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Noticed that the hunter killer is an option for the vehicles, yet there is no profile for the weapon in either the wargear section or the end summary of weapons.
Same thing as the cyclone for termies.
any ideas?

also, best layout for a pred (except the Baal)

Wow, so it is. Looks like BA cannot use Hunter Killers either

feth!
I was thinking about one for the pred aswell
Wasnt suer on thier profile so i went to check, and alas, tis no such thing :(

JD21290 wrote:feth!
I was thinking about one for the pred aswell
Wasnt suer on thier profile so i went to check, and alas, tis no such thing :(

Of course most people will not give two gaks.

Most people does not Include Gwar! Unless a Sacrifice of Ethanol to the Booze God hath been given!

With that idea out of the window im now left with a basic pred
I think either a TL las + 2 HB pred will do the job.
Or a pred with autocannon, 2x HB and a pintle storm

JD21290 wrote:With that idea out of the window im now left with a basic pred
I think either a TL las + 2 HB pred will do the job.
Or a pred with autocannon, 2x HB and a pintle storm

? sorry but take the baal predator its far better anti tank & anti infantry then a standard predator. Also you can always try the over charged engines for a bit of moving and shooting.

Tri, i would diagree here.
The ball would need to rend to do the job, as such, to get even it would need to roll a 5-6 each time for rending damage.
Meaning that to actually damage anything AV14 i would need to roll alot of high dice.

The las is TL meaning it will hit 90% of the time.
Its allready S9 meaning that it will easily damage vehicles.


Also, rending has no effect against living metal, meaning its a waste of time against things like that.


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Edit: I allready have a baal in my army

Also, the TL + 2 las pred is somewhat expensive, but with 3 las shots a turn it can wreck most vehicles that will pose a threat.

JD21290 wrote:Also, rending has no effect against living metal, meaning its a waste of time against things like that.

Things?
Against a Monolith you mean?

Shooting anything at them is generally a waste of time - shoot the Necrons.

Back to the topic at hand: HK rockets simply use a Krak rocket profile, there is no use in having a seperate profile for HK rockets

I know to shoot the crons and go for a phase out, but when people spam a triple lith army (very common now a days)
i need to make sure they wont use them as a living wall to block off parts of the table.

Granted that i would need a 6 for a pen hit against it, but its still more than possible through massed shooting.

Also, many people use the lith to keep the warriors either hidden or in reserve.
Without the ability to kill it im supposed to do what?


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Edit: thanks valkyrie, that seems to be a logical enough idea.

Valkyrie wrote:Back to the topic at hand: HK rockets simply use a Krak rocket profile, there is no use in having a seperate profile for HK rockets

Nowhere in the BA codex does it state what a HK Missile does.

Gwar! wrote:

Valkyrie wrote:Back to the topic at hand: HK rockets simply use a Krak rocket profile, there is no use in having a seperate profile for HK rockets

Nowhere in the BA codex does it state what a HK Missile does.

Well surely if HK's are mentioned as an upgrade but no other info included, then common sense would say use the profile from the generic SM Codex

Common sense would suggest using an unrelated book that is not referenced?

Really?

Just a point here, but in all and every book which includes the HK missile (newest editions), is its profile the same?
If it is, then the BA should use rules as such.

Valkyrie wrote:

Gwar! wrote:

Valkyrie wrote:Back to the topic at hand: HK rockets simply use a Krak rocket profile, there is no use in having a seperate profile for HK rockets

Nowhere in the BA codex does it state what a HK Missile does.

Well surely if HK's are mentioned as an upgrade but no other info included, then common sense would say use the profile from the generic SM Codex

Common sense suggests Dark Angels get 3++ Storm Shields and that Space Marines should be S10 T10 with a 2++ Save that is rolled on 3D6.

In other words: What Kirsanth said. It is a Moot Point because BA does not refer to Codex: Salamandar Clones in any way.

Gwar! wrote:It is a Moot Point because BA does not refer to Codex: Salamandar Clones in any way.

BAH!!!!!!



Why is that subject to debate?

kirsanth wrote:

Gwar! wrote:It is a Moot Point because BA does not refer to Codex: Salamandar Clones in any way.

BAH!!!!!!



Why is that subject to debate?

-giggles evilly- Hurrr Me are trolle HURRR!
But to get back on topic: @Valkyrie: What basis do you have in the rules to back up your position?

If every current edition HK works the same way with the same profile that weapon would then be a universal weapon (much like power weapons for example)

If they have a standard profile that does not change then i see no problem now.

JD21290 wrote:If every current edition HK works the same way with the same profile that weapon would then be a universal weapon (much like power weapons for example)

If they have a standard profile that does not change then i see no problem now.

Can you show me where HK Missiles have this "Standard profile". I see the entry for Power Weapons, but none for HK missiles.

