. Though, if my opponent was playing the other way, I wouldn't stop them. I'll just be sticking to sluggas until they clear up the issue.

But the rules do not clearly state that the Nob cannot take a Powerklaw, so in this case the anecdotal evidence of codex pictures and GW battle reports will most certainly be a deciding factor on how people naturally play the issue and tournament organizers rule on it.

I'm curious to see how effective Orks w/ Sluggas can be for shooting and assault. They have a base 2 attacks and an 18" Shoota. While playing Eldar, I've learned that 18" makes a huge difference for shooting and opens up a lot more possibilities.

The Jan WD (Oz edition) includes a battle report army list with a Nob with PK leading shoota boyz, so that's my answer to that particular issue (until GW issue a FAQ in a year or so...)

I just played a game yesterday where I had 3 mob of sluggas in truck and 1 mob of shootas. the shootas inflicted a wound on an oblit through mass shooting, and the nobz in all squads did the majority of the work.

I'm going to take both in trukks, sometimes the extra dakka is better.

NaZ

Clang wrote:The Jan WD (Oz edition) includes a battle report army list with a Nob with PK leading shoota boyz, so that's my answer to that particular issue (until GW issue a FAQ in a year or so...)

I'd be careful. WD battle reports aren't known for their strict attention to rules.

While WD may not be a rules authority, it can indicate intent. I'm firmly of the belief that it's the designer's intent for shoota mobs to be able to take pks. I think it would better if they couldn't-- it would certainly make sense from a balance perspective.

For a tournament, I would contact the TO to see how to play it. But just ask yourself, would you stop someone from useing a shoota nob w/pk? Would you force them to change their list? Would your soft scores survive that? I hope not.

However I think a better question is if komando nobs can take burnas.

-Leo037

Oh, I wouldn't stop him from putting a PK on his shoota nob. But that's because I prefer the reading that says that shoota nobs can carry PKs. As far as I can tell, it's legal. And even if it were questionable, while I wouldn't do it myself, I wouldn't begrudge him it. I mean, he's not running tri-Falcon Orks.

Now, if my opponent told me he had definitive proof from a WD batrep, whether or not such proof served as supposed substantiation of actual rules, I'd laugh.

I'm surprised people don't mix and match.

2 squads of sluggas with their wierd boy
and
2 squads of shootas

Seems pretty clear to me that you can have Nobz armed with Power Klaws in a mob of shoota boyz. The real question is: Would you want to?

Besides, Shoota boyz and Slugga boyz are complementary units. You should always takes one of each, and preferably two of each.

My perspective is that very often the Orks JUST make CC against an enemy frantically backing away. You don't dare shoot at them for fear of killing the guy who would give you the charge. You can't shoot anyone else lest you deny yourself the charge. Thus, I say go with the pistol option.

I haven't played my Orks since the new Codex, but I have played against them (my Eldar got destroyed by some yesterday) and watched them, and I've started to notice some things...

First off, if you're talking about a big 30 man foot mob, I think Shootas are the default choice. They've got a good volume of shooting which can do some damage, which they got in exchange for CC attacks... Which is more useful? From what I've seen, Orks either get there in big numbers, or they don't get there at all. You won't need the 3,458 attacks Choppas give you, you'll still have a ton from the Shootas, but you can still hurt things that run away.

Put simply, what's the point of extra CC attacks if you're getting 12 unsaved wounds on a 6 man squad?

The only real reason you might need Choppas is to get through the inevitable casualties you're going to take before you get to attack back, even with Furious Charge. Again, though, from what I saw the Orks either had more than enough attacks, or they get wiped out. Generally they either get the charge, lose a few guys, wipe the target... Or they get charged, and get wiped themselves.

The thing is, Orks already have a lot of attacks. This isn't like comparing Tac Maries to Assault Marines. Assault Marines have 50% more attacks on the charge. Slugga boyz only have 33% more.

One thing that's pretty certain, though, is if you're going with Trukk boyz, you want Choppas. They're not going to spend much time (if any) within 18" of anything. And they're a small squad, so they're very vulnerable to the issues of losing too many to make an impact when assaulting I4 or better. They need all the attacks they can get.

One thing to bear in mind with Orks of any kind when assaulting: You generally WANT to assault into cover. Ridiculous as it is, you've got stikkboms, so you go simo. Even if the target's I was better, now it's simo.

My perspective is that very often the Orks JUST make CC against an enemy frantically backing away.

If the enemy is running away from your assault, they're already losing. Very few units can lay down their full firepower down while moving, especially outside of 12". If you're not outside of 12", you're still getting charged, so backing up was pointless, and just puts you closer to running off a table edge instead of maybe breaking out of combat and rallying (not likely), or maybe getting off some shots as you run and taking a few Orks with.

The whole "don't shoot yourself out of charge range" issue is certainly operative for any assault unit, but in a lot of cases the Orks will be using their Waagh move on the turn they assault, and thus won't be shooting anyway. This makes the Slugga doubly useless. You'll simply never shoot it.

By comparison, Shoota Boyz who have been beaten down to a smaller mob (under 11 models) can sometimes give up charging and hide in some decent cover, and lend a little shooting while other Mobs continue the charge.

All in all, I'm rather bummed by the fact that my Ork footslogging force was loaded up with Slugga boyz. Footsloggers are finally good, but now they need Shootas.

Footslogging infantry are always an iffy prospect for getting into assault. Even with the moderately improved pace of orks, it’s likely a canny opponent with mobile units will be able to drag you away from the strategically important parts of the board, or possibly avoid your footslogging orks entirely.

If a unit can put a decent volume of fire out to 18” then they can still contribute well even when they can’t reach melee effectively. For this reason shoota orks should be preferred for footslogging unit unless you have a particularly cunning plan in mind.

Mounted in trucks, on the other hand, you can be a lot more confident of your orks reaching combat. In this situation sluggas become a very good choice, although the open topped nature of the truck means shootas are still viable.

I think the mix an match method works the best. It gives you tactical flexablity and strength. You just have to make sure you position them where they need to be to be effective.