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There was once a gamestore in my city. It was called U.F.O. and was not only a gamestore but also a bookshop specialised on Sci-Fi and Fantasy. 3 years ago, the gamestore and the bookshop broke apart. The bookstore stayed in the old place but changed their name, while two of the founders searched for a new location and opened up a new store. The "Sturmdrache" (Stormdragon) was, like many other independant gamestores, more than just a place where you bought your stuff. It was a place to meet, to converse, it even had a pretty large gaming room (which you can check out on some of the pics in my gallery) which was used frequently for tabletop-, tradingcard- and roleplaying games. A lot of the terrain and tables there were build by the two owners and the community.
There were frequent events, like Apocalypse battles, Blood Bowl leagues, a Mordheim campaign and weekly paint workshops and TCG tournaments. Not to mention the 2 large Warhammer tournaments we had every year.
And they had a bunchload of gaming stuff you could get nowhere else in Freiburg. Shelves full of Roleplaying games, Reaper miniatures, Warmachine and Hordes, the complete Games-Workshop range and even other Warhammer related articles like Warhammer novels and comic books.


2 Months from now, this store will close. There are several reasons for this actually and I'm not going to talk about them...except for one.
GW is opening a store in Freiburg. Still in the "inner city" so to speak, but in the part that is visited the least. I haven't seen the location so far, but I'm told it is just large enough for the full GW range and a gaming table. One gaming table. The Sturmdrache had five.
I'm not going to even think about why GW would open a smaller store 15 minutes from an established Rogue Trader which even got featured in the german WD just a month ago. Appearantly they don't want to share their profits. Not that you earn much money by selling only GW stuff in the first place. And the two owners of the local store decided that this was the proverbial nail in the coffin. Because if they would compete with a "real" Games-Workshop store, no matter how small, they would have to stock up even more, so that their customers wouldn't run off to the new store instead of just odering it and wait for a week or two like they did in the last 3 years.

Now, I'm not going to boycott the GW store. Mainly because I don't want to order too much wargaming stuff over the Internet, because it's things like that, which hurt little independant stores the most.
I also have to say, that this won't ruin my motivation for the hobby at all. Not even for GW systems. A friend of mine is already preparing a new gaming room at home. Still, I will miss the store. And I will put another entry into the GW-Grudge book.

That is all I have to say right now.

Anung Un Rama wrote:
There were frequent events, like Apocalypse battles, Blood Bowl leagues, a Mordheim campaign and weekly paint workshops and TCG tournaments. Not to mention the 2 large Warhammer tournaments we had every year.
And they had a bunchload of gaming stuff you could get nowhere else in Freiburg. Shelves full of Roleplaying games, Reaper miniatures, Warmachine and Hordes, the complete Games-Workshop range and even other Warhammer related articles like Warhammer novels and comic books.


2 Months from now, this store will close. There are several reasons for this actually and I'm not going to talk about them...except for one.
GW is opening a store in Freiburg. Still in the "inner city" so to speak, but in the part that is visited the least. I haven't seen the location so far, but I'm told it is just large enough for the full GW range and a gaming table. One gaming table. The Sturmdrache had five.

So how come your blaming GW? Especially when by the sounds of things the store sold many other things?

As I said: I don't want to go into every detail for privacy reasons. GW opening a store was just the last drop.

This wasn't supposed to be a pure "blame GW" thread, but they sure played their part in the whole thing.

Bignutter wrote:

So how come your blaming GW? Especially when by the sounds of things the store sold many other things?

Because this isnt the first time GW has opened a store close to an independent one?

But that aside, there are probably other different reasons the indey store is closing.

According to the timeline you described, the decision to close the store has happened before the GW store even opened. So, one can not really blame the GW for the indy's demise. They didn't even steal any business away. And, as you pointed out, the indy store sells other products, so it's business is clearly not 100% based on GW merchandise sales.

Sounds like a case of placing blame on GW because they're a convenient target.

They knew about GWs plan for opening a store in Freiburg for a few months now.

Just wait and see, I seriously doubt that the GW store will steal any business, in fact I would wager that sales pick up at your FLGS. GW stores never have sales, they always sell product at retail.

Having worked for a GW store I know that it is not GW plan to make lots of money at there retail store sites. The biggest goal is to make new players, we would routinely send people to buy stuff at the FLGS if they had product on sale lower than our product. The reason being that any GW product sold was money in the bank. It make perfect sense if you think about it. Don't focus on sales to existing customers, because they are hooked and will continue to buy as long as new rules come out.

Anung Un Rama wrote:They knew about GWs plan for opening a store in Freiburg for a few months now.

And were not prepared?

We do know that GW will raise the number of GW-stores in gemany. Slow but steady.
Freiburg is followed by Braunschweig and won't be the last new GW-store.

Are you sure it is a "war or profit" there?
Companys tend to stake their claims against other companys (not independent stores) and I doubt the "evil masterplan"

The size of a GW store seems to be always small here, if you visit GW München (Munich) you'll find them in a backstreet with
only 2 gaming boards. A city like München could supply a greater store if that was their goal.
But still this city as several independent stores and i can't see the GW-store as "challenge" to them.

