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Just heard from the manager that this store in the franklin mills mall is closing in the next month.

Eek! I have that set as "my store" for the GW website contest. I hope they don't close before I win.

I haven't been there in years due to distance but it sucks to see em go.

I'd been a couple of times. I'm not surprised. The guys that ran the store were good but the mall didn't strike me as a good location for a GW store. It struck me that mall was geared towards a different demographic and that GW could do better elsewhere. Couple that with the fact that GW's largest cost is the overhead as a result of maintaining the infrastructure supporting "proper" GW stores and you can see why they'd cut weak performers.

Franklin Mills was designed as an 'outlet mall'. So it gets lots of people looking for bargain clothes and housewares, not as much regular traffic. Coupled with empty anchors, it's probably a much worse location than it used to be. I expect that you'll see another GW store in that area of town soon, in more of a strip mall location.

Maybe this means they'll open Warhammer World US in the philly area, preferably about 5 minutes from my house.

mikhaila wrote:Franklin Mills was designed as an 'outlet mall'. So it gets lots of people looking for bargain clothes and housewares, not as much regular traffic. Coupled with empty anchors, it's probably a much worse location than it used to be. I expect that you'll see another GW store in that area of town soon, in more of a strip mall location.

Who's the dumbass that thought it was a good idea to put a GW in an outlet mall

Necros wrote:Maybe this means they'll open Warhammer World US in the philly area, preferably about 5 minutes from my house.

They did, but it's in my basement, and only I get to play there.

Find me a building with cheap rent and 8000 square feet of space Tim, and I'll show you the future site of WallyworldPhilly.

Probably an accountant or distirict manager who's never been to Phillidelphia and thought "this is a good part of town" and "the rent is sooooo affordable, we'd be stupid not to."

olympia wrote:

mikhaila wrote:Franklin Mills was designed as an 'outlet mall'. So it gets lots of people looking for bargain clothes and housewares, not as much regular traffic. Coupled with empty anchors, it's probably a much worse location than it used to be. I expect that you'll see another GW store in that area of town soon, in more of a strip mall location.

Who's the dumbass that thought it was a good idea to put a GW in an outlet mall

For a while GW has a deal with the Mill's Mall chain, and was putting one in each of the malls. Franklin Mills sucked in a lot of businesses back in the day, as it was prophesied as Philly's big hot spot. Sadly, that never quite happened, and in this economy, it's an empty, quiet, hole.

I always thought it would have made more sense if GW had put their store in something more like the Plymouth Meeting Mall. Which is nicer mall in a better area.

mikhaila wrote:

Necros wrote:Maybe this means they'll open Warhammer World US in the philly area, preferably about 5 minutes from my house.

They did, but it's in my basement, and only I get to play there.

Find me a building with cheap rent and 8000 square feet of space Tim, and I'll show you the future site of WallyworldPhilly.

There's gotta be someplace like that in philly somewhere. We just might have to share the space with crack addicts, but once they get high enough they'll just sit there and not bother anyone.

I think there's already a game store in plymouth meeting mall but I've never been in there. I think King of Prussia has one too but I hear the rent there is just stupid.

It would be great if they would live up to the "hobby center" name and open a big place to play with modeling and painting areas and a well stocked store section, but that would probably cater more to vets who won't spend as much as kids with mom's money to burn in the mall on friday night.

I had a conversation with an employee at a GW about this store's closing recently, and apparently the close has more to do with the mall raising the rent for stores renewing their leases than actual poor sales in the store. There is a sound economic strategy; raise the rent for stores that are already having problems making their bottom line. Why would they close if we are making them pay more to stay in a failing mall?

mikhaila wrote:

olympia wrote:

mikhaila wrote:Franklin Mills was designed as an 'outlet mall'. So it gets lots of people looking for bargain clothes and housewares, not as much regular traffic. Coupled with empty anchors, it's probably a much worse location than it used to be. I expect that you'll see another GW store in that area of town soon, in more of a strip mall location.

Who's the dumbass that thought it was a good idea to put a GW in an outlet mall

For a while GW has a deal with the Mill's Mall chain, and was putting one in each of the malls. Franklin Mills sucked in a lot of businesses back in the day, as it was prophesied as Philly's big hot spot. Sadly, that never quite happened, and in this economy, it's an empty, quiet, hole.

The same thing happened here in the Denver area at Colorado Mills last year. We were told that rent was being raised by too much and GW pulled out. Unfortunately for us it was the only store in the region and the closest GW hobby center is probably in either California or Texas

Poor is a relativistic thing. Poor sales relative to the old rent, no. Poor sales relative to the new rent, yes. The amount a store is expected to sell is directly related to the amount of investment GW has put into it.

