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MacPhail wrote: Where does the 4++ come from? 6+ from SoF, +1 from Celestine's aura, and... what am I missing?
Warlord trait on the canoness that gives her the same AoF improving bubble like Celestine. There's also a strat that buffs a single squad's simulacrum imperialist for 1 phase, too.
the strat can only be used once per game
It's a warlord trait. Every unit in 6 inches improves their shield of faith to a 5+ (specifically a 5+). Then celestine cranks it up to a 4+, and any seraphim would have a 3+.
You...kinda just repeated what he said only you traded out what bonus gets you to 3++. +1 for Celestine +1 for WT, +1 for being a Seraphim, +1 for the Simulacrum strat.
Amishprn86 wrote:And you can also improve the range by 3"
Not...really. Sure, you can improve the Canonesses range by 3"...doesn't help you much when you have to stay within 6 of Celestine anyway.
I went for a little of everything. Lots of Canoness auras, 2 Relics, a bunch of bodies, six tanks, and a wide range of specials and heavies. Roughly speaking, there are several forces here: An alpha strike of two Immolators with Dominions, one with Stormbolters, one with Meltas. Following them at normal speed are two Rhinos, one with Heavy Flamer Rets inside, the other with two Melta-heavy BSS squads, escorting the aura-support characters between them. The last Canoness castles up with Exorcists and Retributors. The BSS screen the backfield, and the Seraphim and Penitent are harassment and countercharge units. I plan on pushing Divine Guidance, Blessed Bolts, and Holy Trinity while looking for other opportunities.
I'll report after tomorrow's game... feedback welcome.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/15 08:42:26
I went for a little of everything. Lots of Canoness auras, 2 Relics, a bunch of bodies, six tanks, and a wide range of specials and heavies. Roughly speaking, there are several forces here: An alpha strike of two Immolators with Dominions, one with Stormbolters, one with Meltas. Following them at normal speed are two Rhinos, one with Heavy Flamer Rets inside, the other with two Melta-heavy BSS squads, escorting the aura-support characters between them. The last Canoness castles up with Exorcists and Retributors. The BSS screen the backfield, and the Seraphim and Penitent are harassment and countercharge units. I plan on pushing Divine Guidance, Blessed Bolts, and Holy Trinity while looking for other opportunities.
I'll report after tomorrow's game... feedback welcome.
Gemini are 25. No free swords. You'll certainly get to try out a lot of unit types with a setup like this.
Just got my CA - anyone not got it let me know if you want to know anything
Good to see that all Sisters Superior can still take a free chainsword Handflamers def up to D6 hits.
My queries to GW at the moment:
Can the Gemini take relics?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/15 11:58:02
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
So far it looks like they can, aka they don't already have one and are characters. I'm disappointed they can't be the warlord. I can understand it, but still disappointed.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Blade of Admonition is unchanged from last year. The rumor where the damage changed turned out to be false.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/15 13:40:40
Remember to give all your superiors chainswords - they are free and donlt remove any weapons.
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
MacPhail wrote: I can pull off six Immolators... who's got the full bakers dozen?
Fixed the power swords on the Geminae... cost me the extra Retributer and brought me down to a respectable 1998.
I have seven plus some new ones from Shieldwolf.
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
Mr Morden wrote: Just got my CA - anyone not got it let me know if you want to know anything
Good to see that all Sisters Superior can still take a free chainsword Handflamers def up to D6 hits.
My queries to GW at the moment:
Can the Gemini take relics?
Top of page 99 specifcially says no. "Geminae Superia, and named characters such as Celestine, cannot be given any of the following relics."
Ah damn - good spot :(
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
After the Ro3 and the nerf to my Doms I’ve been lurking while awaiting this beta codex, and I gotta say I’m extremely disappointed. The tools that worked (fast Seraphims and Celestine) have been trashed and the new faith mechanic is silly considering the acts of faith themselves are nearly useless. The army has no focus - it’s not fast anymore, it doesn’t want to get close, gunline sisters won’t work, and hordes will get smashed by true hordes. Mech isn’t competitive considering the cost of our transports and lack of ranged weapons. And no new choices other than Gemina (who now can’t soak up woundsnfor Celestine). The Convictions don’t make any builds competitive either.
I’ll stick to my allies and the paltry Sisters battalion of 3 BSS in Repressors with 2 Canonesses.
