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My friend's starting Imperial Guard and I've been wondering how my Horde Orks will cope with the new 'dex. I've heard mixed things about 'em, and I'm slightly worried.

Any and all advice is appreciated.

If your playing horde Orks the only anwser to think about are commandos or stop it. Lol the new ig were pretty much made to slaughter mass orks.

You're screwed.

Snikrot with Burna equipped crew for taking down their main tank (in 1500 games), for big games either go Deffkopta suicidal or forget footsloggin'

What approach?

Snikrot is your best bet. If he's mech you might have a bit of luck rushing him with Ghazghkul while he faffs around on the first turn. You're not up for an easy fight either way.

Terrain friendly? Going to be tough with no armor/vehicles at all. The KFF isn't going to help against the Eunich Choir, but staying out of LoS will. Maybe long enough to get into hth.

i played a game today with a horde style ork list against the new guard. i was facing down a load of troops, a russ, a demolisher and an eradicator (vicious against orks, str 6 ap 4 ignores cover aka my KFF)

i was running this:

warboss, EA, cybork, PK, skorcha
mek, KFF, burna, ea and cybork

30 shoota boyz, 3 BS, PK/bosspole nob
30 shoota boyz, 3 BS, PK/bosspole nob
30 shoota boyz, 3 BS, PK/bosspole nob
10 boyz, PK nob, truk red and ram
10 boyz, PK nob, truk red and ram

10 kommandos, snikrot and 2 burnas

3 rokkit kans
3 rokkit kans
3 rokkit kans

i had first turn (siezed the init actually) and surged forward. snikrot and the truk squads i kept in reserve.

i just braved the guns and pressed on. granted guard can dump out alot of fire, but with all the cover/KFF saves i was getting i only lost about 20 boyz before they got stuck in.

my number one recommendation is what everyone else said, snikrot, kommandos and 2 burnas. in this game snikky came in behind his command squad with an infantry platoon and heavy weapons platoon all sitting in cover. i flicked on the 2 burnas and they accounted for 16 deaths, the asault the followed wiped the entire unit off the board.

snikrot usually always goes for rear artillery basalisks or whirl winds, but sometimes i toss him into a unit where i know he is gonna die but will last long enough to delay the target unit a round or 2 so the rest of my army can better prepare for it.

try to mount al your troops in trukks battlewagons or looted wagons
dont take shoota boyz
nobz should be on bikes or in a battlewagon if you have 10 of em
Rush the imps
get red paint job on all you vehicles
ensure that you are fighting in the 2nd turn
i know, now your army looks like speed freeks instead of goffs but its a good way of beating imps

That depends on what kind of guard your friend is running. A gun line will require blast weapons and storm boyz to occupy the line giving time for the big mob to get up into range. Another option is mechanization, but be carful given the number of lascannons a guard army can cram in.

Mechanized or tank heavy will require shokk gun artillery and fast moving anti-tank like nob bikes.

Things to look out for heavy weapon teams, artillery pieces, leman russes, ogryns. These will be some of your most dangerous enemies when facing armies of guard.

I have to disagree about not taking shootas. They allow you to pump out a ridiculous amount of shots and they can handle guardsmen just as good as a slugga boy.

Agreed. I run a big unit of both. If I need to hold, shoota's get the job done, especially in the open.

If I gotta run, slugga's get er done.

Canonness Rory wrote:You're screwed.

Trufe trufe.

Hmmmm, I'll try to

1: Field more Trukk Boyz
2: Get more Vehicles
3: Get Snikrot in the list
4: Get some Stormboyz
5: Find a Way to kill da 'Ard stuff.

Scrazza wrote:try to mount al your troops in trukks battlewagons or looted wagons
dont take shoota boyz
nobz should be on bikes or in a battlewagon if you have 10 of em
Rush the imps
get red paint job on all you vehicles
ensure that you are fighting in the 2nd turn
i know, now your army looks like speed freeks instead of goffs but its a good way of beating imps

Really? Looted wagons are a no. Just dont do it. Trukks are much better, have a gun included, and cost the same. Looted wagons are only for if you cant figure out a way to get a trukk, and even then, consider a battle wagon. RPJ is questionably useful, I dont know that the extra inch is worth the five points- think about it, when have you ever needed one inch? On one trukk it isnt such a big deal, but when you field 6-8 vehicles we are talking 30-40 points, esp when your goal is to get to the enemy in the second turn. RPJ will get you in combat first turn in DOW, but even then it is questionably worth it.

Shoota boyz have a purpose, even against guard. Never just dont take them, considder if they have a role then decide. I use my shoota boyz to soften up large squads before I charge with another squad, to take out smaller, less combat ready squads, also to keep my KFF mek covered.

I am a guard player, and personally what I'm scared off are lots of killa kans and dreadnoughts, since if these get stuck in, there is practically nothing we have (except straken and priests with eviscerators) that can handle these in assault....

for snikrot as well as the deep strike character, luckily we have master of the fleet now, that can help delay when they comes in, and for the deep strike stormboyz an allied DH with mystics help....and I would turtle up in a corner, deploy sacrificial shield units around the 2 sides where snikrot can come in, and brace for impact...then retaliate the next turn....

