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Hey All,

I have recently thought about doing a death Korps of Krieg army, but I am rather put off by the possibility of spending 50 plus dollars per 10 man squad. I am also quite ken on Leman Russ tanks so I thought, why not put the two together?

So I thought about something along the following lines:

Cheap CCS w/Chimera

3x10 Vets in Chimera's

1xLeman Russ MBT, 1xExecutioner

1xLeman Russ MBT, 1xExecutioner

1x?? posibly with Pask (mainly for fluff reasons, I like the idea behind a tank ace)

So what do you guys think?? Viable??

Thanks for your thoughts and opinions.

Chappy P!

I would not squadron Leman Russes like that, the MBT and the Executioner don't have synergy in range or AP.

You also have to look at the fact while you can squadron tanks like that, you are losing your ability to have them target units separately, resulting in the possibility of a lot of Overkill.

Tank squadrons are pretty terribad when those thunder hammer terminators or (insert other nasty assault unit with high strength here) assaults you on rear armor.

Keep your heavy tank count to 3 total and get some Valkyries\Vendettas or Hellhound variants.

Executioner is a good choice but pretty expensive for 1500. Would not run more then 1 at 1500.

Run a Manticore as well. D3 Strength 10 large blasts can be very devastating.

Pask is pretty expensive. Might want to skip Pask in favor of more Tanks.

Give your Vets and Company Command Squad Meltas to kill Land Raiders and heavy armor.

I agree massively with Avariel's statements.

As do I. I find 2 tanks is usually enough if I pair them correctly (usually a demolisher variant and a MBT variant). If you want more armor, add in chimeras, hellhounds, valks, etc. The Ordinance Battery is usually the only time I would squadron vehicles, and that's because I usually have them stuffed in a corner somewhere.

I've run a 4 Leman russ army at 1500 with fair success:

Company Command Squad:
-Melta x 4
-Chimera
-Astropath
-Ofc of the Fleet

Veterans:
-3x Melta
-Bostonne
-Grenadiers
-Demo

Infantry Platoon
Platoon Command Squad
-Mortar
Infantry squad
Infantry squad

Vendetta

LR x2
Demoilsher x2
Manticore
-Camo


My infantry platoon amd CCS setup a cordon around the tanks to prevent anything from reaching melta or assault range with out hitting them first, and that block of tanks and men advance together hammering everything they meet. Meanwhile the Manticore does its thing and the Vendetta generally outflanks with the Veterans on board either as late game objective thieves or to cause mayhem with damaged units for KP.

It lacks some oomph against monstrous creatures and I've been toying with a new list with Executioners with plasma sponsons in place of the demolishers as a solution, but have not played it as much.

Jack

I'm not a fan of russes anymore, though i used to...
For the points of one LR BT with HB sponsons you get... a Manticore? 2 Hydras? 4 AC Sentinels?
Yes, they are AV 14 and they got that funny pie plate... but Hellhounds (or variants) can kill infantry more effectively negating cover and wounding them on 2+ most of the time. The only argument speaking towards a Russ is that AV 14 imo... any other role can be complied by other units as well and more efficiently.

Im going to agree with cpt. icanus on the LR thing with one exception. the exe is still the most devistating unit in the IG codex. imo any list 1500pts and over needs to have one. dont get me wrong its very costly but if you need a unit that can take down any thing on the table this is your baby, but you only need one to much of a point sink to take more. the rest of the RLs are next to worthless, ill run a dem in my 1750 or 2500 list for anti deepstrike, and a pun w/ pask if i think i may see alot of ork. dont stack LR when the real power of the IG codex is in the fast attack right now. vend are just op for the points, i realy like the chem cannon type of hellhound w/ a MM off the front, its going to die every game but before it does its going to wreck a tac squad or 2 and pop a Land raider. ive also found that my chimeras almost do more damage then my melta vets in 1500pt games, you dont have to worry about the instant first turn death of 2-3 melta units that you must think about in the larger point games (2000-2500). so ive put in only 1 melta vet, and used my CCS for the 2ed melta vet unit to tank hunt. and put in 1 PCS w/ flamers, and 2x IS w/ and AC. the extra point give me more chimeras, puting my 1500 list at 9 tanks.

sorry i started to rant.....hope something in there was helpfull

Played in a 1500 point tournament against an IG player that had a Demolisher, an Execution, and a Leman Russ Squadron.

Russ squadrons are hard to deal with if you have to go through multiple Meltavet squads to get to them.

Thanks for the replies everyone!

Ok I am going to try and flesh the list out some, but here's a question:

If I were to put in a Hell Hound or two, or even three, which variation would work best?

Also would Creed be a good choice to put into such a list? Or is that jacking the price up too much?

I have to run right now, but I'll post up a mock list probably in the list forums.

Again thanks for all the input!

All Hellhound variants are worthwile. The Banehound is the most preferred one atm as far as my experience goes. Only drawback it has is the simply not existant range, so it's likely to be in the open after shooting. But it's gun is to devastating against MEQs. If you're not to cross any power armored models the standard Hellhound is your choice. the 12" extra range to that flamer make it possible to stay in cover and thus survive longer. Finally the devil dog is a kind of jack of all trades but excels in killing Terminators and the like. If no such targets on the table just give him a MM and he's a fine tankhunter.
So HHvariantas can fill in any role.
Tank hunter and TEQ-killer needed? Devil Dog. Lots of tac marines or CSM? Banehound. Just a little more anti horde? Hellhound it is. everyone worth its points.

im going to agree with cpt. all the hellhound variants are viable. you just need to pick the one that compliments your build the best. i tend to shy away from the devil dog, most IG armys have more then the adequat firepower geared to anti tank or drop 2+ saves. but the choice between the hellhound and the bane wolf is alittle harder. both very good at killing troop. if you feel you can deal with SM/CSM well in your list go with the hellhound to deal with hord. and if you feel you can deal with hord well with your list go with the banewolf. as a side note, i like to put a MM on my banewolf. this compliments the short range and makes it more of a threat to the guy across the table. as for the hellhound the HB works fine, you prob wont be fireing it much any way.