I was hopeful for this Codex but truthfully I’d rather use the index than this beta gak
davidgr33n wrote: After the Ro3 and the nerf to my Doms I’ve been lurking while awaiting this beta codex, and I gotta say I’m extremely disappointed. The tools that worked (fast Seraphims and Celestine) have been trashed and the new faith mechanic is silly considering the acts of faith themselves are nearly useless. The army has no focus - it’s not fast anymore, it doesn’t want to get close, gunline sisters won’t work, and hordes will get smashed by true hordes. Mech isn’t competitive considering the cost of our transports and lack of ranged weapons. And no new choices other than Gemina (who now can’t soak up woundsnfor Celestine). The Convictions don’t make any builds competitive either.
I’ll stick to my allies and the paltry Sisters battalion of 3 BSS in Repressors with 2 Canonesses.
I was hopeful for this Codex but truthfully I’d rather use the index than this beta gak
Basically. The index is far stronger overall, and even that didn't really function that well post rule of 3. We can come up with all the 'combos' or w/e we want to but the end result is polishing a turd at the absolute best.
MacPhail wrote: I can pull off six Immolators... who's got the full bakers dozen?.
Six Repressors (two more under construction) 3 Exorcists, 13 immolator/rhino's. Life is good.
Same boat for me. I have 5 exos, 13 immolators, and 6 repressors. 3 built and 3 in the bitz box. I just ordered 10 more storm bolters yesterday. Ugh. That's a $100 hit i'm not looking forward to.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
davidgr33n wrote: After the Ro3 and the nerf to my Doms I’ve been lurking while awaiting this beta codex, and I gotta say I’m extremely disappointed. The tools that worked (fast Seraphims and Celestine) have been trashed and the new faith mechanic is silly considering the acts of faith themselves are nearly useless. The army has no focus - it’s not fast anymore, it doesn’t want to get close, gunline sisters won’t work, and hordes will get smashed by true hordes. Mech isn’t competitive considering the cost of our transports and lack of ranged weapons. And no new choices other than Gemina (who now can’t soak up woundsnfor Celestine). The Convictions don’t make any builds competitive either.
I’ll stick to my allies and the paltry Sisters battalion of 3 BSS in Repressors with 2 Canonesses.
I was hopeful for this Codex but truthfully I’d rather use the index than this beta gak
Get out of my head you witch. It looks like I'll sticking with Battalion + Outrider + Castellan for the foreseeable future.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/16 04:03:52
I got a quick win today against AdMech. My opponent conceded after Turn 2 with all of his HQs alive, but only one Onager, one Kastellan, and one undamaged Ranger squad. I had lost 2 Immolators, a Rhino, and squads of Seraphim, Dominions, and Sisters, but I had both Exorcists, two melta squads, heavy flamers, Celestine, and lots of infantry left to secure the board.
I tried Vessels with Divine Guidance to some good effect, and I managed to deploy Blessed Bolts, Holy Trinity, and Burning Descent. They were all mostly as advertised, but I found them all pretty circumstantial. MVPs were the Stormbolter Doms (with two uses of Blessed Bolts they tallied a unit of Sicarians in each turn) and the Exorcists (who bagged two Kastellans and were about to finish the third). Double-melta BSS squads accounted for an Onager on their own, which was a nice return on investment. The Penitent Engine chopped down a Dragoon, but died before making back its points. Letdowns included Seraphim, who just aren't very mobile, and Acts of Faith, which were laborious and seemed to struggle with how much impact was reasonable.
More thoughts as I have them... but the general assessment that this army doesn't have a clear sense of direction seems accurate so far. Stratagems had a bigger impact on game planning the AoFs, which didn't feel quite right.
And no new choices other than Gemina (who now can’t soak up woundsnfor Celestine)
If they are within 3" of St Celestine they can on a 2+ but get a Mortal Wound which is much worse than before especially since once both are dead thats it for them.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/16 08:42:43
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
MacPhail wrote: I got a quick win today against AdMech. My opponent conceded after Turn 2 with all of his HQs alive, but only one Onager, one Kastellan, and one undamaged Ranger squad. I had lost 2 Immolators, a Rhino, and squads of Seraphim, Dominions, and Sisters, but I had both Exorcists, two melta squads, heavy flamers, Celestine, and lots of infantry left to secure the board.
I tried Vessels with Divine Guidance to some good effect, and I managed to deploy Blessed Bolts, Holy Trinity, and Burning Descent. They were all mostly as advertised, but I found them all pretty circumstantial. MVPs were the Stormbolter Doms (with two uses of Blessed Bolts they tallied a unit of Sicarians in each turn) and the Exorcists (who bagged two Kastellans and were about to finish the third). Double-melta BSS squads accounted for an Onager on their own, which was a nice return on investment. The Penitent Engine chopped down a Dragoon, but died before making back its points. Letdowns included Seraphim, who just aren't very mobile, and Acts of Faith, which were laborious and seemed to struggle with how much impact was reasonable.
