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In my gaming group there are two SM players, one CSM player and me (Ork/IG). Last time we played, the CSM guy had an SM attack bike conversion, which he played with standard SM rules. Now, I didn't dispute this because: 1. He was on my side. 2. He paid the points, and 3. It doesn't really break with any kind of fluff (that I know.) But one of the SM players felt it was a severe breach of rules, since the attack bike isn't in the CSM codex, and that it left the CSM army even more overpowered. The attack bike ended up being in the game, but the discussion was left unresolved. So I turn to Dakka, to get an outside opinion on the subject. What are the pros and cons with regard to using an SM Attack Bike in a CSM army? And would you let a CSM opponent put an SM Attack Bike on the table?

I would say that,

Offically, you could not have fielded that bike. Its isn't listed in the codex and although it can fit with fluff or what-have you, it isn't a CSM unit

Unoffically, if the opponents agree then game-away! As long as all parties agree that your twist of the rules, the points you have paid, the presentation of the model and the rules it will be using are all clear and easy to see, then I'd personally have no problems with this provided I was asked before the game started.

I myself have wanted to field a model using certain wargear options whilst displaying him slightly differently, i.e. using a terminator with jump pack model with counts as rules for artificer armour and bike. My opponent said "no way" and although i was miffed, I understood and respected his refusal

Thanks for your input hellsguardian, I feel the same way you do. If the rules for ones unit is clear, and the wargear is represented or at least something to indicate whats there, then I have no problem making exceptions to the rules.

Just to be clear though. I don't play CSM.

Well...'count as'.
I will have a whole CSM army using SM rules...all on bikes that is.

YMMV, highly dependent on gaming group standards.

Sanctjud wrote:Well...'count as'.
I will have a whole CSM army using SM rules...all on bikes that is.

YMMV, highly dependent on gaming group standards.

Will you not be using any CSM rules? My friend objected because it there are no substitutes for the attack bike in the CSM list (I haven't validated the info, I'm just repeating his point), and the CSM player simply added it in with SM rules.

Nope, no CSM rules.
Everything is SM rules, but the models will be very much Chaos.

Chaos Bikes and WFB Knights all converted as bikes.
CSM riding juggernaughts as attack bikes...or some salvaged Tau/daemonic flying engines as attack bikes...

What your friend did is (as others said) opponent consent only.
Whether or not it affects the game it is something that is only good for one-off games.
I do not suggest a long term use of it....MMABs are very powerful and there is a reason why CSM don't have MMABs...maybe because of army balance reasons...just maybe ...

Using Space marines with some chaos marines as a full chaos army: Cool (they all look the same anyways)

Using Space marines with some chaos with their normal SM options: Not cool

There are things you can take as a marine player you cant take as a CSM player. And visa versa. Don't go confusing people by mixing armies (unless its apoc) rules. It aint right. Next hes going to want to take land speeders and tech marines with his chaos army. Pick an army and use those rules.

I have one set of models, but can swap them for 3 different army rule sets. I can do Dark Angels, Space Marines, and Chaos Marines. Most use the same models, but I cant take a crusader in my chaos army, or a interrogator Chaplin in my vanilla army, or a thunderfire cannon in my Dark Angels. Those models stay in those armies codexs.

Mixing codeces is generally frowned upon, at least outside of Apocalypse. If your group says it's fine then don't worry about it. Just don't expect the same understanding if you play outside the group or anywhere near a tournament.

Well, what sort of game were you playing?

1 on 1 "tournament"style? No.

small points for fun? Sure!

multi-player large Apoc? Absolutely!

So the CSM stole an Attack Bike... who cares? It's one lousy bike. Big deal.
____

hellsguardian316 wrote:I myself have wanted to field ... a terminator with jump pack model with counts as rules for artificer armour and bike.

That's a conversion that cannot normally exist. Field it as Artificer with Bike!