You seem to have missed my point. They may have known that GW would be opening a store in the area, but it had not happened yet. So they just decided to close their shop and go out of business because a competitor shop was going to open? In other words, they hadn't even lost any actual business YET from the GW store, and as a games store, were not 100% reliant upon GW merchandise sales exclusively, and yet just completely shut their business down?

And somehow the GW store's fault, GW is bad for doing this? That's a little odd.

I'm surprised GW is opening a store in Freiburg. I didn't think the city was big enough to warrant a GW store.

One of my favorite places in Europe btw.

None of this is really relevant...

Ozymandias, King of Kings

Part of how they operate here is they watch the sales of the independants in an area where they (GW) on't have a store.

If they are selling a lot of stuff - an amount that means it's cost-effective for GW to open their own store in the area - then GW WILL open a store and restrict access to that other store to their stock (by 'losing' requests and orders in the system).

May not be how it is in other parts of the world, but that's how it works here. Most of the independants here go through their own channels for GW stock, not even going through the GW oz distribution network as a result.

The trend with independents here in Aus is 10-15% off boxed sets (sometimes blisters), except at Toyworld and the more general toy stores, where they might just knock fifty cents off the RRP. That's how they generally manage to compete, especially where GW stores are present. Not sure about other parts of the world...

If the store you speak of is the 'place to meet,' as you said, and has a large gaming room, it's already winning over the average GW store. There must be other reasons.

chromedog wrote:Part of how they operate here is they watch the sales of the independants in an area where they (GW) on't have a store.

If they are selling a lot of stuff - an amount that means it's cost-effective for GW to open their own store in the area - then GW WILL open a store and restrict access to that other store to their stock (by 'losing' requests and orders in the system).

May not be how it is in other parts of the world, but that's how it works here. Most of the independants here go through their own channels for GW stock, not even going through the GW oz distribution network as a result.

I've heard this for years, but never seen it. My store is one of the top selling independent stores GW has in the US. They've had all our sales numbers for 15 years. No rumor that they would open near us, and open discussions with me on why they don't want to.

In the US, they want independent stores selling their products. Do a good job and it's not worth putting a store nearby. On the other hand, if you're in a good market, and doing a crappy job of selling their stuff, they just might.

As for this store that's closing, it sounds like they weren't selling a lot of GW to start with, had other problems, and decided to throw in the towel and use GW as a handy scapegoat. "My business didn't fail, not my fault, it was those mean GW guys!"

My opinion, YMMV.

I've never been to Freiburg, but it always sucks to hear that a FLGS is closing, whatever the reasons may be.

Arctik_Firangi wrote:The trend with independents here in Aus is 10-15% off boxed sets (sometimes blisters), except at Toyworld and the more general toy stores, where they might just knock fifty cents off the RRP. That's how they generally manage to compete, especially where GW stores are present. Not sure about other parts of the world...

Haha, ImagineIf (a toy store chain) sells GW above standard RRP (I think about +10%). I still used to shop there, because it was a five minute walk from home..

Clthomps wrote:Just wait and see, I seriously doubt that the GW store will steal any business, in fact I would wager that sales pick up at your FLGS. GW stores never have sales, they always sell product at retail.

Having worked for a GW store I know that it is not GW plan to make lots of money at there retail store sites. The biggest goal is to make new players, we would routinely send people to buy stuff at the FLGS if they had product on sale lower than our product. The reason being that any GW product sold was money in the bank. It make perfect sense if you think about it. Don't focus on sales to existing customers, because they are hooked and will continue to buy as long as new rules come out.

I can back this statement up.

I'm very close to my FLGS's owner. When he opened his store and began to sell GW minis the Blackshirt from the Mall of Georgia store came by and said "I don't see us as rivals. I see us as partners. I get them into the hobby and you keep them here. As long as the stuff gets sold I win, doesn't matter who is selling it." it's slightly paraphrased but that's it.

Why is everyone jumping Anung's case? He clearly stated there were a variety of reasons that the store is closing, not just the arrival of the GW store. And yet I see thinly veiled accusations of everything from immaturity to having sympathy for poor business sense.

Seems to me he just wanted to post about "his" FLGS going down the tubes. I know what he's talking about; one of mine just shut down recently as well. Hell, I thought he was talking about MY store when I initially saw this thread. I understand why he's unhappy with it; I am too. What's so wrong with being attached to a community of people who share your same interests? Is it a crime to be a part of a community that is not online? Is that what I am hearing?

MY store didn't even sell GW. Not a drop, nore blister.

I don't pretend to know GW's strategies, besides to make money. I have no conspiracy theories.

Anung, have you done something on these boards to earn this kind of treatment? This is stupid. This is truly stupid, and sounds damn near like trolling.

mikhaila wrote:

I've heard this for years, but never seen it. My store is one of the top selling independent stores GW has in the US. They've had all our sales numbers for 15 years. No rumor that they would open near us, and open discussions with me on why they don't want to.

Then be happy and consider yourself lucky.

