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Does anyone know what happened to the loyalist Iron Warriors, Night Lords, Alpha Legion, Word Bearers and Thousand Sons during the Heresy? Are they massacred in some way like the Death Guard/Sons of Horus/World Eaters/Emperor's Children?

If so, how? Or has this yet to be resolved in the books? Or are those legions more traitorous than the others, so only had a tiny fraction remain loyalist, instead of 1/4-1/3?

Most likely, there was indeed some sort of culling of loyalists among at least some of those legions, but we have yet to see that happen in the novels. For the Word Bearers, it probably happened before the time frame of any of the books since they're already scheming for Chaos in Horus Rising, but I expect to see the other four experience schisms as we get further into the series. (Wolves vs. 1ksons hasn't even hit book shelves yet, so we're definitely still early days.)

Well, I'd argue that the entire Thousand Sons Legion was loyalist up until Leman Russ and his puppies walked up to their door and flaunted a death warrant from the Emperor himself.

So what happened to the loyalist Sons? They didn't survive Prospero.

Also, as the Word Bearers turned before everyone else, I doubt that there were any that didn't believe Lorgar's rhetoric(especially as he probably started as preaching a new religion at first and NOT treason).

And the entirety of the Alpha Legion are STILL loyalists, at least if you believe Legion.

The entirety of the Alpha Legion were loyalist at the end of Legion according to that book. They have a lot of Horus Heresy ahead of them before we know their full story. I suspect Abnett is not done with them yet.

inquisitorfaust wrote:The entirety of the Alpha Legion were loyalist at the end of Legion according to that book. They have a lot of Horus Heresy ahead of them before we know their full story. I suspect Abnett is not done with them yet.

True, especially as they fight the Ultramarines even after Horus dies - why would they do that when the last hope for the survival of the galaxy has died (or at least last hope according to the information they have etc).

I wonder if maybe the Legion actually tried to play it clever and it blew up in their faces. If they accept that Horus is destined to mortally wound the Emperor once they go mano a mano and damn the galaxy, then the way to head that off is to get close to Horus, and elminate him before the epic duel can happen, thus preventing the Emperor's injuries and preventing the prediction of the Xenos Seers. So they say the oaths, drink the communion wine, double-cross at Istvaan, etc. etc. just going along with it as a lie, but once the taint sets in, it's taint.

That whole Ultras vs. Alphas fight after the Heresy might be a sort of reverse Istvaan. Where the other legions went over to chaos right at the start, the Ultras were, as they claim, never anywhere near the place and this fight is a metaphor or something for the final fight between loyalist alphas that wanted to betray Horus, and the ones that had the taint fully take over and have given in to the Primordial Annihlator.

Well, that's all speculation and guesswork, but it would fit with Legion and everything else we know about the Alphas so I hope it actually plays out that way.

You talk about the Thousand Sons, but you forget the aftermath of Prospero,
The Rubric of Ahriman

They were presumably killed in "accidents" before the heresy or absorbed into other Legions. If any escaped to Terra I'm sure others would have taken them in.

Loyalist Thousand Sons supposedly became Blood Ravens.

There were also a handful of loyalists who became the first Grey Knights and founded the Ordo Malleus as it is today. The only two I can remember are Nathaniel Garro of the Death Guard and a World Eater.

Cheese Elemental wrote:Loyalist Thousand Sons supposedly became Blood Ravens.

There were also a handful of loyalists who became the first Grey Knights and founded the Ordo Malleus as it is today. The only two I can remember are Nathaniel Garro of the Death Guard and a World Eater.

Close but not quite, the loyalist Thousand Sons and other remaining loyalists, notably those with psychic powers, formed the Grey Knights, which eventually became the militant arm of the Ordo Malleus when it was up and running (the Ordos is really an Inquisition thing, and it took a while to develop after the Heresy).

Afaik, the Blood Ravens are not a second founding chapter. They were formed much later using elements from the Thousand Sons gene-seed (and other Traitor Legions?) basically as a test to see if using the Traitor Legions gene-seed was still viable and whether it would have any major side effects.

iron warriors always had a hate for dorn and the fists, and where on the warmasters side as soon as he turned, umm night lords just wanted to murder, maybe they where too violent and apparently their primarch had 3 assasination attempts against him before the heresy, so LORD OF NIGHT book says

Iron Warriors helped other traitor legions destroying Imperium's strongholds. When Horus got killed, they retreated (with organisation, unlike other legions who simply ran away) to Mendregad in the Eye of Terror; it would be their new homeworld.
They also made a trap for the Imperial Fists, a world totally converted into a stronghold, but without any purpose or objetive into its core. Imperial Fists offloaded there, and all were killed. This victory made of Perturabo, Iron Warriors' Primarch, a Demon Prince.

Powerguy wrote:

Close but not quite, the loyalist Thousand Sons and other remaining loyalists, notably those with psychic powers, formed the Grey Knights, which eventually became the militant arm of the Ordo Malleus when it was up and running (the Ordos is really an Inquisition thing, and it took a while to develop after the Heresy).

Afaik, the Blood Ravens are not a second founding chapter. They were formed much later using elements from the Thousand Sons gene-seed (and other Traitor Legions?) basically as a test to see if using the Traitor Legions gene-seed was still viable and whether it would have any major side effects.

Umn, I don't think either of these 'facts' are actually correct... If so I'd love to see your sources ^^

I knew, that it was Rogal Dorn who gave the loyalists of the former traitor legions, the order to form the bulk of the Grey Knights.