Thanks again for the replies, so here's a rough idea of what I am thinking now...

Creed CCS w/Chimera - 195pts

3x10 Vets, 3xmelta's with Chimera rides - 465pts

2xBanewolf - 270pts (I think I put smoke on each one, these would be 2 separate units)

1xDemolisher - 165pts

1xExecutioner - 190pts

1xEither another Demolisher, Executioner or a plain Leman Russ MBT with points left over to add any upgrades I may need?

Thoughts?

The idea is with Creed, I won't need another CCS and I have the option of making the Banewolves a squadron and scouting them, or taking 2 Demolishers and scouting them. I thought about 2 demolisher to take care of any deep striking terminators or other such units?

What do you guys think?

Thanks,
Chappy P!

I have a list I run that is similar and very effective:

HQ
CCS - 4 x melta, chimera w/ heavy flamer and heavy stubber

Troops
Vet squad - 3 x melta, chimera w/ heavy flamer
Vet squad - 3 x melta, chimera w/ heavy flamer
Infantry platoon - pcs w/ 4 grenade launchers, 4 x infantry w/ 4 grenade launchers

Fast
Banewolf w/ mm

Heavy
Executioner w/ plasma sponsons
demolisher w/ mm sponsons
demolisher w/ mm sponsons

1500 on the nose. The infantry makes a 13" buffer to protect armor from melta/multimeltas and everything moves forward at the 6" + run of the infantry.

It takes some getting used to, but it is absolutely awesome when you get the hang of it.

@ Chaplain Pallantide. Most of Creed's cost is his immense order-giving ability. He has 4 orders a turn. There are only 4 units in your starting line-up that can take orders. None of them can be ordered about until they get out of their chimeras. I would spend the 90 points on something else here. Maybe a valk/vendetta (if you save points on your 3rd LRBT) or a sentinel squadron, either of these could give you some outflanking ability despite the lack of creed.

Someone pointed out to me the other day, an executioner costs the same as a vanilla LRBT with plasma sponsons. Against almost anything except meganobs/honour guard/non-stormshield terminators, the LRBT is better.

It's a pretty strong list, if you took light heavy support and cheaper CCS, could you fit in a 4th veteran squad? Scoring units are pretty necessary.

@Inigo Montoya: cool army, I really like the idea of the cheap platoon to protect the tanks.

Ok fellow Dakkites, how does this look now? Again I think over a short period of time I should be able to afford all this as I would like to use Forge World's Death Korps of Krieg models. I think I have a winner, but what do you guys think??

HQ:
CCS - 4xMeltaguns, Chimera - 145pts

Troops:
3x10 Vets, 3 Meltaguns, Chimera - 465pts

Fast Attack:
2xBanewolf - 260pts

Heavy Support:
2xLeman Russ MBT - 300pts

2xDemolishers - 330pts

Total: 1500pts on the nose!

Not enough mid/high strength ranged anti armor capability. Fire Dragon wave serpents, for example, will be on top of you before you can shoot them effectively. Ditto Vulkan Marines, Space Wolves, and any type of biker army.

That's your real weakness.

If you take Hull Heavy Flamers on all your vehicles you should be fine versus horde. I would probably drop one LRMBT for two Hydras, switch the Bane Wolves to Devil Dogs, and either buy an Astropath or upgrade the remaining LR to an Executioner with the extra points.

Avariel wrote:Tank squadrons are pretty terribad when those thunder hammer terminators or (insert other nasty assault unit with high strength here) assaults you on rear armor.

Keep your heavy tank count to 3 total and get some Valkyries\Vendettas or Hellhound variants.

Executioner is a good choice but pretty expensive for 1500. Would not run more then 1 at 1500.

Run a Manticore as well. D3 Strength 10 large blasts can be very devastating.

Pask is pretty expensive. Might want to skip Pask in favor of more Tanks.

Give your Vets and Company Command Squad Meltas to kill Land Raiders and heavy armor.

I agree with this. Depends on what you are playing against, because my army has little chance of popping a Leman facing them until turn 2, usually 3, and facing up against lots of Russ is not cool

I'm a casual player so YMMV

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/262319.page 7 tanks, kinda mechanised.

Take out one devil dog, all the infantry & replace with 3 veteran squads with meltaguns in 3 chimeras & your rolling! Perhaps move some points around and get that CCS in a chimera as well (remove everything & ofc replace with weapons and a chimera).

That's 11 tanks, that's mechanised done properly.

Sorry to throw a spanner into what seems a solid list (to me), but have you checked out the Armoured Company rules from FW? Tanks as troops with Armoured Fist squads in support.

Just an idea!

Not 5th edition friendly, I dont think.

i think this last list is solid. and any one that has read any of my posts can tell you, im not a big fan of the melta vet spam. but i think it works well here. one thing i think you should consider (even though you prob plan on doing this or something along the same lines) is to fieald the LR MBT as seperate units. you may want to drop the 2 pie plates on diffrent targets, and the squadron rules realy suck. keep in mind your IG you are going to have 3 times the kill points on the table then any other army any way so whats one more.

I run 2 lr mbt as seperate units, it works a lot better. Komosunder is right, you dont always want them shooting at the same target. Also you could loose both from 1 enemy unit.

what would look better:

1 LR Demolisher and 8 Ratlings

or

1 LR Executioner

??