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So I finally got to play my first game of WFB this past weekend. My 1k Caledorian HE force vs. my friend's Dwarfs.

It was a fun game, despite the heavy loss on my side.

Rough break-down of armies:
Me (HE):
2 nobles, both kitted out on barded horses, dragon armor, shields, and lances, one with helm of fortune, the other as a BSB.
21 spearelves w/ sentinel and standard
2x 5x unit of dragon princes with fc, one with Banner of Ellyrion (BSB went with the unit without the BoE).
RBT

Him(DWF):
1 Thane w/ Rune of Challenging or something like that
1 Dragon-slayer
10x Iron Breakers (Thane went here)
a unit of Dwarf Warriors
10x Thunderers
1 Grudge Thrower (Slayer lingered near them)
1 Cannon

Main problems I had were that one unit of DPs got shot up really badly before they got to the Dwarf lines, and the other was forced to charge the Iron Breakers because of the Thane's rune.
Probably due to my choice in maneuvering, Spearmen took too long to get to combat. Granted, I think we also deployed with more than 24" between us.
I also forgot to roll attacks for my steeds.
My friend opted to keep his units stationary for most of the game.

I'm not too sure how best to deal with his list with my current list. I suppose on one hand I should've charged my DPs together (the shot-up one went after his grudge-thrower instead).
I would've liked to have charged his warriors first, but that wasn't an option due to the thane.
I focused shooting with the RBT mainly against his thunderers, but I wiffed a lot (sucky dice-throwing).
I did quickly learn to appreciate that I REALLY need to break units on the charge.

Any suggestions?

I would suggest 2 changes to your army.

1) get a second RBT (you can have 2 in one slot)

2) Change your spearmen to Archers. 2 Units of 10 is nice.

Tactically if you deploy your DP's wide enough out they can run towards the artilery and make sure they are always facing towards them. This will decrease the number of hits a cannon can cause.

As a Dwarf Player I play 2 Bolt Throwers real wide and when my opponent has the flank of one of his units in range I show him what a single shot bolt thrower can do.

The Dwarf Thunderers have a range of 24. You have a range of 30 with your archers. If you target his War Machines with the bolt throwers and then archers on the Thunderers the DP's can sweep in from the sides in a Pincer movement. And then he has to turn his Thunderers to face one of the two flanks before he can turn back to face the other. Thunderers are Move OR Fire.

Also by staying out of charge range of the Thane you avoid having to charge him. By not being able to see him in your front arc this can avoid the issue.

Dwarfs setup tactically behind the deployment line. They try and get an extra round of shooting before you charge. And standing there while they shoot you as you move across the field is another standard Dwarf Tactic.

I played over the weekend and in all three games my first round was" My Turn! OK, Done Movement, Done Magic, on to Shooting."

Always good to have another elf player to join the ranks Congrats on the new army.

I suggest you look at my latest battle report , which happens to be a 1.5k HE vs DWF Battle:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/216390.page



The thing that I've learned is that most dwarf armies all play the same. They play like a 40k army, which is very point and click. A common tactic for DWF armies is that they create a "tower of power zone" and stand and shoot you with their many warmachines/thunderers. They can do this quite well unlike any other army because of their high toughness and great leadership.

One way to attack this problem is by outranging him yourself (as I did in my battle report)

Your archers can move and shoot, while his thunderers cannot. he cannot shoot even if he pivots. his guns are 24" as well as his organ gun and archers can shoot 30". If he moves forward, you can move back 2.5" (by doing 2 180 turns) and still have the ability to shoot back!!
Your RBT's have the ability to knock out his long range guns like cannons/bolt throwers.

You can also outmagic him if you take more than 2 mages + banner of sorcery.. he will only have 4-5 dispel dice and if you take the spell which does damage to any units on/near a hill, it will be devastating.
You can mow down his most expensive troops (ironbreakers) easily with single shot RBT as well, since this one doesnt allow any armor saves at all. Even better is if you can take the magic spell where you can do D3 rerolls per turn and use them on your bolt throwers to hit roll.

In short, deny him his range with your superior range/magic.
Use your superior mobility to choose when and where the fight happens.
Make him come to you and soften him up as you can. Dwarves can always march, but only 6" at a time. You will have 3-4 full turns shooting at him.
Run MSU with most of your units to give him only 1 wound with cannon shots and hide your big static CR unit out of sight of his cannons.

