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me and a friend played our first 40k game last night and i was unable to find this in the rules. if a space marine and ork unit were in close combat can another marine unit fire at the orks?

No, I do not believe so.

Though I understand that if they are in charge range, they can charge into CC with them.

if one unit is fighting in close combat with another unit, then no other unit on either side may fire into that close combat. They can however (as SilverMK2 said) charge into the combat to join it, making it a 2on1 close combat.

No, they cannot fire into the Close Combat. The rule is on Page 40 "Shooting into & out of Close Combat".

thanks thats what i suspected.

I'd like to see this rule modified for the Orks... it would be kind of interesting if they could fire into Close combats, but instead of missing, they hit their own troops instead.
It would sort of fit their fluff imho, they infight enough against themselves that it would be the perfect time to eliminate a foe and a clan enemy and fits the rest of their crazy mishap rules.


I might have to try this as a house rule sometime soon.

EDIT: edited my post as its not related to this topic even remotely

lol, and Dark Lord Seanron's post below is still a valid answer to it

Nope

Only times you can fire into close combat is in a 3 way battle, or if your using the vindicare assassin.

R3con wrote:Only times you can fire into close combat is in a 3 way battle, or if your using the vindicare assassin.

Or if you play Eldar

Or if you have blast markers.

Gwar! wrote:

R3con wrote:Only times you can fire into close combat is in a 3 way battle, or if your using the vindicare assassin.

Or if you play Eldar

When is this possible? I would like to know.

Vibro Cannons FTW

sbeasley wrote:

Gwar! wrote:

R3con wrote:Only times you can fire into close combat is in a 3 way battle, or if your using the vindicare assassin.

Or if you play Eldar

When is this possible? I would like to know.

It is possible if the blast template drifts into the assaulting units, but it affects friend and foe alike (ie counting figures under the template, rolling for wounds, and rolling for saves), but you would not be able to target the figures in CC themselves

Edit: Just thought of a interesting scenario, say one of your units is locked into CC with an enemy unit. The oppenent has a unit about an inch (I guess distance does not matter, it could be right up next to the squad for all I care) away from his unit in CC. Could I target that unengaged unit and have its template affect the unit in CC since it is under the template? (Assuming it did not deviate and covered part of the cc squad)

While blast markers and templates may not be deliberately placed such that they cover any models locked in combat, they may end up there after scattering and will then hit any models they touch (friends and foes!)

I had a game recently where this happened. My rhino was next to a libby terminator taking on a guant squad by himself. My opponent wanted his Tyrant to get in the mix but there was no room in b2b, so he targeted my rhino with a blast and hoped for it to drift onto the gaunts. He got his wish, killed enough to fit his tyrant in b2b. Needless to say, the tyrant finished the job the gaunts had been unable to do.

Anecdotes aside, gwar has it right.

Dracos wrote:I had a game recently where this happened. My rhino was next to a libby terminator taking on a guant squad by himself. My opponent wanted his Tyrant to get in the mix but there was no room in b2b, so he targeted my rhino with a blast and hoped for it to drift onto the gaunts. He got his wish, killed enough to fit his tyrant in b2b. Needless to say, the tyrant finished the job the gaunts had been unable to do.

Anecdotes aside, gwar has it right.

Errrm... the Tyrant should not have been able to assault the Librarian. He shot at the Rhino, so must assault the Rhino or not at all...

Or do you mean the blast came from somewhere else?

Unless he could charge both, and simply direct all the attacks at the Librarian.

kirsanth wrote:Unless he could charge both, and simply direct all the attacks at the Librarian.

No, he can't. Single models are unable to Multicharge.

Wha. . .

Really?

Aww man.

Time to read.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I do not see why that is the case. . .
Difficult, perhaps, but why is it disallowed?

kirsanth wrote:Wha. . .

Really?

Aww man.

Time to read.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I do not see why that is the case. . .
Difficult, perhaps, but why is it disallowed?

Because the first model to move into CC in the unit must move into BTB with the target. Only models AFTER the first may assault other units. The Closest model must always assault the unit that it shot at (and only that unit).

I did not think it impossible for closest to closest to include touching other models.

So long as the Tyrant moved to the closest point of the rhino, and was in base with the Librarian, no issue.

I agree that the multicharge rules specify that additional models are able to charge either unit, but why is it disallowed to get into base with both?

Editing to add: I can actually think of some times this would be required.
Again, I agree it would be rare and hard to pull off, but I cannot read it being illegal. Is it more than Page 34?

kirsanth wrote:I did not think it impossible for closest to closest to include touching other models.

So long as the Tyrant moved to the closest point of the rhino, and was in base with the Librarian, no issue.

I agree that the multicharge rules specify that additional models are able to charge either unit, but why is it disallowed to get into base with both?

Editing to add: I can actually think of some times this would be required.
Again, I agree it would be rare and hard to pull off, but I cannot read it being illegal. Is it more than Page 34?

You cannot do it because if you do you are not charging the unit you shot at.

Let me add a bit I left off, for no reason.

"So long as the Tyrant moved to the closest point of the rhino, and was in base with the Rhino and the Librarian, no issue. "

Scalp wrote:I'd like to see this rule modified for the Orks... it would be kind of interesting if they could fire into Close combats, but instead of missing, they hit their own troops instead.
It would sort of fit their fluff imho, they infight enough against themselves that it would be the perfect time to eliminate a foe and a clan enemy and fits the rest of their crazy mishap rules.


I might have to try this as a house rule sometime soon.

How about this: If they miss shooting into CC, roll 1d6 for each miss, on a 5 or 6 they hit their own unit? I made that up as a joke with my friend a few weeks ago, but try it. It sounds like fun.