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I couldn't help but wonder if anyone ever takes the 2nd Storm Bolter for their Rhinos?

I would guess most players don't, as they figure they can get something more effective for the same cost (combi-melta, for example). Still, probably not a bad idea if you have several rhinos...a decent upgrade in firepower, and after the first turn, most weapons will be shooting at your marines and not your rhinos, so you get a little free firepower for IG, orks, etc.

I fought a blood angels player at 750 points. He was using 2 rhinos with paired stormbolters. At that level, they were very solid firebases.

I will probably try them out.

I run a mounted SM force and have been debating on switching to razorbacks instead of rhinos, but i like having mounted 10 man squads too much.

An additional stormbolter equals almost 1/3rd of the cost of the Rhino. A Razorback gives you a TL-HB for 5 Pts at reduced capacity (but you combat squad in 2/3rds of the missions). Rhinos are meant to be disposable, but if I ever had the points...

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I'd still get something else somewhere else

They can be worth it, at BS4. Especially if you want to OD on shooting while keeping the 10 man transport.

Plus youve got two firepoints, a HQ with a storm bolter, a flamer marine (or somthing @ 12") & now your tanks got 4 different weapons on the go.

If your codex still has the "Smoke Launchers = Glancing Only" rule then the extra bolter is very much worth it. The extra bolter means one more weapon destroyed hit is needed before you are immobilized or destroyed.

Otherwise they are marginal at best from a cost/effectiveness standpoint.

Extra storm bolters for vehicles are just a point sink. A Rhino with two storm bolters is still not very much firepower.

On one rhino, that extra 10 points will get at most 7 chances to fire during a game (assuming you never move more than 6").

Fourteen shots x BS4 = 9.33 hits

Versus MEQ(T4) = 4.7 wounds, 1.5 dead marines
Versus OEQ = 3.1 dead Orks (assuming an avg cover save of 5+)
Versus GEQ = 4.1 dead Guardsmen (assuming an avg cover save of 5+)

This is an average performance based on maximized shooting. If you pop smoke, move at cruising speed, or suffer a shaken/stunned result, or end your game early, you will reduce your efficiency by 1/7th.

In all situations, I think a sergeant with a combi flamer could do significantly better.

In really small games, 500-750 or so, I could see an extra SB being effective (As a Rhino or two are probably going to be your only vehicles), but the points are better used other places once you go above that.

When I played World Eaters I used both havoc missile launchers and the extra pintle mounted combi bolter on my rhinos. I had one dreadnaught with a TL lascannon who setup on a flank. That was the only real shooting on the army I would use it soften up hordes as they came in. Obviously the storm bolter is better at range.

I have four rhinos in my BA list. I would like to take extra storm bolters but I just don't have the points. I do remember once killing a Nurgle daemon prince with a storm bolter mounted on a rhino... the prince was down to his last wound and I just got lucky.

I have found that a lot of times that the majority of my rhinos are still alive towards the end of a game... usually my opponents are focused on other units. By turn 5 usually a lot of the enemy units are dead and those extra shots can take their toll.

G

DA only pay 5 points for their storm bolters, in which case can be worth it.

I see it as being you are forcing morale checks. The more shooting you have the more likely they will run.

At five points it is a gimme; at 10 points it is a decision.

45 points buys you 2.667 hits at strength 4 ap 5

40 points buys you 2.667 hits at strength 5 ap 4

for 5 points you gain 4 seats and the ability to fix immobilized results, and then you take a huge hit in shooting output.

Whoever said, at 5 points is a gimme but at 10 its a head scratcher was pretty spot on.

I think it's on OK upgrade, but I think you can always find a better use for 10pts. A combi-weapon on a sergeant, Melta bombs on Independant characters, Bumping a missle launcher up to a lascannon or adding a heavy flamer to a dreadnought all seem like better uses of the points to me, but YMMV.

What it is, since we are getting philosophical here, and because I have thought about and discussed this enough times; for whatever reason I would want to do so. .

What it is, it is not the greatest upgrade. But you are upgrading medium range firepower. So you want to go SAFH, and you are determined to squeeze in as many anti-infantry guns as you can, specifically; it is a good upgrade. But if you are going for versatility you are probably better off with a combi-melta someplace.

BoxANT wrote:I couldn't help but wonder if anyone ever takes the 2nd Storm Bolter for their Rhinos?

Well, take extra armor if you run an assault based army mounted in Rhinos.
But storm bolters are a waste of points.

I think its a good use of 10 points. If you were gonna be shooting two storm bolter shots anyway, why not shoot four?

Plus you've earned your points back already when you've killed two orks or one space marine, or made that squad's morale break...

Twin storm bolters on a rhino make it more lethal once it's delivered its cargo. At 24 inches it's the equivalent shooting of four tac marines and can threaten certain squads quite well (fire warriors for instance). For that ten points you gain a marginal ability to kill more and greatly increase your opponents likelihood to sink shots into a (still cheap) group transport. I would never take it over a razorback if you're only transporting 5/6 models but if it's moving a 10 man assault squad it's a great mobile followup for it's points.

ShumaGorath wrote:Twin storm bolters on a rhino make it more lethal once it's delivered its cargo. At 24 inches it's the equivalent shooting of four tac marines and can threaten certain squads quite well (fire warriors for instance).

Not sure I follow you here. At 24" each Rhino bolter fires one (twin-linked) shot. A bit better than two marines but not as good as 4.

Loyalists (HURR) have storm bolters which are better than combibolters at 24".

Democratus wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:Twin storm bolters on a rhino make it more lethal once it's delivered its cargo. At 24 inches it's the equivalent shooting of four tac marines and can threaten certain squads quite well (fire warriors for instance).

Not sure I follow you here. At 24" each Rhino bolter fires one (twin-linked) shot. A bit better than two marines but not as good as 4.

You're thinking Combi-bolters. Storm Bolters are Assault 2.

In my DA i used them, they averaged earning more than their pints back every game

So, to summarize, they are not a complete waste of points, but there is probably better places to drop 10 points.

Yes, but what they do give you is specific if that is what you want to stack up on.

I guess it all depends on your opponent and your play style, i used to run them on all my Blood Angel Rhinos, but since most games the first turn i move at max speed, pop smoke... i found them only really useful when i'd roll a 1 with the overcharged engines...which is all too often (wouldn't we all love to roll 6s) but i still think the points can be spent in better places