I think its just the Mill Malls, over estimating their relationship with GW. They probably think GW needs them more than they actually do. That GW would be willing to absorb additional cost out of the inertia it would take to move the store.

What are the decent game stores in downtown Philly? I'm moving back there soonish. I think it would be cool open one...

I dunno about in philly, but in the burbs there's a few. Showcase Comics in Granite Run Mall or in Bryn Mawr. There's TDS in west chester, I think there's one in plymouth meeting mall and king of prussia mall, and I think there's a complete strategist in King of prussia but I've never been in there. A guy I used to work with was always talking about the Roundtable in Conshohoken but they didn't stock GW so I never cared. I personally shop at Showcase, since Mike always has what I need and will get it quick if he doesn't I rarely play in stores though since I never have time :( but mike also has plenty of gaming space and events pretty often.

Malls raise their rent to get rid of the stores that are not drawing enough of the right traffic. I used to work in a food court in a mall and that is how they changed their shops. Once the mall wanted to get more high end, they raised the rent for the low end shops. Thus, they closed down and a few days later construction started for a new high end shop.

mikhaila wrote:

olympia wrote:

mikhaila wrote:Franklin Mills was designed as an 'outlet mall'. So it gets lots of people looking for bargain clothes and housewares, not as much regular traffic. Coupled with empty anchors, it's probably a much worse location than it used to be. I expect that you'll see another GW store in that area of town soon, in more of a strip mall location.

Who's the dumbass that thought it was a good idea to put a GW in an outlet mall

For a while GW has a deal with the Mill's Mall chain, and was putting one in each of the malls. Franklin Mills sucked in a lot of businesses back in the day, as it was prophesied as Philly's big hot spot. Sadly, that never quite happened, and in this economy, it's an empty, quiet, hole.

Yeah, I also think Franklin Mills data probably looked really good on paper until you did a little more research. The rent was probably reasonable for a mall, with lots of population around it, decent mall traffic and a spot next to a video game store (although they weren't always in that spot, IIRC).

But the reality of that location is that it's a PITA to get to from many of the major suburbs. And there are people who (right or wrong) are scared of that mall thanks to some of the incidents they've had there in the parking lots, etc.

Anyway, it's still a shame to lose a place for hobbyists to game. I assume they're moving their stock to other stores and not doing a closing sale, right?

Necros wrote:I dunno about in philly, but in the burbs there's a few.

Would a game store in downtown Philly do well? Would people in the burbs go to downtown Philly for a tournament?

Me personally I would never go into Philly for anything I didn't need to. #1 reason is parking. it just sucks. There might be better places in NE philly but I don't know that area at all. Maybe something in the University of Penn / Drexel area might be ok if you only expect foot traffic from students, or maybe Old City for foot traffic also, but it seems like the only reason people go there is food and booze. Same with Rittenhouse square. Manayunk might be ok, but again parking will suck. All of those places will likely have really high rent.

Necros wrote:All of those places will likely have really high rent.

truth

There's a store in university city that's got a couple of tables for gaming and is doing GW now. Redcaps Games, it's sharing space with a comic and video shop. Check them out when you get in the area.

Based on past experience, doing business in the city limits can be an extreme pain. I used to have a comic/game store on South Street. GW had a store 2 blocks down, and when they closed, we did a deal to move into their bigger store and buy the stock and fixtures. It worked good for a while, but the city wore me down with insane taxes, fees, fines, and other grabs that basically came down to "bribe us so we don't drag you to court". They also hit me with 7k in fines over 5 years for taxes that I had reciepts and cancelled checks showing I paid. Every year we straightened things out, and then 3 months later they sent us another, larger bill. Philadelphia still does not have computerized records. Makes it easier to screw up an account, which is fixable by hiring an 'expiditer' who will take care of things for you. ("Here's my 1k bribe, keep half, spread the other half around, and make my troubles go away.")

We eventually fixed things the hard way, and finally sold the business to friends/employees who lived in the city. I'll never open a shop in the city limits again.

As to tournaments, most people in the suburbs probably won't head intown for tourneys. Parking, driving, etc. can be hellish.

Sadly Mike, I have heard much the same thing from just about every other buisiness owner in a city I have talked to, from liquor liscence issues to handicapped access. It seems that most cities anymore are setting up regulations such that the beaurocrats can request bribes while they work and get part time work as "expiditers" when they retire. Why there are not more armed revolts is beyond me...

