Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

a updated List is posted down the page
Another updated List is posted down at the bottom of the page
HQ 1: (140)
Socerer
*Terminator Armor
*IoS
*Lash of submission

HQ 2:(155)
Daemon Prince
*Wings
*IoS
*Lash of submission

Elite 1: (260)
Chosen Space Marines x 10
*Champion
*2 x Power fist
*2 x Flamer
*IoCG

Elite 2: (260)
Chosen Space Marines x 10
*Champion
*2 x Power fist
*2 x Flamer
*IoCG

Troop 1: (245) ---------Socerer attached to this unit
Noise Marines x 8
*Champion with PW, DS
*8 x Sonic Blasters

Troop 2: (245)
Noise Marines x 8
*Champion with PW, DS
*8 x Sonic Blasters

Troop 3: (245)
Noise Marines x 8
*Champion with PW, DS
*8 x Sonic Blasters

Heavy Support 1: (150)
Obliterators x 2

Heavy Support 2: (150)
Obliterators x 2

Heavy Support 3: (150)
Obliterators x 2 or Stock Defiler x 1 (Any suggestions?)

this adds up to 2000 points

this list is what i've came up with to deal with any army
please have a good look at it and suggestions will be much appreciated

the reason i am using chosen space marines are because of their special rule, Infiltrate

Looks decent, but give the Noise Champs PFs, because if a Dread charges you, game over. Get something to attach your Sorcerer to, maybe some Termies.

Cheese Elemental wrote:Looks decent, but give the Noise Champs PFs, because if a Dread charges you, game over. Get something to attach your Sorcerer to, maybe some Termies.

i would stay with the PW, i dont want anyone with I5, striking last..

i am pretty sure i can shoot down at least one vehicle or dreadnaught in one turn with that many anti tank

News: 6 Oblits in 2k points is not a lot of AT.

I'd be more worried about things like enemy DPs or Flyrants than Dreads. If your Chosen Infiltrate, that means that if your opponent downs you DP, there's nothing in the rest of your main force that can seriously threaten something like that if it hits your lines. At least put a PF in one of those squads.

As for wasting the I 5, don't get hung up on it. Karandras wastes I 7 and he's still good.

tegeus-Cromis wrote:News: 6 Oblits in 2k points is not a lot of AT.

I'd be more worried about things like enemy DPs or Flyrants than Dreads. If your Chosen Infiltrate, that means that if your opponent downs you DP, there's nothing in the rest of your main force that can seriously threaten something like that if it hits your lines. At least put a PF in one of those squads.

As for wasting the I 5, don't get hung up on it. Karandras wastes I 7 and he's still good.

can you please give me a example of a whats lot of AT in a 2k game?

i think i need to rebuild my list

9 Oblits.

Or 6 Oblits with some squad-borne AT. Or mauleed Marines, or any shooty DE army, or any decent IG.

I'm not saying you necessarily need more AT, just that you seem to think 6 Oblits in 2k is a lot, but it isn't. It's enough to scrape by, I guess.

tegeus-Cromis wrote:9 Oblits.

Or 6 Oblits with some squad-borne AT. Or mauleed Marines, or any shooty DE army, or any decent IG.

I'm not saying you necessarily need more AT, just that you seem to think 6 Oblits in 2k is a lot, but it isn't. It's enough to scrape by, I guess.

9 Oblits ? thats 675 points
for a 2000 army it is not too much?

would'nt it lowers the number of troops or elites down?

I'm not saying take 9 Oblits (although that wouldn't be an awful idea). I'm saying don't take 6 Oblits and no other ranged AT and think your army is well-insured against tanks and MCs. It isn't. It can scrape by if you're lucky. Of course it depends on your gaming environment as well.

And of course it would lower the amount of other stuff you could take. How could it not?

