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Hello and thanks for reading! This is my first time on these forums and i saw a few posts like this and figured i would try to get some advice. I played "back in the day" and realize that much has changed (like no magic box and while chaos has two army books at least they don’t get their own boxed set anymore.) Through the ages i have played (owned) a high elf army, undead, empire, and skaven armies. while they all had their fun moments i never really found something that fit my play style so i quit playing altogether. I am returning to visit a friend for a couple months and his local group has a paint and play league that i hope to get into start from the ground up. About my playstyle...I have the absloutly worse luck ever when it comes to wargames, if it can go wrong, it will go wrong (for those that play 40k i have an eldar army and my 'invincible' tanks rarely last through round 2) I need something that has a decent mixture of units coupled with sturdiness (to survive the bad luck) which eliminates most toughness 3 armies. I absloutly HATE the thought of ogres, lizardmen, skaven, beasts, dwarves, and dark elves. Cost is a factor (as in the everpresent $$ to points ratio) as well as the ability to customize the army (mod it out so it is unique) which leads me to believe that TKs will probably be removed from the equation there. I am not HUGE on warmachines and am the kind of player that would NEVER use a steamtank…if I wanted that I would play 40k. My friend is trying (really really trying) to get me to do O&G I got the armybook and am having a hard time stomaching a lot of the stuff in it, but the base 4 toughness with cheap units is a nice thing.
If you have gotten this far it comes down to, solid army that can take a turn or two of the dice just not working that well for you. Has to be able to be made unique, I don’t mind spending the time to mod out something or greenstuff all night. While not necessary having some giant gnarly beasts would be cool as well (IE: Giant or dragons) And the available options for me would be TK, O&G, Brets, HE, WE, hordes, and maybe empire (mostly because I still have my old army but can trade it off for money/a new one) I appreciate you guys taking the time to read this and look forward to talkin with you soon. Ill throw a poll up and would apperciate comments on the relative merits of the armies above.


C

I'm just starting fantasy, so I can't give you much advise. However, I did ask a question about armies with good $$-to-points ratios, and some of the answers I got were Brettonians, Dwarves, Ogres, and Wood Elf forest spirit armies.

I didn't vote, because I don't think I really know enough about the game yet to give good advice. If I had, it probably would have been Wood Elves. I started Brettonians, but soon found out that they're considered an overpowered army (at least in my area). And since you're not interested in Dwarves or Ogres, that only leaves a Wood Elf forest spirit army. Be aware, though, that some Wood Elf builds are also considered overpowered as well (but not forest spirit armies, apparently).

I would ask why you've listed empire and high elves as a choice in your poll, if you've tried them before and found they weren't a good fit for you.

In terms of cost to points ratio I'd say your best bet would be an all cav Hordes army; a couple units of Chaos Knights and some Marauder Horsemen is a solid force. However, beware the fact that most rumors point to GW making that type of force illegal in a couple months with a WD update to the Hordes book.

I you don't like warmachines don't play empire; they're pretty much required for any such army.

TK are fairly inflexible, but pretty resilient due to their magic. Plus chariots are cool.

High Elves are really good in their current incarnation thanks to Always Strike First. Swordmasters will pretty much hammer anything that tries to charge their forward arch. Not a forgiving army though, and very vulnerable to shooting.

WE are really effective due to their shear maneuverability, but they require alot of finnesse and don't hold up well to mistakes or poor luck.

While you didn't mention VC that's the army I would go with. You'll usually spend half your points on characters which pulls the price down significantly; at least so long as you don't build a summoning horde. Plus its really durable thanks to inovcation which allows you to heal any unit in your army.

Allow me to quote Bauhaus when I say:

Undead, undead, undead.

Undead never break, never panic, and always do what they’re told. They win primarily by stable static combat resolution, with a few hitty things, but the ability to just eat a few extra wounds and keep going if they fluff a round of attacks. Undead line units lose combat a lot, but they don’t run away. You just raise more. And the moment your opponent rolls badly (blows a Fear test to charge, fluffs a round of attacks) is when you eat his lunch.

Tomb Kings are honestly exactly what you’re looking for in terms of reliability and resilience. Vampires Counts casters can still Miscast when using magic, which can really screw you. Tomb Kings never miscast. Their spells always work, unless your opponent manages to dispel them, but your list will be built to overwhelm his dispel attempts (at least after you burn through his scrolls in the early turns).

Undead also paint up really easily and DO have some good scope for conversions. You just have to be a little bit creative. But it’s not exactly hard to get creative with multipart plastic kits for walking corpses. Vampires have more model variety than Tomb Kings, so choosing between them is probably a matter of what’s higher priority- more modeling/unit variety, or the ultimate in reliability.

