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Here is why scatterlasers are better than starcannons:
Scatterlaser: 36 range, str 6 ap 6
Starcannon: 36 range, str 6 ap 2
Let's assume you're shooting at your standard marine in cover

Scatterlaser breakdown:
To hit (assuming BS 3): 3/6
To wound(assuming T 4): 5/6
Armor save (assuming 3+ save): 2/6

3/6 * 5/6 * 2/6 = 30/216 = ~14% to kill one marine with one shot

Scatterlaser is heavy 4 so 14%*4 = 56% to kill one marine

Starcannon breakdown:
To hit (assuming BS 3): 3/6
To wound(assuming T 4): 5/6
Cover save (4+): 3/6

3/6 * 5/6 * 3/6 = 45/216 = ~21% to kill one marine with one shot

Starcannon is heavy 2 so 21%*2= 42% to kill one marine

If the marine is in the open the starcannon has a ~83% vs the ~56% of the scatterlaser

Shooting at vehicles the scatterlaser is much better than the starcannon:

Against armor 12:
Scatterlaser has a ~33% chance to glance vs the Starcannon's ~17% chance to glance

Against a Plague Marine in cover:
Scatterlaser:
3/6 * 4/6 * 2/6 * 3/6 * 4=22% to kill one
Starcannon:
3/6 * 4/6 * 3/6 * 2=33% to kill one

Good post, but I am pretty sure most eldar players new this

Just comparing the to-hit and to-wound %s doesn't equate to these weapon's true effectiveness. It's about taking the right weapon for the job. Factor in POINT COST and what army you're facing and suddenly things can change dramatically.

Run some numbers on both of them trying to take out plague marines.

Hint: It's the opposite result.

That's a good point. Fortunatally that doesn't change anything, since the scatterlaser is 10 pts cheaper and has the same range.

ya but if you face 24 termies you want star cannons.

Well, star cannons were the obvious choice in the former edition of the Eldar codex when they were assault 3. But now as they are assault 2 and still very costly compared to scatter lasers, I never used them in the current incarnation of the codex.

How many starcannons do you need to remove 24 Termies?

wuestenfux wrote:Well, star cannons were the obvious choice in the former edition of the Eldar codex when they were assault 3. But now as they are assault 2 and still very costly compared to scatter lasers, I never used them in the current incarnation of the codex.

How many starcannons do you need to remove 24 Termies?

29, compared to 87 scatter lasers.

scatter lasers are still the better choice, however. you get lots of terminator killing potential from fire prisms, falcons, harlequins, banshees, avatars and wraithlords, just as standard. not to mention that 24 terminators are slower than you.

Personally i find the Star cannon to still preform slightly beter for me in 5th edition even with all these cover saves [which i find ok, but i would much prefer the grot shield rule for the old ork dex for if you are shielded by another unit] and im a fluff nut and scatters arnt really the ulthwe style, we are more precise and stuff [that my take on it] plus the star looks better

Regwon wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:Well, star cannons were the obvious choice in the former edition of the Eldar codex when they were assault 3. But now as they are assault 2 and still very costly compared to scatter lasers, I never used them in the current incarnation of the codex.

How many starcannons do you need to remove 24 Termies?

29, compared to 87 scatter lasers.

scatter lasers are still the better choice, however. you get lots of terminator killing potential from fire prisms, falcons, harlequins, banshees, avatars and wraithlords, just as standard. not to mention that 24 terminators are slower than you.

Not when they bring stormshields and thunderhammers.

Regwon wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:Well, star cannons were the obvious choice in the former edition of the Eldar codex when they were assault 3. But now as they are assault 2 and still very costly compared to scatter lasers, I never used them in the current incarnation of the codex.

How many starcannons do you need to remove 24 Termies?

29, compared to 87 scatter lasers.

scatter lasers are still the better choice, however. you get lots of terminator killing potential from fire prisms, falcons, harlequins, banshees, avatars and wraithlords, just as standard. not to mention that 24 terminators are slower than you.

The correct answer would be 72 starcannon wounds (86,4 starcannons assuming bs3), as everyone will take terminators with storm shields now a days. Yes scatter lasers would need twice as many wounds, but they also get twice as many shots for a lower price.
Even against TEq without storm shields, they will almost always get a 4+ cover save. Meaning the starcannon is only marginally better against TEq's without storm shields and is worse against anything else. Even if the starcannon would be the same points cost as the scatter lasers are, the scatter lasers would still be the better choice.

Airmaniac wrote:

Regwon wrote:

29, compared to 87 scatter lasers.

scatter lasers are still the better choice, however. you get lots of terminator killing potential from fire prisms, falcons, harlequins, banshees, avatars and wraithlords, just as standard. not to mention that 24 terminators are slower than you.

The correct answer would be 72 starcannon wounds (86,4 starcannons assuming bs3), as everyone will take terminators with storm shields now a days. Yes scatter lasers would need twice as many wounds, but they also get twice as many shots for a lower price.
Even against TEq without storm shields, they will almost always get a 4+ cover save. Meaning the starcannon is only marginally better against TEq's without storm shields and is worse against anything else. Even if the starcannon would be the same points cost as the scatter lasers are, the scatter lasers would still be the better choice.

i was assuming BS3 because that is the comparison the OP used.

starcannon havent been good in this edition sinse they became assault 3 (as has previously been mentioned). its just not worht it for the low number of shots you get. since weight of fire is the name of the game in 5th, scatterlasers come out on top 9/10

Actually I've been trying out the starcannon lately and it does have a really nice effect against troops jumping out of blown up rhinos. It also forces your opponent to stay in cover.

@ 120 points, a 5man pathfinder squad gets the ap 1/2 half the time, BS4, 'heavy' 5 and can generally live longer. Conversely less mobile while shooty but can get into a firing position pretty well with the scout rule.

As for the str, 4+ to wound but with the rending rule it kinda levels out but it only gets better with tougher things.

As for AV pen, a roll of a 6 for a SL/SC gives 12 penatration, whereas a ranger rifle gets 10-13 with the rending and on 33% of those hits counts as ap1.

They also have shruiken pistols........ My point is, ap 2 or better weapons are abundent and not nessicarly seperate from high shot volume either.

Why even bring scatter lasers when you have shurkin catapults that are doomed and guided by your Farseer. A little bit of overkill if you ask me. Best just to leave both of them at home and spend those points on pathfinders.