HQ 1: (140)
Socerer
*Terminator Armor
*IoS
*Lash of submission

HQ 2: (155)
Daemon Prince
*Wings
*IoS
*Lash of submission

Elite 1: (320)
Chosen Space Marines x 10
*Champion
*4 x Power fist
*IoK

Troop 1: (200) ---------Socerer attached to this unit
Noise Marines x 8
*8 x Sonic Blasters

Troop 2: (240)
Noise Marines x 8
*Champion with PF
*8 x Sonic Blasters

Troop 3: (240)
Noise Marines x 8
*Champion with PF
*8 x Sonic Blasters

Heavy Support 1: (225)
Obliterators x 3

Heavy Support 2: (225)
Obliterators x 3

Heavy Support 3: (255)
Landraider with Extra armor and Daemonic Possession

this is a new list that i've came up with

the Chosen squad is riding on the landrider, it has 4 PF.. is that a good idea to have 4 in that unit? and a Icon of Khorne, charging with alot of attacks..
definitely, a champ with PF has 5 attacks on a charge, and the other 3 PFs has 4 attacks..
would this unit be very powerful?

your kinda putting all your eggs in one basket with that 4man PF squad. What if the LR gets knocked out first round of combat? (Ive seen it happen) Or what if a guard player Drop pods a ton of meltas and demo charges the sucker? (seen this happen before too)
Or what if your crafty opponent sees what you are doing and moves his army around avoiding your Lr until like round 5..
Bottom line spread the PF's out over your army. They will live longer.

stone1208 wrote:this is a new list that i've came up with

the Chosen squad is riding on the landrider, it has 4 PF.. is that a good idea to have 4 in that unit? and a Icon of Khorne, charging with alot of attacks..
definitely, a champ with PF has 5 attacks on a charge, and the other 3 PFs has 4 attacks..
would this unit be very powerful?

You originally stated you took the Chosen because of their infiltrate ability. Putting them in a LR kind of defeats that purpose. I'd dump the LR and get more Oblits, and then maybe swap out the Khorne squad with another Noise Marine squad and give the champion a Doom Siren. That way, you can fire into a squad with all your sonic blasters and Doom Siren, which should thin the numbers down, and then assault with the higher initiative of the regular NMs and then clean up with the the PF armed Champion. With that combination you wouldn't need a bunch of PFs.

Hmmm might wanna read my Chaos Space Marine Army Analysis...

http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Chaos_Space_Marines_Army_Analysis

Chosen are bad even in 5th edition.

I highly recommend one unit of Thousand Sons in any army, especially one using Lash.

FYI my Chaos army now has 9 oblits in it at 1750 points and 2 lash princes...you have 250 more points to spend but not a better army...

Run 3 Kult Choices...concentrate your army and leave large marine count armies to the smurfs.

Hey, Stelek, mind taking a look at my list and tell me what you think?

Sorc, trash.
Chosen, trash.
Land Raider doesn't fit, ditch it.

Decide if you want alot of Noise Marines.

Give them two HQ's to support them, and the obliterator anti-tank anti-MC firepower NM need.

You don't HAVE to run two DP. You can run sorc with lash and warptime (I see it being very popular) but give them wings for mobility.

Whatever you do, focus on the kind of army you want to have. You can take my advice and plug almost anything into it. Terminators, Raptors, Kult troops...they all work just fine. Figure out what you want, and run with it.

Chosen? Trash? I think not.
Sorcerer? Trash? Everything except Spawn are useful to CSM. Nothing wrong with a LR in a shooty army.

Stelek wrote:You don't HAVE to run two DP. You can run sorc with lash and warptime (I see it being very popular) but give them wings for mobility.

a socerer can only have one psychic power?
it can have two with a mark of Tzeentch, but then it cannot have lash of submission

familiar.

Woops sorry that should have said 'or' not 'and'. Warptime will be popular because you can use a force weapon after you get a wound off and blow up a IC.