Da_Viking wrote:I would suggest 2 changes to your army.

1) get a second RBT (you can have 2 in one slot)

You can't have two RBT in one slot, but you do get extra Rare slots in a HE army.

I know dwarves can have two Bolt Throwers in a single slot. Not sure about HE though.

I think they had it in the previous book, but this book does not.

It's not a big deal, except their Rare slots were increased
alongside their Special slots, so 2 for 1 with increased Rare
slots would be insane.

Example: At 2k they have 4 Rare slots, which if it were 2 for
1, they could field 8 RBT.

Right I forgot that they got the extra slot and not the 2 for 1. OK my oops.

Hey I play Dwarfs. Where we can have 2 for 1.

The other bonus on HE Bolt Throwers is that they can either do single shot no armour safe through the ranks untill they do not wound or they can do a six shot distribute like shooting and take out multiple models in one unit. Dwarfs have only the single shot type.

So essentially the best answers lie in adding more range to my forces (something I gathered shortly after the game).

I'll try subbing out spears for archers/RBTs. I imagine with even just another RBT, I probably could whittle down his thunderers (they caused the most damage to me) and hit him with my DP's mostly intact. The only thing about that idea is that I'm not exactly excited about the idea of sitting back and shooting for most of the game. Kind of reminds me too much of 40k sometimes. I'll most likely run a shooting heavy-list at some point for variety's sake, but still consider the list I have closer to my "true/ideal" list.

As for magic-heavy - I feel like at 1k, it's too much of a liability. Sure, I could fit in 2 lvl2's, but he still has a decent Dispell base without having to invest into it. That and considering my luck (you wouldn't believe how good I am at rolling 1's when a leadership test is not involved ) and that's 300+ points of dead mages. I'll run a magic list at some point for fun/variety's sake, but I'm not immediately drawn to that idea.

I do agree that I could stand to have more range in my list....I may consider trading those spears for archers and a great eagle. Or maybe even just get rid of some unit upgrades to get a Great Eagle to stop warmachines, if only for a turn or 2.

I suppose the issue I have is an uncertainty of the targetting priority with the list that I had. The RBT in the game was focused mostly on clearing those Thunderers, since my friend was keeping his infantry relatively still. I was worried about a stand and shoot reaction from the Thunderers, so I tried to avoid charging them with my DPs, and not knowing about the rune of challenge, I spent an extra turn trying to flank his warriors and IBs. While it doesn't seem like a particularly attractive option, I feel like I could've saved myself a turn of being shot at by just charging head-on with both DP units.

I need to read through the Dwarf book a bit to get a feel for the other "fun" runes they have available.

Thanks for all the advice thus far, though!

It's going to be a bit tough at this points level. Shooting tends to be disproportionately effective at 1k and below, and as you've noticed, Dwarves still have outstanding leadership and dispel abilities, even without a Lord or any runesmiths. Once you get to a bit higher points value, where you can afford a couple of mages (or a more substantial shooting component) while STILL having decent combat ability, things will get more interesting. Mages or shooting allow you to put some hurt on his shooters early, allowing the game to be more about the melee. They also give cool utility spells like the one that makes your guys Stubborn, or the one that gives them a Ward save, which again will reduce the power of his shooting.

I think you're on the right track in terms of going melee instead of just shooting back. It's going to make a more interesting game, though games against Dwarves below 2000pts (where they can take the Anvil and have a more interesting mobile army) will always tend to be a bit samey, as their lack of mobility and high-quality shooting will always tend to make for a more static play style.

@Mannahnin:
Yeah, I can see that about shooting at 1k and below. There're only so many units that people have at 1k (well, at least from what I can divine), I can see how shooting can really affect the game at those levels.

I actually originally had a lvl2 as a second hero instead of the BSB so that I could have a bit of everything. But after realizing that with only that many points devoted to heroes, I was still only going to match his dispel, so I figured I'd give my units a bit more oomph.

My friends and I are playing again this weekend. I'm curious to try having a rematch, but with a bigger table (I think we were playing ~5'x4', going at eachother along the long side, and with some more forest pieces on the table for terrain (only had one forest that game, the rest was pretty open). I think my friend has luckily (or unluckily?) sworn off the Anvil, which kind of makes me happy.

If you want to get into combat then why dont you change the spears for sea guard and then you can move and shoot and get into combat. With 2 ranks during charge and 3 after charge.