It would be handy for me if a GW or simialar store opened up there on Red Lion road near where the Best Buy was/is. I could probably convince my wife to buy me something every time I drove her down to her parent's place for something Unfortunately, Showcase Comics is out of the way, so I can't guilt her into any quid pro quo. Mike has a great store though; I highly recommend going.

Jumping on the Philadelphia discussion, I visited Philly earlier in the summer to see the two live Cinematic Titanic shows there. Luckily, our hotel had it's own parking garage and I wisely did not move the car the whole weekend, we walked everywhere since the hotel was close to the theater and many fun historical attractions. I didn't get back in the car till it was time to go home.

Driving in the city just to get to the hotel in the first place was a bit of a nightmare. During the weekend while walking around the city I've never heard so many car horns in my life and I live in the D.C./Baltimore area with some of the worst traffic in the country. Seriously, some people in Philly must blow their car horns every three seconds for every perceived problem and annoyance no matter how slight.

And of course, parking inside the city can be tough to find and quite expensive. If you're going to have a tournament there or convention, best to look to the suburbs.

The brotherly love in Philly is why they blow their horns.
Besides you have the Battle bunk in Baltimore close to you. By close I mean you can get there faster than I can from Jax, FL.

That mall is crazy big I would not be suprised if the whole thing is on it's way to shutting down. Every time I am there I think about the Capcom game Dead Rising.... what I wouldn't give to be able to run through that mall with a shotgun wasting zombies

Not only was the GW store in the wrong type of mall but they were in a horrible area of the mall which doesn't receive much foot traffic and the storefront was rather small. Still I'm surprised to see that GW won't have a store in an area that seems to have a lot of gamers.

As for the problems with Philly, I'm moving back into the area later this year, after having been gone for about a decade, and there is a reason why I'm avoiding moving into the city. Parking sucks, the taxes sucks, public transportation sucks, and there's little in the city that I can't find elsewhere.

Jumping on the Philadelphia discussion, I visited Philly earlier in the summer to see the two live Cinematic Titanic shows there. Luckily, our hotel had it's own parking garage and I wisely did not move the car the whole weekend, we walked everywhere since the hotel was close to the theater and many fun historical attractions. I didn't get back in the car till it was time to go home.

Driving in the city just to get to the hotel in the first place was a bit of a nightmare. During the weekend while walking around the city I've never heard so many car horns in my life and I live in the D.C./Baltimore area with some of the worst traffic in the country. Seriously, some people in Philly must blow their car horns every three seconds for every perceived problem and annoyance no matter how slight.

And of course, parking inside the city can be tough to find and quite expensive. If you're going to have a tournament there or convention, best to look to the suburbs.

Where are you people from that you think driving in Philly is rough? For a major metropolitan area, Philly has a suprising low number of cars. The layout of the streets makes getting anywhere so easy an ork wouldn't have to ask for directions. As for car horns, have you ever been to New York? They actually have city ordinances stating that you can be fined for using your horn. That's a city with horn problems.
In reality you should've been happy they were only blowing there car horns at you instead of shooting you. If Philly has one problem that keeps gamers (and everyone else) out it's a high rate of violent crime.

Redcap games is new to me, and i'm excited there's something in the city and just happens to be on the way to the subway station from me, so I'm gonna check it out on my way home from work in about 40 mins.

Theres a Gw opening in Delaware. Home of Tax free shopping!

As a Philadelphian born and raised (in a playground where I spent most of my dayz)...oops, nevermind... parking does suck in downtown Philly, and in Manayunk, and Old City, and RIttenhouse Square, and South Street. Parking lots in the downtown, convention center area (which is growing) is $24 a day. Near the theatres (not movies), $15.

I didn't know about the store in W Philly, and there is also another store on 3rd St (or 2nd) between Market and Arch in Old City. I think it only carries comics, etc. AFAIK, no gaming tables, but that is from a walk-by, I didn't go in.

I moved from Manayunk to the Northeast, 5 mins from the Franklin Mills Mall, and I rarely went there, except for the occasional paint purchase, or primer.

Getting a gaming group together has been tough, due to travel times and traffic which blows pretty much all the time - don't try to take the Schuylkill Expressway (the Surekill Distressway Parking Lot) at any time, and 95 is bad during rush hour, and now that they're doing construction. Ugh. And driving in Center City near City Hall, or the areas I mentioned above, can be rough most of the time during rush hours, and in the evenings.

I'd second a store in the Northeast, Red Lion Rd would be good, or maybe just outside the borders of Philly in Bucks County. We actually have free parking spots, grass, and trees out here in this part of Philly