Bikes and Kans/Dredds. thats what makes my Guard go limp and waiflike.

Either he is running a gunline, which foot orks hard-counter and you are going to win every game without making any adjustment. Or he is going to be running mechanized, and your foot list is pretty much in trouble.

If he starts running mechanized, I advise for you to start taking single deffkoptas with tl rokkits and a buzzsaw. You get a first turn charge on his stuff if you manage to go first, and if you are going second you can outflank with them.

If you aren't running killa kans as the support to your foot list, then they are really the best bet to opening up tanks without bunching up a unit for template death. Aside from lootas, which I'm sure you have at least 30 of... right?

Ultimately, you should think about transitioning to a mechanized force. Foot orks are cool and you should definitely hang on to them. (defending a planetstrike is one thing that comes to mind) But they are a victim of their own dominance. Foot orks struggle against armor, so people are taking mass armor to stay alive against you.

Battlewagons with boarding planks, deffkoptas and rokkit buggies are a more 'modern' choice for today's greenskin.

trust me the guard player isnt gonna know how many lascannons he is gonna use if you dont tell your army list to him

Scrazza wrote:trust me the guard player isnt gonna know how many lascannons he is gonna use if you dont tell your army list to him

Any guard player worth his salt will bring enough anti armor to do the job. They have the ability to bring a good mix of anti armor and anti infantry in the same list. In friendly games it would be a good idea to share lists. You don't want to be stuck with the stigma of an unfun sod to play against. That causes your opponent pool to dry up rather quickly,

Elnicko5 wrote:RPJ is questionably useful, I dont know that the extra inch is worth the five points- think about it, when have you ever needed one inch? On one trukk it isnt such a big deal, but when you field 6-8 vehicles we are talking 30-40 points, esp when your goal is to get to the enemy in the second turn. RPJ will get you in combat first turn in DOW, but even then it is questionably worth it.

Oh, God.
I've REALLY gotta disagree here. ALWAYS take that RPJ. You never know when it's going to help. Even on trukks.

I just played a NASTY game against a well built IG army with an above average (but not GREAT) Ork army (not built by me).
We had 3 battlewagons with RPJ's. His tanks annihilated them on his turn 2 (bottom of turn 2). At the top of turn 3 the orks inside charged... They LITERALLY made it by the skin of their teeth. They had 18 inches for move/waaagh/charge and (with gazzy's Waaagh), it was only about 1/8 of an inch (or less) more than they needed. Without the 2 extra inches from 2 rounds of RPJ, those orks would have been sitting ducks.

I've had numerous occasions where that extra inch made the difference between my trukk contesting an objective or not... EVERY time that's happened, it's given me a tie or win.
It's also helpful if you need to get a unit far across the table lengthwise (maybe to that unclaimed objective FTW).

Always take the RPJ. The extra movement is MORE than worth it...


Eric



Automatically Appended Next Post:

Toxxic wrote:

Scrazza wrote:trust me the guard player isnt gonna know how many lascannons he is gonna use if you dont tell your army list to him

Any guard player worth his salt will bring enough anti armor to do the job. They have the ability to bring a good mix of anti armor and anti infantry in the same list. In friendly games it would be a good idea to share lists. You don't want to be stuck with the stigma of an unfun sod to play against. That causes your opponent pool to dry up rather quickly,

Agreed... but there's no reason to tip your hand and show him what you're holding BEFORE he makes his list (which is what I think Toxxic meant).
Definitely share lists AFTER both armies are created, but don't let him know in advance.


Eric

Yes RPJ is worth its weight in gold.

Yup MagikalMemories that's what I meant, I should have clarified that better. Sorry about that.

I know for sure he's not running mechanized, so I'll be fine.

So Horde Boyz is a no? I'd hope not, as I'm not too excited about changing up my list, but whatever works I guess.

Toxxic wrote:Yup MagikalMemories that's what I meant, I should have clarified that better. Sorry about that.

LOL
No. The apologies are all mine.
It was clear to me what YOU meant... I SHOULD have typed that I think that's what scrazza meant (but didn't say clearly),

Eric

It would seem that the key would be to engage both fodder and important targets at the same time. If you don't hit the fodder squads, you're gonna get your boys riddled with holes, but if you're ignoring the key units while engaging the fluff, you're gonna tear through the fluff and get your green hindquarters handed to you. You need to engage as much of their army as possible as quickly as possible.

To sum it up simply:

"DAM 'DA TORPEEDOZ! FULL WAAAGH AHED, BOYZ!"

A good player will probably let you have a flank, stagger rows of meatshields, whilst he rips a hole in the other side of your army. This denies you the ability to hit his entire line hard. Knowing where he intends to manuevre his key units will help your charges count, because you can't count on all (or even half!) of your orks getting in, and there are a lot of combat situations with IG just not worth getting into at all.