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One of my friends plays IG and one of the doctrines he takes is carapace armor. He claims that the point cost per unit is for a whole platoon. In other words, he gives two infantry squads and a command squad carapace armor for points. I know this isn't right, but I haven't found any concrete evidence to the contrary.

P.S. Even if he is doing it wrong I'll probably let him keep on anyway. Any IG player who takes carapace armor needs all the help he can get.

EDIT: Censored the rules references. I don't want any trouble.

The entry say per unit...what more clarification do you need?

A platoon is a FOC choice, but is 3-6 units. You must pay for every unit you have, not FOC slot.

I realize that, but he refuses to believe me. I was wondering if there was a quote anywhere from the rulebook that specifies.

The one that says "per unit" is the quote you need.

If he wants to use it for the whole platoon, I would let him, as long as he is willing to treat the platoon as a single unit, including coherency, etc.

I'm going to have to eat crow on this one. In the doctrine section it says

Guard Infantry:
In several of the following doctrine descriptions, the term Guard Infantry unit is used. In this context, the definition includes any command squad along with it's officer, any attached advisers anti-tank squads....normal infantry squads.....and Armored Fist squads.

The term "Guard Infantry Unit" is used in the Carapace Armor description.

So in the case of doctrines, a unit means a platoon; but in any other circumstance a unit means a squad. Just another case of GW messing up its definitions between books.

i havent got my rulebook handy, but i may suggest looking up the definition of a unit in the core rules, that may help clear things up abit, however i would still say no you pay per squad not per Force Org Choice as he is suggesting

The rules are really ambiguous in the codex. The carapace armor description says that Guard Infantry units may take the upgrade for + points per unit (not Guard Infantry unit).

I really could go either way on this one. It could be assumed that the second unit is talking about a Guard Infantry unit, or I could go with the strict interpretation and say it's cost per squad.

The most sensible suggestion is coredump's. I'm fine with him getting the doctrine for an entire platoon, as long as he treats the entire platoon like a single unit for game purposes (really good for me because I play tau. Can you say submunitions?)

dementedwombat wrote:I'm going to have to eat crow on this one. In the doctrine section it says

Guard Infantry:
In several of the following doctrine descriptions, the term Guard Infantry unit is used. In this context, the definition includes any command squad along with it's officer, any attached advisers anti-tank squads....normal infantry squads.....and Armored Fist squads.

The term "Guard Infantry Unit" is used in the Carapace Armor description.

So in the case of doctrines, a unit means a platoon; but in any other circumstance a unit means a squad. Just another case of GW messing up its definitions between books.

And exactly how do you figure that? Try reading it again. Does it say anything about 'platoons' in the defintion of 'Guard Infantry units'? No. As the codex states, a Command squad and normal Infantry Platoon squads are considered 'Guard Infantry units'. An Infantry Platoon as presented on page 44 of the codex consist of a Command squad and two to five normal Infantry Platoon squads, each of which meets the defintion of a 'Guard Infantry unit'. Therefore you already have three to six 'Guard Infantry units' right there. So how are you figuring that it's one 'Guard Infantry unit'?

dementedwombat wrote:The rules are really ambiguous in the codex. The carapace armor description says that Guard Infantry units may take the upgrade for + points per unit (not Guard Infantry unit).

Try reading the first three words of the Carapace Armour entry. It's crystal clear if you don't leave words out.

you want the rules for the infantry platoon, "Each Platoon counts as a single Troops choice on the Force Organisation chart when deploying, and is rolled for collectively when rolling for reserves. Otherwhise they function as independent units"

Obviously otherwhise means all other situations other than deploying or rolling for reserves, which would include purchasing upgrades granted by doctrines.

This is not ambiguous at all...the rules are clearly spelled out here.

Guard Infantry Unit lists what counts as a Guard infantry unit. Carapace armour then states that any Guard Infantry unit may upgrade...

How is this not 100% clear?

EDIT: The two posters above me spell it out perfectly. This should not be an issue, there is nothing to be confused about.

Joyous_Oblivion wrote:
How is this not 100% clear?

Because I'm an idiot noob.

Thanks for clearing this up everyone. I don't think he's going to be too happy with me the next time we play a game.

Hey we were all Idiot noobs at one point, we all get over it, don't let this small 'duh' moment weigh too heavily on you, your friend is really the one at fault for even making an issue of it.

You should print this thread and show him what other gamers think...

He pay +XX pts per squad, so if he has 3 squads, he pays 3 times.

This is one of the clearest Doctrines in the Codex, and people can *still* screw it up? :S

That is why Doctrines need to go away and be redone as clear per-Platoon options.