I don't remember where I read this... also I don't know how good reference the books are. Many have told me that the books are just offsprings and non correct versions of the facts that are taking places in the 40k Universe.

So I don't know if they are valid.

in the book flight of the esiention or whatever

that was the best horus heresy book

Konrad is the only good primarch i must say
he lets himself be killed after the heresy

physcosamatic wrote:night lords just wanted to murder, maybe they where too violent and apparently their primarch had 3 assasination attempts against him before the heresy, so LORD OF NIGHT book says

This is not known for certain. The Daemon prince suggests that Konrad was lying to the Talonmaster in order to set the events of the book in motion. It is also possible that Haunter was driven mad by his visions of the future, and confused his dreams of the coming assassin attempts with a reality where no assassin attempts were made until after they went heretic but he was seeing that future over and over again.

Powerguy wrote: Close but not quite, the loyalist Thousand Sons and other remaining loyalists, notably those with psychic powers, formed the Grey Knights, which eventually became the militant arm of the Ordo Malleus when it was up and running (the Ordos is really an Inquisition thing, and it took a while to develop after the Heresy).

Afaik, the Blood Ravens are not a second founding chapter. They were formed much later using elements from the Thousand Sons gene-seed (and other Traitor Legions?) basically as a test to see if using the Traitor Legions gene-seed was still viable and whether it would have any major side effects.

LOL....I love when people put forward these "facts".....how long have you been into WH40K? Nothing you've posted has any basis in current WH40K fluff. Its speculation at BEST, and even then you're a way off from the established speculation.

I suggest you do some more research before putting forward your point, it might avoid leading others to follow your same confused path

As far as I got from Legion, Alpha legion are good but if the imperium survives the humanity will become extinct in a relavitly short space of time where as if chaos is the eventual winner the humanity will last for much longer tho under the rule of chaos. So to keep humanity in existence they fight for chaos.

So the space smuffs incident was just them carrying on the fight, thats why they still say "for the emperor"

... I really need to read Black Library

Ok I know this is off topic but you all seem to know a good bit about the books. Is there a HH about the BA or one that is upcoming? I mean I know they were on Terra and what not and Horus killed Sanguineous. I've read the lexicon stuff as well. Sorry to derail.

umm i dont think they have done a HH version, but im going to get the blood angles obnious, looks kickass

i agree with delephont, the whole blood raves and thousand sons link is a true conspiracy and has No strong evidence besides none of the DOW games had any thousand sons in it :( and that game was the way to get blood ravens into the scene and also rack in a whole new wave of GW customers. also grey knights are no way linked to thousand sons!!!

also the whole konrad kurts story rreaaaaly tripped me out, and the whole lord of night book was crazy as i might of said ^^

can anyone answer for me how did lemun russ break magnuses back? they better write a book on that part oh the HH

Lorgar's Herald wrote:As far as I got from Legion, Alpha legion are good but if the imperium survives the humanity will become extinct in a relavitly short space of time where as if chaos is the eventual winner the humanity will last for much longer tho under the rule of chaos. So to keep humanity in existence they fight for chaos.

So the space smuffs incident was just them carrying on the fight, thats why they still say "for the emperor"

I don't think that's quite right.

The Cabal really did NOT have humanity's best interests at heart.

At issue was the Galaxy's eventual survival, not humanity's.

I think.

Anyway, the Alpha Legion - still loyal, 10,000+ years later!

Alpharius is correct.
The following is the two possible outcomes of the Heresy as seen by the Cabal (directly from lexicanum.com)
Outcome One: Victory for Horus
The Cabal believed that, after the Heresy, a scintilla of the honourable being he once was would remain within Horus, eating at him and fueling a self-destructive sense of self-hatred and loathing that would see Horus fall on his subjects in an acceleration of the violence of the Heresy, creating civil strife amongst the traitor and Chaotic forces that would culminate in a final armageddon. The end result of Horus leading humanity would be total extermination of the human species within two or three generations...however, if this were so, the powers of Chaos, so heavily invested in humanity, would be extinguished with it.

Outcome Two: Victory for the Emperor
The foreseen outcome of the Heresy, the Cabal saw the Emperor giving his life to kill Horus, becoming a howling rictus trapped inside the Golden Throne. They believed that this path would lead to stagnation, and stagnation to decay. This decay would accelerate, continually allowing the Chaos powers to grow and spread their influence, until after ten or twenty thousand years of misery, the entire galaxy would be consumed by Chaos.

Lorgar's Herald wrote:As far as I got from Legion, Alpha legion are good but if the imperium survives the humanity will become extinct in a relavitly short space of time where as if chaos is the eventual winner the humanity will last for much longer tho under the rule of chaos. So to keep humanity in existence they fight for chaos.

So the space smuffs incident was just them carrying on the fight, thats why they still say "for the emperor"

Wrong. Alpharius-Omegon is shown before the Heresy that if the Emperor sacrificed himself and doomed Humanity, Chaos would be defeated at the cost of our race. Seeing this as a better result for the universe at large than what ended up happening(the Emperor slowly withers on his throne as the war and suffering are drawn out for thousands of years) they fought on the side of Chaos to bring about the former. As they did not align themselves with the Chaos gods but rather fought on Horus' side to bring about a specific long-term goal, none of them succumbed to madness or mutation and their battle-cry remains "for the Emperor!".