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I've been playing around with lists and toying with the shooty side of the nids. I'm trying to stay away from complete godzilla, but i just dont think its possible.

I really like shooty warriors but having never used them in practice i'm not sure of their performance and am still debating how to properly arm them. Pretty much my debate is deathspitter/scytals vs twin devourers. The deathspiiters are str6 so they can hurt light vehicles and the new blast rules make them great against hordes and they also have a nice 24" range. The devourers will just make a mess agaisnt infantry. 20 str4 hits with re-rolls on everything is nasty. The downside in my opinion is the range. 18" means if you move in range of orcs they can waagh and hit you. Marines can walk into rapid fire range. Opposing gaunts can assault you, etc. I think this can be negated by ganging up on units with either a warrior brood + fex/tyrant, both warrior broods, or giving them a gaunt shield. I really dont wanna give them cover saves so the gaunt shield sounds unappealing. I'm kinda up in the air at the moment.

I based the list loosely on the old Iron Warriors gunline i used in 3rd. I'm not sure how it wil ltranslate to 5th in concept but i guess thats what playing games are for. Pretty much its a solid core of guns backed up but 2-3 hitty CC units for when something reaches your lines, or for taking the fight to another gunline. The nid army has the advantage that everything is relatively hitty in cc.

Enough talk, here's the list. I used the deathspitter warrior for now.

HQ:
Flyrant - wings, 2x scytal, AG: I + WS, toxin sacs, implant attack.

Tyrant - VC, twin devourers, ES, toxin sacs 2x tyrant guard

Elites:
Warrior brood - 5x warriors with toxin sacs, scy tals and deathspitters, one with barbed strangler

Warrior Brood - same as above

Dakkafex - 2 twin devourers, ES

Troops:
Spinegaunts - x20

Spinegaunts - x20

Spinegaunts - x20

Genestealers - 8x with feeder tendrils

Genestealers - 8x with feeder tendrils

Heavy Support:
Carnifex - Barbed Strangler, Scytals, Reinforced Chitin, Mace tail, AG:WS

Carnifex - same as above

Carnifex - same as above


It came to 1844 when i added it up last night, but i'm at work going off memory so I might have missed some biomorphs but I'm throwing this out as a general idea.

The flyrant is to kill nasty stuff. I could replace it with a BL and retinue but they arent as mobile and I feel i'm going to need the mobility to react to incomming assault.

I added CC biomorphs to the Heavy fex's as I have a feeling they will probably end up seeing some combat anyways, so might as well make them OK at it. Would i be better off with sniperfex's? The VC's would be able to put some glances on vehicles to slow em down and stop shooting. Nothing is set in stone yet so i can find points for things if I really have too.

Any opinions?

I would pick a Winged devourer Hive tyrant with warp field and implant attack. Its possible for him to deepstrike and devourer away!!!

I dunno what you want to do with your second hive tyrant.. You want to get in CC? dont pick the Vennom cannon because you cant run and shoot. You want to shoot? then use your points to upgrade your carnifexes OR give him 2 sets of devourers OR a twin linked Barbed Strangler..

I love the Barbed Strangler in 5th edition! do you know you can get elite carnifexes with barbed strangler?

The Genestealers are still getting killed even with the cover from guants.. every bolter, heavy bolter etc. ignores the guants and shoots at the genestealers. I would go for the scuttlers-genestealers and let them enter from the side board edge.

The gaunts die faster then before and that sucks!

in 4th edition as a fearless (synapse)you had to make armor saves for being outnumbered in CC. NOW you have to make armor saves for every wound you lost the combat by... your gaunts will die twice as fast!!

I like the warriors because I really like the Tyranid blast template!! I also love the Barbed Strangler..Did I mentioned that before.. 8)

Warp field is a joke. 6+ invulnerable? If anything I'd give him carapace. I want the flyrant to be able to reliably kill things like orc warbosses and other MC's. He'll do that with 6 armor ignoring implant attacks.

The walking tyrant is for fire support, i dont know what about his gear makes you think i would want him in combat. The VC is not as useless in 5th as people would want you to believe. I'd rather have the VC on a walking tyrant than 2 set's of dev's

Yes I know i can get elite carnifex's with stranglers. But my elite slots are full and i have 3 heavy fex's with them.

Gaunts die, its what they do. They are a speedbump.

Can't give flyrant carapace, thus you take warpfield for the 2+. The Invulnerable is just a bit of icing. And that 2+ is pretty much a must in 5ed (no way you can hide the flyrant all the way into combat outside of a city table).

You want to reliably kill MCs with the flyrant? Take acid maw then. Also miasma is better then ws gland IMHO (cheaper iirc for the same effect on your rolls). I'd add that the firepower a twin devourers tyrant throws out more then makes up for losing 2 ccw attacks. YMMV.