HQ 1-155
Daemon Prince
*Mark of Slaanesh
*Lash of Submission
*Wings

HQ 2-155
Daemon Prince
*Mark of Slaanesh
*Lash of Submission
*Wings

Troop 1-246
*7 x Thousand Sonds
*A.Socerer (Bolt of change)

Troop 2-246
*7 x Thousand Sonds with
*A.Socerer (Bolt of change)

Troop 3-246
*7 x Thousand Sonds with
*A.Socerer (Bolt of change)

Troop 4-215
7 x Noise Marines - A.Champion (Powerfist), 7 x Sonic Blasters

Troop 5-215
7 x Noise Marines - A.Champion (Powerfist), 7 x Sonic Blasters

Heavy Support 1-225
3 x Obliterators

Heavy Support 2-225
3 x Obliterators

Heavy Support 3-225
3 x Obliterators

this list comes down to 1998 points

advices will be appreciated

gamefiend wrote:familiar.

you are right
i've forgotten about the familiar~ lol

Last list looks very stable.

Stelek wrote:Chosen, trash.

Infiltrate is actually fairly useful to try to gain some measure of board control early on. Put into terrain, they'll benefit from cover, and a full squad can have up to 4 special weapons. Add an icon of Chaos Glory, and you have a very annoying unit in the midfield that isn't going to break easily, and can be reinforced through deepstrike without fear of scattering. 4 plasmaguns can reach up to 24" away - S7 can fry most light vehicles and AP2 rapidfiring can fry anyone trying to reach them in assault. Double up for twice the annoyance. In a 2000-2500 point games, I don't see why not.

that's a lot of points to give up for one shot, which is all they'll get if they're threatening. They're still just expensive marines, like cult troops, except that cult troops are fearless and get useful abilities on top of that. Chosen aren't tougher than anything in the C:SM list, but cost a a great deal more with all the specials.

In a void, the Chosen are pretty good. Within the context of the C:SM list though, they are trash. Heavy weapons? Oblits. CC? DPs, zerkers, raptors. dakka? TS, EC, PM.

Chosen, like vanilla CSMs get choked out of a list due to much better options.

You can surely use the Chosen, and they won't auto-lose, but you take the Chosen with IMO the understanding that they are not the best choice you could have made.

Chosens with a ML and an icon can work pretty will in a deep strike heavy enviroment. And might give some board control benefits depending on the scenario. But other then that they are what everyone sais "Expensive chaos marines".

in the 5th version
power weapon, power fist, lighting claws, chainfist with a pistol does not gain the extra 1 attack anymore..
therefore i do not wat to have the chosens with 4 power fist in one unit.. for my 2000 army list, i think my last post is good.. should be able to take on any army.. whether winning or not.. all depends on how you play it

i have one more question to ask
with thousand sons, it can only rapid fire in 12", this way, the enemy will be able to charge you no matter wat, unless they are also slow on purposeful.. Thousand sons are very weak in CC .. what can be done to it?

PW with a pistol doesn't get +1 A? Surely you're mistaken.

Use the TSons with another squad that's good in CC (NMs or PMs--zerks are pretty weak). Also, don't feel that you must always close to 12". Sometimes it's better to stay at 24" (or 18" if the Sorc has Doombolt).

also, if you're closing into 12" of a unit that you've been firing at for the last few turns, you're probably rapidfiring to finish it off.

tegeus-Cromis wrote:PW with a pistol doesn't get +1 A? Surely you're mistaken.

Use the TSons with another squad that's good in CC (NMs or PMs--zerks are pretty weak). Also, don't feel that you must always close to 12". Sometimes it's better to stay at 24" (or 18" if the Sorc has Doombolt).

thats in the 5th edition
i have been told by GW staff
which means a champ with a PW and a pistol, on charge, is a maximum of 3 attacks with the PW, not 4 anymore

i have 2 units of 7noise marines supporting with there SBs, they will be sitting with my obliterators and shoot~ i was gonna use 3 units of 8thousand sons walkin up the field taking all the fire.. since they have Invunerable save on 4+, and the AP3 bolters are going to shoot down a fair few marines in one turn (hopefully)

how does that sound? but i am really worrying about my thousand sons getting into CC

suggestions will be much appreciated

Stone I don't think I've heard that Power weapons are on that list. Still the Fist thing is right, and those multiple fist squads are getting toned down. (I have one in my Blood Angels list that I'm giving a hard look at)