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this came up against my chaos marines foe this weekend. my Horrors scattered badly on the deep strike, within assault range of some chaos space marines. They fired their bolt pistols at the pink horrors, but failed a Ld test and ended up shooting the terminator squad behind them. This is all very clear and simple to me so far (and assume all of you out there in dakkaland), but it gets odd in the Assault phase. Can the marines still charge the pink horrors?

Unless I'm missing something, this again comes down to a RAW vs. RAI argument, as alot of the YMDC threads do.

RAW arguement:
pg. 33 of the rule book, under Disallowed Assaults: "...a unit that fired in the Shooting phase can only assault the unit that it shot at - it cannot assault a different unit to the one it previously shot at." It says nothing about intended targets, just who they actually threw bullets at. They just shot the terminators, and since they cannot charge friendly models, they stay put, yes?

My opponent (it was my changeling if you hadn't guessed by now) was livid when I raised this point, as he claimed that this was absolute cheese for a 5 point upgrade character. I explained that yes, he could have chose not to shoot after I used the Glamour of Tzeentch if this assault was so vital, and yes he was still allowed his (iirc Ld9) leadership test.

I'm equally if not more so interested to see how this is handled by fellow Daemon players, as it's quite likely to come up again in the future. And if you do agree with the above, how do you justify it to the cries of cheese? It's a great special character who's effect can be alot of fun (making a squad who just got out out a rhino turn around and meltagun their own rhino always cracks me up), but for a 5 point upgrade I'd rather not destroy my reputation at my FLGS over it.

Thoughts, Points of View, Musings, and maybe even the occasional flame welcome.

You are definitely correct. The rules clearly say you can only assault the unit you shot at.

I have no opinion of the cheese aspect but I believe that the Changeling is undercosted.

BTW, is there something that limits the ammount of times you can use Glamour of Tzeentch in each enemy shooting phase?

Webbe wrote:
BTW, is there something that limits the ammount of times you can use Glamour of Tzeentch in each enemy shooting phase?

Yes. The number of times the opponent fires. Seriously, Glamour can be used each time the enemy shoots.

Yup, I'd agree he couldn't charge.

If this was in the Ard Boyz you should have pointed to the poster where it says "No wining"


This is also not cheese (course I think very little is cheese) because you have to fail your leadership test, and you can choose not to shoot if you really need the assault.

I agree with krunch here. if they really needed to charge, they should have withheald their fire

I make that choice all the time with my orks. last thing you want is to be stranded out in the open while the other squad rallies, moves 3" then rapid fires

NaZ

Ok, 1st time poster here. Are we sure the power is anytime somebody shoots, not just one target? I'm a daemon player and I want to know if it's set in stone, that's how it's played.

I see nothing in the rules about it only working once.

While the power is good and probably a bargain at 5 points, that would appear to be how it works. The chance of failing a leadership test is fairly low for most units out there and you always have the option of not shooting. In friendly games where it is obvious that your opponent is going to want to charge your horrors, you should probably point out to them that they won't be able to if they fail their leadership test. In ard' Boyz, its up to them. They know the tournament was a rules mongering cheeze fest before they got there. They hardly have a reason to complain now.

the paragraph regarding use goes as follows: "This power can be used in the enemy Shooting phase. Pick any enemy unit that is visible to the changeling and is about to fire. if the unit is found to be within 24" of the Changeling, it is affected by by his mind-altering mirage."

it's not a psychic power (and therefore being limited to a single use), and there's no explicit mention of only a single unit. It seems like a simple task to throw in the phrase "this power may only be used once per enemy player turn." but they expressly did not.

However, the sentence "Pick any enemy unit that is visible to the changeling and is about to fire." implies a single selection to me (the word pick, in this case). If they had intended for it to affect every unit in range, I imagine it would have gone something like "any enemy unit the Changeling can draw line of sight to and is found to be within 24" is affected by his mind-altering glamour."