Also flesh hooks are worth the 3 points on the flyrant. Don't go Int1 when you can kill bosses and MCs before they get to strike.

I think gunfexes would be better. This is a shooting list right? Getting more shots is better then trying to make a shooty carnifex that can kill 1-2 more guys in cc. Why not kill 1-2 more guys a turn with shooting instead?

Overall an interesting list. Might workout for you in 5ed. Would be curious to hear results.

ah yes i forgot about that. I'll see how my 5th ed games go without it and take it from there wether or not I need it. True about the miasma and the maw, I was just trying to keep him as cheap as possible while being able to do his job.

The problem is finding points for everything. The way I see it the fex's are most likely going to see combat agaisnt anything but a gunline hence the CC upgrades. if it turns out thats wrong via playtesting I'll change em around. Ah the beauty of magnets.

I could possibly work it down to 2 gunfex's and 2 dakkafex's instead of what i have now.

you spend a lot of points for a vennom cannon Hive tyrant...(with tyrant guard). If you want to cripple vehicles, then I would let the carnifexes do the shooting. you could use the amount of points to give your carnifexes a vennom Cannon instead of talons.

I forgot sumthing: Give your warriors rending claws instead of talons. the are not as good as before but still better then the extra A.

I'm not so sure about the rending claws on the warriors. Without spending points on at least the WS upgrade i dont see it being worth it. With the new rending you need a lot of attacks that hit to make it worth it imo

they are there for the guns and to only get into CC if absolutely unavoidable.

I've actually been thinking of some changes since I originally posted, mainly going to 2 walking tyrants with guard instead of 1 and the flyrant. I'm gonna work up some ideas when i get home and post a revision.

Although I recall little of the way he built the army beyond loads and loads of warriors, a friend of mine somehow managed to cook up a shooty nid list that gunned down a line of 80+ orcs before they got hit in cc. It was sick.

But regarding your army, I think for what you want two shooty tyrants plus guard will work better for you. When they do finally get caught up in CC your guard do a pretty good job of messing up whatever it is that threatens the tyrant. With two teams of them hulking around while the tyrants take potshots all across the board, you'll be harassing and frustrating the crap out of your opponent.

If you want to really give your genestealers a chance to do anything at all, give them scuttling and let them perform their role as shock troops. As it is even all the spinegaunts you have will only just barely stall their very swift death. Every gun on the board will point at them.

Finally I haven't played with any gunfexes with 5th rules, but I still think they are supremely useful. Sure that VC won't be one-shotting any tanks, but it sure will reduce their effectiveness long enough to let your stealers and warriors do their thing. Barring that, I think giving them twin-linked BS would substitute nicely. You say you expect them to get into CC eventually but I disagree, you want them staying out of reach of any powerfists on the board so they can keep taking shots the entire game. Stick and move, son.

well i had originally had the stealers in mind as a counter assualt unit and not so much as a shock troop. But with the changes in 5th i can see where scuttlers will be useful. Like i said I loosely based this on the only shooty army i have experience with which was my old 3rd ed IW which was all guns with 2 counter assault units. While i dont think the same concept will work here it was an outline.

Any idea what your friend was usuing? Warriors with twin devourers can do a number on orcs in numbers but they risk being assaulted if they fail to kill enough with the 18" range.

OK I was playing with points and came up with this. I dont know if its more solid than the original but its an idea.

HQ:

- Tyrant - VC, twin devourers, ES, toxin sacs 2x tyrant guard

- Tyrant - VC, twin devourers, ES, toxin sacs 2x tyrant guard

Elites:

- Warrior brood - 5x warriors with toxin sacs, scy tals and deathspitters, one with barbed strangler

- Warrior brood - 5x warriors with toxin sacs, scy tals and deathspitters, one with barbed strangler

- Dakkafex - twin devs and ES

Troops

- 20 spine gaunts

- 20 spine gaunts

- 8 stealers with scuttlers and tendrils

- 8 stealers with scuttlers and tendrils

Heavy:

- Gunfex - VC, BS, ES, RC

- Gunfex

- Dakkafex

This is a solid list especially if you keep those gaunts in front of the warriors for screening goodness. Outflank with the genestealers...pepper his infantry while harassing his tanks. You've got a healthy number of VC and BS on the board to keep with the shooty theme. Lots of templatey goodness.

Thats a solid list, now just change the warriors for dakkafexxes/strangler elite fexxes and the last heavy fex to a sniper fex and you are set

Thats a solid list, now just change the warriors for dakkafexxes/strangler elite fexxes and the last heavy fex to a sniper fex and you are set

Disagree. I think between the synapse the warriors provide and the cover save they can get, they will be a fine choice in 5ed. Plus I am sure many people are bored playing and facing nidzilla.

Yeah thats the idea. I dont really feel like doing a "full" 'zilla list although I think this list would suffer without the ones I have. I think the new template rules make the warriors very usefull, especially against hordes.