Thats why i said its much like a power weapon, not the same as, Gwar
The bolter is used by many armies and every marine chapter, it allways has the same profile.
So it makes sense that if another weapon (such as the HK) has the same profile throughout every book that it would continue.


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Edit: Rule book says that spacemarines have the HK missile.
And the space marine section includes BA

JD21290 wrote:Thats why i said its much like a power weapon, not the same as, Gwar
The bolter is used by many armies and every marine chapter, it allways has the same profile.
So it makes sense that if another weapon (such as the HK) has the same profile throughout every book that it would continue.

Yes, but there are many cases where wargear does not have the same stats. How are we to determine what the stats for a Blood Angels HK missile are? Just because they are the "same" in every other codex means nothing (from a Rules Standpoint).

JD21290 wrote:Edit: Rule book says that spacemarines have the HK missile.
And the space marine section includes BA

Rulebook says that in the case of any differences, codex overrules rulebook.

Rulebook Says XYZ, Codex says nothing, so it does nothing.

Because if it is different then it tends to state otherwise (storm shields are a good example)

If there are say 3-4 armies that use the HK, and all use the same profile then i dont see why BA would have a different one atall.


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Its not a difference though Gwar, its missing from the BA dex, it is in the rulebook, meaning there is no conflict, just something to fill the gap.

And since you can purchase it as an upgrade then it is there.

JD21290 wrote:Its not a difference though Gwar, its missing from the BA dex, it is in the rulebook, meaning there is no conflict, just something to fill the gap.

And since you can purchase it as an upgrade then it is there.

You can purchase it just fine. Just like you can purchase a Cyclone Missile Launcher. It still doesn't do anything. And it is a Conflict. If Book A Says "This does This, but do whatever Book B says if different" and Book B does not mention it, Book B is different, thus it does nothing.

Gwar, im somewhat going to just ignore this.
The HK has a profile from the rulebook.
It also classes BA as marines in there, there is no sections that seperate chapters.
As such there is NO conflict about how the weapon functions. (the BA dex does not have its function, it simply leaves that to the rulebook)

Give me a reason why a weapon with a universal profile couldnt be used once you have purchased it for an upgrade.


To be honest, i think your a 1 of a kind person, unless i play against you, ill never have to worry about someone complaining.



Edit: A conflict is when 2 things do not agree (much like us now)
If i were to just not say anything the conflict would end.
The rules for the HK are in the rulebook.
The BA dex does not give the rules for the weapon, you then use your handy rulebook to check the rules for the SPACE MARINE HK missile.


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Gwar, please find a rule in the rule book that states you cannot use a weapon if the profile is not present in the dex, but is elsewhere instead.

Isn't the Hunter Killer Missile referred to in the Main Rulebook as well? Just thought. Unless we are requiring rules lawyers I think it is 100% correct to go from the Main Rulebook, or Space Marine Codex, Guard Codex, or any other Imperial Codex, since they are all the same. We need not such silliness as debating over what profile to use if the Hunter Killer is offered, it is always the same. Unless I am mistaken, I have heard not of the Hunter Killer being anything else but single shot, infinite (n/a) range, S8 and AP3, Heavy 1. Let us all put down our daggers and play a game of WARHAMMER 4o,ooo!!!!

Thank you skinnattittar!
someone else with some sense

Skinnattittar wrote:Let us all put down our daggers and play a game of WARHAMMER 4o,ooo!!!!

Hey, don't get me wrong. Not even I am gonna say "No you cannot use it." Even I have limits to GW's ineptitude. However, I always (and I do mean always) Follow the RaW and explain to the opponent that "XYZ is the RaW".

Also, you missed a G there, it's Spelt Gwarhammer.

For reference, it is really hard to find rules telling you that you should only use your codex for your army (or NOT do just about anything - the rules tell you what you CAN do).
That said, Main rule book viii under "Codexes" lets you know that each codex "contains. . . complete rules for all the models in the force, along with their weapons and wargear".

So looking elsewhere for them is. . . questionable. At best.


Anyhow, carry on.

Gwar! wrote:

Skinnattittar wrote:Let us all put down our daggers and play a game of WARHAMMER 4o,ooo!!!!

Hey, don't get me wrong. Not even I am gonna say "No you cannot use it." Even I have limits to GW's ineptitude. However, I always (and I do mean always) Follow the RaW and explain to the opponent that "XYZ is the RaW".

Hey everyone, I think Gwar! needs a hug. We all should give Gwar! a great big hug. It is RAW you know.

-hugs Gwar!-

It is the cheese.

Gwar, you only play RAW right?
The HK missile has a profile Writen in the rulebook
It doesent have one in the BA dex.

So how can you play RAW when there is nothing writen as such?


Also, why put down daggers? when playing 40k they help


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So looking elsewhere for them is. . . questionable. At best.

But you would have to look elsewhere when a weapon profile is not present.
and the prfile of a generic weapon would be a reliable one.