More thoughts as I have them... but the general assessment that this army doesn't have a clear sense of direction seems accurate so far. Stratagems had a bigger impact on game planning the AoFs, which didn't feel quite right.
Similar conclusions to what I've been seeing. Got another couple games in (v Thousand Sons and Orks), and Sisters have a couple strengths, but more weaknesses.
I'm having a really difficult time getting to backfield units, everything is just too slow. Dropping in Seraphim is a death trap, and breaking them away from the Aura buffs means they are just as dead before getting anywhere. I'll likely end up allying in an Assassin Vanguard (I was using one before Beta) so I'll at least have something that can hit softer backfield heavy weapons. That doesn't help the Beta Codex though. Exorcists are good against backfield vehicles, but jusy don't have the RoF for things like Lootas, HWTs, etc.
I will say that I love our Psychic defence, it's probably THE change to the army I like. It was instrumental to beating a Thousand Sons army. Combo the Brazier with Suffer the Witch and purity of Faith and it really gives psychic armies a tough time.
Psychic defense and Invuln Auras are our biggest strengths right now.
Sometimes, you just gotta take something cause the model is freakin cool...
Creeping Dementia wrote: I'm having a really difficult time getting to backfield units, everything is just too slow. Dropping in Seraphim is a death trap, and breaking them away from the Aura buffs means they are just as dead before getting anywhere. I'll likely end up allying in an Assassin Vanguard (I was using one before Beta) so I'll at least have something that can hit softer backfield heavy weapons. That doesn't help the Beta Codex though. Exorcists are good against backfield vehicles, but jusy don't have the RoF for things like Lootas, HWTs, etc.
I have a hope that running two Exorcists, parking them near a Canoness, and assuming that your shooting phase re-roll goes to one of the Heavy d6 rolls every time MIGHT just make them consistent enough to plan around. I would have been one round faster in resolving the threat from the Kastellans if I hadn't had to fall an Exo back on a poorly screened flank.
This AdMech matchup revealed another weakness of Seraphim, which is that without flyers, they draw all of the enhanced AA fire (in this case an Onager with Icarus Array). The IP Seraphim never made it off the line, and the HF Seraphim basically traded themselves for a Ranger squad. I suspect their only viable use is to drop out of LoS on Turn 2 and deliver the strike on Turn 3, assuming your opponent hasn't repositioned. The Burning Descent strat was decent, but might have been better on a full size unit... I found myself wishing for more pistols when the regular Shooting phase rolled around to finish the job I'd started in the Movement phase.
Automatically Appended Next Post: A question came up in that game... does Vessels turn an AoF into an aura that can then be extended by the Book of St. Lucius? The word "aura" does not appear on the Vessels stratagem, but it is part of the phrasing of the relic...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/16 18:42:03
So is it me or is the rumoured email address for sending SoB Beta feedback not actually inside the CA2018 book? I looked twice and can't find any email address...
Overall the codex is a blanket nerf compared to the Index army. Maybe they want to make things worse so they can then claim a true 2019 codex is amazing when all it does is bring Sisters back up to the level of the index rules
Personally I wouldn't mind the nerfs if we at least regained a wider selection of characters and a couple of new fun units. I knew things were going to suck the moment I saw the photo of Veridyan and below it just said "Canoness"...
I want Celestine, Ephrael, Veridyan, Mirya and Verity, plus a couple of new alternates for Celestine. It's just so lame and boring how there are no choices and haven't been for like 10+ years.
Amishprn86 wrote:And you can also improve the range by 3"
Not...really. Sure, you can improve the Canonesses range by 3"...doesn't help you much when you have to stay within 6 of Celestine anyway.
Yeah, i'm questioning this as well. I mean does the relic affect the warlord trait? Or is it just things listed in the "abilities" section of the datasheet?
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2018/12/16 19:26:57
Amishprn86 wrote:And you can also improve the range by 3"
Not...really. Sure, you can improve the Canonesses range by 3"...doesn't help you much when you have to stay within 6 of Celestine anyway.
Drider wrote: Yeah, i'm questioning this as well. I mean does the relic affect the warlord trait? Or is it just things listed in the "abilities" section of the datasheet?
It says "the range of the bearer's auras"
BRB Aura says "have abilities that affect certain models within a given range. Unless the ability in question says otherwise, a model with a rule like this is always within range of the effect"
So it will work on anything that says out to a certain range, even if that bearer has multiple auras it will work.
Edit: The quote broke, edit to fix it.
This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2018/12/16 19:39:01
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