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Hey guys just here to help beat those unbeatable armies with the help of your army lists, advice, suggestions and
of course those Veteran, Warbosses, Imperial Force Commanders, Ethereals and of course those chaos warlords
So if anyone has anything in there bag of tricks please share we all need a little help now and then. If everyone
could put in one thing we would all have an "Un-beatable" army. Thanks

Ok, well real easy way to combat something like nob bikers... shoot the hell out of them, and make sure to charge them with a whole lotta crap, and few goody goodies in there. Reason for this, Nob bikers cost rediculous money for one unit, and as resilient as they are, all you need on the unit is 3 successful wounds to kill one, assuming they throw one on the boss, and because of the "you nominate wounds" rule for CC, just send all the wounds to your crap, and kill things with the goodies, just tarpit the hell out of them. Lash oblit lists, I really dont see how people have problems with this list, I usually manage to stay out of range of the sorc, DP can be anoying, but he cant lash if hes in CC, and oblits are so fun to kill with DS units, yes yes, leave them bac there, oh Im sorry, did I just drop my dual assault cannon termie squad next to them, oh, one squad gone? A lot of elite lists have one major flaw in common with each other, they all have expensive armies with low unit count. standard overwhelm ruins a lot of these lists, theres only so much shots you can put downrange with only 30 guys.

Most of the unbeatable armies right now are doing well for two reasons
Point Advantage- In newer codexes squads and upgrades are cheaper than they have been in the past.

Rule Advantage- These codexes are written with the most resent rule set in mind

It depends on players to take it from there

i agree with gameandwatch about expensive elite armies getting overwhelmed. But unfortunately orks can both overwhelm an opponent with greenskins AND have that nifty nob bike unit... presents a problem

I find movement is the overlooked phase. If you can out maneuver the opponent then you have the upper hand even if they are rolling with the latest 'ard boys list.

also most beasty units like termis or DPs, HQ's of all types, can usually be peppered to death. Focus fire for a round with lots of dice and watch them fail saves.

tank spam a problem? melta rule is the answer. either that or MCs hahaha

I agree with deuce, and yeah, orks can have that unit plus some tide in there as well, the spam that Im refering to specifically is the DUAL nob biker lists, like one unit is I cant recall exactly but I think around 600 pts or so?? 2 of those? doesnt leave much left to use. Also agree with the movement phase comment, I never quite understood the fear of lash oblit spam, lash only has a 24" range, and if hes close enough to use that, then hes close enough to get shot to hell, DPs only have 4 wounds, technically one full rapid firing unit could kill him outright, or one of those and some help. Just recognize the keystone units to the list, and take em out, then the rest comes crumbling down.

Thanks for the help deuce11 gameandwatch and gdurant for the feedback i totally agree withyou about the costly elites. With orks i really feel tha is is best to get as many ork boyz out there as you can so rather then having 2 squads of nob bikers for 1200 have 120 boyz for about 850 so big guns arent always the solution. With space marines i would probably have to say the same thing i mean a tactical squad is all around great especially if you have a rhino and maybe to heavy weapons you can have a fairly independent squad along witha redeemer 2 dreadnoughts force commander and your pretty much set for a small game.

Here is a thousand point army list which i found fairly good
HQ
Space Marine Captain
-Storm Bolter
-Lightning Claw
-Artificer Armor
133pts
ELITES
Sternguard Veterns
-6 Veterns
-2 Combi-meltas
-1 Vetern Sergeant
-Power Weapon
-Rhino
210pts
Dreadnought
-Assault Cannon
115pts
Dreadnought
-Twin-linked Lascannon
-Missle Launcher
145pts
TROOPS
Tactical Squad
-9 Marines
-Heavy Bolter
-Plasma gun
-1 Vetern Sergeant
-Storm bolter
-Rhino
225pts
Tactical Squad
-5 Marines
-1 Vetern Sergeant
-Power fist
-Razorback
171pts