I've seen it here in NY and a friend had the same thing happen near him in TX. It happens enough that its not just coincidence. *shrug*

i have a feeling, OP, you will get completely smashed in this thread with out more reasoning behind the store closing...

sure, its tragic to any gamer to here of a good place to play is closing, but a GW opening near by is not a good enough reason to qeue the funeral procession...

Anung, is it actually closing or are you coming to this idea because of events in the game store?


Also, to the rest of you, keep buying local. This recession sucks and it will / is hurting your FLGS. Spend some cash and go buy that new army.

Hmmm. I just remember in 2005 when the attitude was 'firebomb the indepentants'. Although, this has worn off and now they have become more 'indy-friendly' in the past year or so.

Le Grognard wrote:Hmmm. I just remember in 2005 when the attitude was 'firebomb the indepentants'. Although, this has worn off and now they have become more 'indy-friendly' in the past year or so.

Even better was when mail order became 'direct services'. Someone had some sort of sign up that said "Trade is dead, the future belongs to direct services". Trade sales, (who deal with independent stores) was not amused.

Interesting to note that half decade later, 'direct services' is gone, and folded in to customer service. Independent stores still going well, and Trade sales for GW is getting friendlier and friendler. Someone a few years ago realized that the future just might be in working with independent stores. I'm hearing many good reports from other stores that indicate that this direction is working out very well.

mikhaila wrote:

Le Grognard wrote:Hmmm. I just remember in 2005 when the attitude was 'firebomb the indepentants'. Although, this has worn off and now they have become more 'indy-friendly' in the past year or so.

Even better was when mail order became 'direct services'. Someone had some sort of sign up that said "Trade is dead, the future belongs to direct services". Trade sales, (who deal with independent stores) was not amused.

Interesting to note that half decade later, 'direct services' is gone, and folded in to customer service. Independent stores still going well, and Trade sales for GW is getting friendlier and friendler. Someone a few years ago realized that the future just might be in working with independent stores. I'm hearing many good reports from other stores that indicate that this direction is working out very well.

One of the FLGS in my area had a terrible experience with GW, they pushed them to over stock on items that could not sell, would not help them restock the best sellers, bits service was wonky which made the store look bad. So the store stopped carrying fantasy and only carried stuff it's regulars would buy. Sometime later GW came around and were much much nicer to them. Now the store has much better ordering capabilities and stocks stuff people actually want. It's odd how GW did try to screw the independents. It's awesome they are working with them now though. The other store I go to was rather untouched by GW's PMS like flare ups as the owner just didn't care since most of his capital came from magic and other card games. He did mention an ease of ordering some items and how the reps will really work with them now, more so in the past.

grizgrin wrote:Why is everyone jumping Anung's case? He clearly stated there were a variety of reasons that the store is closing, not just the arrival of the GW store. And yet I see thinly veiled accusations of everything from immaturity to having sympathy for poor business sense.

Seems to me he just wanted to post about "his" FLGS going down the tubes. I know what he's talking about; one of mine just shut down recently as well. Hell, I thought he was talking about MY store when I initially saw this thread. I understand why he's unhappy with it; I am too. What's so wrong with being attached to a community of people who share your same interests? Is it a crime to be a part of a community that is not online? Is that what I am hearing?

MY store didn't even sell GW. Not a drop, nore blister.

I don't pretend to know GW's strategies, besides to make money. I have no conspiracy theories.

Thanks griz, that was actually pretty much what I was going for. It wasn't my plan to make a "blame GW" thread, I just started this topic to talk about that a place would shut down which was basically my 2nd living room for the last 3 years.
And unless I crack the lottery jackpot this weekend they will have to close the store. The GW store opening was just the proverbial last drop in the barrel (if you can say that in English, I'm not so sure).

I think in English we would have used "last straw" most commonly, however your euphemism translates quite well, for "United States"-style English at least. We have a bit of a tendency to make up our own euphemisms at times, which is accepted so long as they are decipherable. Yours is quite so.

My FLGS that just imploded literally overnight was not my primary, but I had some good times there. It was a nice, clean, well-lit place that I enjoyed visiting and spending some cash in. I'm sorry to hear about your casualty to the world economic situation.

I don't know if a GW opening in the same city as a FLGS is the death knell for that independent retailer. We've had a FLGS here for going on 20 years. There have been several other hobby/game stores that have opened in the area and they have all pretty much come and gone. GW even opened one of their stores a few minutes away from our FLGS in a brand new mall, but within a couple of years, that GW store had closed up shop, while our FLGS is still going strong.

I'm not sure if it is. I know that the GW stores I have been in just didn't have the sense of community. The ones I've been in seemed very sales driven, as oppossed to in some of the better FLGS's I've been in that build a community, while maintaining sales to reflect primary purpose. A business.

so do you blame starbucks when the local coffe shop closes?

i'm no GW policy fan, but thats just how it goes.

wash-away: huh?

Having only been in one GW shop during my life i find that the local shops definately are more comfortable places to learn and play. It is always a pain when one goes under. My condolances to the OP.