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In any mission, what sort of victory do you get for Tableing your opponent.


EXAMPLE

Scenario-Kill points

My army gives up 6 kill points total.

Yours gives up 16 total. (mechanised or something)

During the game I score 12 of your 16 kill points however you TABLE/WIPE ME OUT, garnering 6 total kill points.

What is the level of victory, massacre? Minor win? Whose victory is it?

I really hope that the guy who got wiped out would get the win. It would just further prove how idiotic the KP system is.

BYE

From what I understand and the way it has been played so far at the tournements i have been at tabling=masscre. It was how some of the really lucky AC players got thru the first round of the Ard Boyz.

Rulebook, page 90
"Regardless of the victory conditions, if at the end of any standard mission your enemy has no units left on the table, you win the game!"

Some of the minor points issues might still apply.

the person still on the table wins.... the question is whether it is a minor, major, or massacre

The scenarios and scoring are up on the GW site. IMO, if you table your opponent you should get a Massacre and all bonus points (other than those that require something of yours to be alive, if it's dead). Twp of the objective ones are easy. Do you have twice as many objectives as your opponent. OK, you've got one, he has none, I'd say that counts. The other obj one is harder, do you control both obj? If you don't control both at the end of the game, it's not a massacre. And what if you table them on turn 3? Do you get the two (or mroe) additional turns of movement to see if you can take them. I would allow it, but I'm a pushover.
The KP games are the most difficult, as they are based on ratio of KP PvP. Double KP is a massacre. Say I wipe you off the board, kill all 12 KP in your army, but in the process, you kill 14 (I've got 21 in my army) KP of mine. Sure I win, but can I really claim a massacre? Anyways, maybe we can get an answer out of the GT staff before this weekend.

As per the rulebook wiping out the opponents force is a pre eminent win condition in all the scenarios. If your opponent has no army you win. Period.

How its handled in the Gt I don't know.

ShumaGorath wrote:As per the rulebook wiping out the opponents force is a pre eminent win condition in all the scenarios. If your opponent has no army you win. Period.

How its handled in the Gt I don't know.

No one is contesting that... we just wonder if it is a massacre or not!

In addition... what if your opponent concedes? is that a massacre or not?

If your opponent concedes but doesnt agree to a massacre or at least a major win....likely you'll have to tell him to finish playing the game.

The BRB makes clear that if you wipe out your opponent it's a Win, but says nothing about it being a massacre for tournament points.

I don’t see any basis for automatically awarding a massacre just because you wiped out your opponent. The objectives are what matter. Wiping out your opponent should give an automatic Win per the BRB, but there is no requirement to reward that as highly as someone who actually completed all the objectives. Especially when you consider that it could still be a close game on VPs. If I wipe my opponent out but all I have left is a 100pt unit, that certainly shouldn’t be a Massacre. In the old scoring system it’d be a Draw.

As for the missions scoring, all the objective missions work fine, with the exception that they don’t make an allowance for the situation where you wipe your opponent out but he manages to kill enough of your army that the VP totals are within 175pts differential. 8 to 8 is clearly a Draw, but per the BRB you should get the points for a Win. Of course if you consider the 11/9 scoring a type of Draw too, then that wouldn’t be good enough. It’s kind of ambiguous, because the scoring sheets don’t tell you if 11/9 is a Win/Loss or an uneven Draw.

Of course, the GT team can override the BRB rule for the purposes of their tournament scoring; But if they are disregarding the statement in the BRB, it would be nice if they said so explicitly.

I’ve asked the guys over on the GW Community board. I’m going to PM them too.

A Massacre at the LVGT was an automatic 20 pts for the winner and the lowest value for the loser (although the loser could still potentially get some of the bonus points added to his total depending on whether he accomplished them or not during the game).

yakface wrote:
A Massacre at the LVGT was an automatic 20 pts for the winner and the lowest value for the loser (although the loser could still potentially get some of the bonus points added to his total depending on whether he accomplished them or not during the game).

But what about a concession?

you should never concede. if its that bad the game should end quickly or do your best to get as many points from him.
you pay to play 5 games. play them.

The same question was also asked on the GW Cummonity forums, and Go Go posted that he'll have an answer for us today.

Normally when you concede to your opponent, they get the full 20 points. I have no problem with people conceding because sometimes they get a bad match up, and there is nothing they can do. So you might as well call it a game, and look around the hall (As a side note: I have never conceded a game. I go down kicking and screaming and I will deny you every point possible. From the gates of hell I will spit at you!).

What I hate is when your opponent concedes the game on turn #3, and then they turn around and tries to deny you the VPs for being in their deployment zone, or not picking off their final HQ, etc. If they refuse to give me those additional points, we have to finish the game.

Never give up, never surrender. First game at Vegas this year, it was obvious I was going to lose early on. Finished the game with only three guys from my IG army on the table. But on the last turn, those three guys killed his Chaos Sorceror Lord which netted me a bonus Battle Point........................

Seriously! I've lost track of the number of times i've kept playing to see how long my last model or two would last while going down heroicly. Example was 'Ard Boyz I had a single guardsman with a flamer who flamed 3 sentinals. Nothing happened to the sentinels and he got smooshed flat but It was a cool sight to see the flamer hit all 3

Go Go has clarified that it's a 17/3 Win, but you still need to achieve secondary and tertiary objectives if you want the 20.

Chris Gohlinghorst wrote:
Joined: 05 Dec 2007 Posts: 688 Location: Baltimore, MD Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 4:32 pm Post subject:
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For the purposes of wrapping up this season's GTs (simple since there is one left) tabling your opponent will be equal to securing all the objectives (scenarios 1,3,4) or achieving double the amount of kill points (scenarios 2,5).

This should always result in a 17-3 victory.

To garner the extra points you must still achieve those conditions as listed in the scenarios. Tabling your opponent will almost always result in achieving those conditions (conversely it'll also be possible for said tabled opponent to walk away with more than 3 battle points).

Just read carefully the conditions placed upon the secondary and tertiary objectives.

http://gwuscommunity.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6764#6764