If you don’t want to do undead, another great choice for the risk-averse is Lizards (Cold Blooded= take all LD tests on 3d6 drop the highest, Slann can be immune to miscasts), but you ruled them out.

I'd stay away from Hordes of Chaos, at least until the new list comes out.

Thanks for the replies so far guys it (really) is much apperciated. From what i hear about my (so-to-be local) gamestore they have a boatload of bret players there. I kept empire on the list because i have a full army already but it sounds like i should avoid them since i dont like all the tech. I have been reading rumours that hordes are going to be redone soon as well, which led me to be somewhat leery of them, and i didnt put VC down because the thought of a vampire army really isnt my bag...ive been taking some ancient history/art classes at my college and all the egypt and medieval stuff ive absorbed kept making me think of TK and brets. I wonder who voted for O&G though, i know you can put together an army pretty cheap with the BFSP stuff.

The problem is that you can really screw yourself with animosity and casting in an O&G army so if you want reliability they're about as far from that as you can get. I recently started TK and my only issue so far is that if you go up against the new VC you pretty much lose. They have everything you have, but better. Other than that I've been happy with them. If TK is the way you decide to go then all I can say is this: Bone Giants.

If your looking to have a good time, which I hope is everyone's reason to play, O&G cannot do you a wrong, the wacky style of the game, and overall uncertainty makes every game different, and while having bad luck im most cases is bad, It can sometimes (and I say that loosly) be a boon, for me the models are great painting them is an adventure in its own right, and for me its the only way Id play, but if your looking for consistancy, go Lizardmen, easy play style, very versitle, and paint friendly. Just what ever you do, dont go Vampire Count, everyone and their mother are playing them, have some orginality

I am definetly not a fan of VC, mostly because i dont really like vamps in general and i know there is a million vc players that came out of the woodwork with the recent release. I guess im just looking for something to match the visual i have in my head of how a fantasy match should play out with pitched battles in the middle (big blocks of troops locked in struggle) and some crazy hero wandering around slugging it out against inhuman odds and some elite troops that can just blast through lines and punch holes in defenses, crushing the skulls of my enemies underfoot the whole way through

Orcs can do that, I personally love orcs check out a few of the models on the GW website, like I said their overall unsureness of the battle makes for a good game no-matter what, unless you get mad quickly, then stay away from orcs, their little bumps and hick-ups will make you want to throw you dice across the room. But if your easy going and level headed then I would say orcs. Also if you get tired of doing that you can do like themed armies, all goblins with Fanatic's (One of the coolest units in the game IMO.) Or Squigg hordes! Everyone loves Squiggs, run them out in to the enemy and let the unit break, watch squigg's running a-muck! Ruining all your enemys plans....I do love orcs.

Thanks again for the reply, i have a tau army im trying to trade right now i have an offer for bretonnians and O&G Ill keep everyone updated. my gut is leading me towards TK though to be honest

Don't play tomb kings unless you're prepared to lose every game until you become really good at the game. O&G are fun but if you get frustrated by losing the game to random dice rolls then don't pick it up. Brets are good but really boring, you're either going to have a very one dimensional army that is really boring to play, or you're going to have an army that you'll win with every time and no one will want to play you. HE I think are a decent starting army and I like the models. WE are again one of those armies that requires you do really know the game to do well with. Hope this helps.

TK don't take THAT much skill. If you start off with three priests, a King with Destroyer of Eternies on foot in a block or the "re-grow my unit" weapon on a chariot in a unit of chariots, and 2-3 Tomb Scorpions (Hey, I have better combat abilities than a Chaos Lord for 85pts!), the rest of your list can be pretty flexible.

The past few days have been filled with an absloute TON of research and talking with people (thanks especially for the help in this thread alone and the continued patience with a flighty fantasy freak)
Hopefully today i can swing by my local game store and see if they have the tomb kings and maybe high elf books, i figure its down to those three armies, but to be honest the high elf figs look the same as they did in 3rd-4th edition, i dont see much difference (outside the chariot and characters.) After pouring over the past 10ish pages of threads on this forum attrition seems to be a reoccuring theme with the armies people pick, many want ranged shooty things or armies that can dominate the magic phase...to be honest i want an armie that can have units locked in combat and win the battles of attrition, Im not a huge fan of magic in any system i prefer either sneaky things (assassins and such) or beef units (black orks).

C

For those that continue reading my helpless pleas i apperciate it and hope to one day return the favor for someone in my shoes.