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OK, so I'm looking at a new tourney army.
I have 4 options, since I don't want to be updated n the next couple years.
Option 1 is rebuild my good old CSM. I know how to do this myself.

Option 2 is Orks.
Big Mek, KFF, PK........110
Big Mek, KFF, PK........110
10 Lootas..................150
10 Lootas..................150
10 Lootas..................150
20 Shootas, 2 Big Shootas, Nob, PK, Bosspole......170
20 Shootas, 2 Big Shootas, Nob, PK, Bosspole......170
20 Shootas, 2 Big Shootas, Nob, PK, Bosspole......170
20 Shootas, 2 Big Shootas, Nob, PK.....................165
3 Killa Kans, Grotzooka.....135
3 Killa Kans, Grotzooka.....135
3 Killa Kans, Grotzooka.....135
1750
Shootas, Lootas, and Kans. This list is a little weird, so it'll catch people who for some reaon brough a casual mentality to a tourney off guard. At the same time, it's solid and can go head to head with other top builds.

Option 3 is Guard.
CCS, Astropath, 3 Meltas, Flamer ..........115
Marbo.........................65
10 Veterans, 3 Flamer .............85
10 Veterans, 3 Flamer.............85
10 Veterans, 3 Melta...............100
10 Veterans, 3 Melta...............100
10 Veterans, 3 Melta...............100
2 Vendettas..............260
2 Vendettas..............260
2 Valkyries, Multiple Rocket Pods.........260
Manticore......160
Manticore......160
1750
Air Cav + Manticores. Marbo's in there 1) because I think he's cool 2) He makes people play more cautiously 3)Try filling 65 points in a tooled Guard list some time .

Option 4 is Daemons.
Skarbrand...........300
KoS, Musk, Might.........235
6 Fiends, Might..........190
3 Flamers.............105
3 Flamers.............105
6 PBs..............90
7 PBs..............105
12 PBs, Icon...........205
DP, MoT, Bolt...........140
DP, MoT, Bolt............140
DP, MoS, Musk, Might, Aura.......135
1750
Skarbrand & Crew, with two bolt princes to help open transports. I could easily swap the KoS for 2 TzCheralds (110 each) and add another PB. Even then, though, I feel like the daemons list is the weakest .

Don't be kind
Anything you have to say on any of the lists is appreciated.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
No comments? So they're all perfect?

I'd go with the guard list. Just because people always ohh and aww when they see 6 valks/vends sitting down on the table.

My only comment on the ork list is maybe try to put burnas on the meks instead of klaws. The 4 PKs on the nobs and the Kans should be able to open up any tanks in your way.

For the demons list I'd try to find the points to swap out the DPs for soul grinders. I really think the only time to use DPs are in a tallyman list because they can add to the tally. Otherwise the SGs just add the ranged anti-tank that a demon army really needs. Also AV 13 is nothing to laugh at. They can not be shaken or stunned so they wind up absorbing some firepower and coming off unscathed many times.

With Soulgrinders instead of DP's, Skarbrand makes (even less) sense. If you switch out the DPs, you really need to start over.

Well, I'd say that Orks are awesome (and they are), but if my choices were to choose between THAT particular Ork army list and....anything else, I would choose anything else. You're missing some basic fundamentals of Orkyness, such as the one about "morez bettah!" You're assembled three units of headshot Lootas. Do you know what that means? A single bullet can wipe out the entire unit and cause them to flee off the board. Unfortunately for you and the statistics of that happening, 40k isn't a game of individual models firing, its a game of units firing...meaning that your Lootas will take fire from a unit of enemies, taking more than one bullet, making it much easier to kill three guys, hit the magical 25% casualties, and see you flee off the back table edge with leadership 7.

Lootas are a "take 15 or leave them at home" unit. Don't even get me started on your boyz.

Ork list:

I would add rokkits instead of big shootas. You have enough ranged fire power and the close up rokkits can come in handy for armour your lootas cannot do damage on.

Guard:

Drop the flamer. A flamer is weak troops and anti horde. Meltaguns are anti vehicle, mostly, along with tough infantry and monstrous creatures. Using either weapon on either target is over kill or won't do any damage. I would go either all meltas, or 3 x flamers and 1 x heavy flamer.

Some plasma vets wouldn't hurt

I'm not a fan of squadrons, makes vehicles weaker. And armour 12 isn't mega hard. I would take two demolishers and drop some valkyries or vendettas. You'll probably have some points to get chimeras for some of the troops.


Out of the two I'm leaning towards the ork, that needs less work IMO.

I'm with dash on filling up those ork units. You don't need to split fire that much IMO and you'll give up less KPs and stay fearless longer. Consolidate those boyz and loota squads.

I'd opt for putting some rokkits (or KMBs) on the kans rather than putting the anti armor in the boyz squads. A 30 count boyz shoota unit should be pretty affective agianst horde. You need some more anti armor (at range since this is a shooting list) and in my opinion it's best to split out anti horde and anti armor to different squads if you can help it.

I'm not sure how everyone else feels but I'd recommend not taking the PKs off the big meks. He's got very little to deal with AV14. If he consolidates that's 1 less PK from the nobz. I wouldn't rely on those kans CCWs with their WS2 for it. If he wanted to do that he should be taking dreads.