Skaven Clan Army Plausibility

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**radiohazard**

I've been looking into doing a Skaven army since the book was released and i've thought about doing an army based around a specific clan (not a warlord clan).

Well after looking through the book i've come to a couple of conclusions...

Clan Eshin

This is a very difficult army to build to win. Even in friendly games, this army is very difficult to use successfully.

Clan Moulder

This is one of the clans I am interested in. A lot of big creatures (Rat Ogres and Abominations) saturating the board, giving your opponent too much to deal with.

Clan Skryre

Lots of shooting, lots and lots of shooting yes yes??? A good army that tends to fall flat when they are hit by another army head on. Take as many Jezzails as you can.

Clan Pestilens

The other clan that interests me. Frenzy can be a pain to deal with against a skilled opponent, but it is not all lost. An army of T4 guys with a lot of attacks that are effectively immune to psychology is a very big thing. This clan can put a lot of hurt on the enemy with Censer Bearers, Plague Claw Catapult and Plague Furnace. They have an ok magic list too and the armies tend to run a lot of wizards or Skrolk plus three other Priests.

Clan Mors

Not strictly one of the 4 great clans, but Mors has a fair amount of background that make them very characterful. Mors have more Stormvermin than most other clans and take them more than Clanrats. This can lead to a slightly smaller army, but it will be far more elite and close combat based. With Queek, who is a combat beast, you can take a unit of Uber Stormvermin who have boosted abilities.

Has anyone else got any comments to build on this?

**JD21290**

Just a very quick side note.

With queek being back and storms being common place troops it is viable to build a clan Mors army.

For those who dont know: Clan Mors is one of the biggest warlord clans, prefering storm vermin over basic clanrats.
they tend to be a CC orientated army.

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Just another thing, but any info on the plague claw and the tower please?
Havent actually heard of them until now

**radiohazard**

I was thinking of adding in Clan Mors up there. An all Stormvermin army is tempting...

So I will LOL.

The Plague Claw is the Rare choice catapult.

I meant Plague Furnace, which is the Pestilens version of the screaming bell.

Sorry - it's been a long day. I have Script deadlines and i haven't had more than 4 hours sleep in 60.

**JD21290**

With queek vermin get to be upgraded aswell, but it aint cheap lol.

but yea, Mors is actually a viable list now, and lets face it, who the feth expects to face a skaven army that charges headlong into em? XD

Hmmm, sounds like, im guessing screaming skull style with a hint of warpstone and flame?

Not a problem mate, it happens, just dont get my hopes up too much

**radiohazard**

No one expects the Skaven to charge in - thats a brilliant way to throw someone off. Queek isn't all that pricey, but the Uber Vermin unit is insanely expensive, but so worth it.

The Plague Claw is basically a stone thrower that lobs a large template that has a low strength but ignores armour and makes the target run away if they lose any models. It's pretty good.

**JD21290**

Heh, tempting, but i would also be tempted to boost the price by throwing in Snikch for the fun of it

queek is bad enough, queek and snikch in combat together could be fething amusing XD

Nice, this i do like, nice for anti-cav / chaos.

Kinda annoyed though, 2 rare in a 2k army, i now have to pick between this, the HPA and doomwheel :(

**LunaHound**

I find Storm Vermins to be absolutely pointless ( stat wise )
the only reason ( though good reason ) would be for carrying the special banners...

Sacred Banner of Horned Rat
Shroud of Dripping Death
Banner of the Under Empire

**JD21290**

Luna hun, storms offer something that most units lack to skaven.

strength and armour.

Maybe not alot of either, but much more than usual.

If you want a heavy hitting unit, then it tends to chew up a special or rare choice which could be spent elsewhere.

However, for specials im thinking along the lines of:

10 jezzails
10 plague cen's
Large plague monk block
Either 4 rat ogres, or another unit of jezzails lol

**Flashman**

Thematically speaking, Clan Moulder would also have a lot of Clanrats and Slaves supporting their big beasties. Remember Hell Pit is packed to the rafters with writhing skaven, there's barely room to breathe.

**LunaHound**

JD21290 wrote:Luna hun, storms offer something that most units lack to skaven.

strength and armour.

Maybe not alot of either, but much more than usual.

If you want a heavy hitting unit, then it tends to chew up a special or rare choice which could be spent elsewhere.

However, for specials im thinking along the lines of:

10 jezzails
10 plague cen's
Large plague monk block
Either 4 rat ogres, or another unit of jezzails lol

I dunno JD , i just dont like those "jack of all traits master of none" units xD
even when maximum upgraded to str 5 with halberds and Queek, their 1 attack really wont win them anything when compared to other armie's same point cost units.
Hmm to think of it , i dont like halberds either -_- they cant use shield with it!

**JD21290**

thats what variety is for hun

Charge in with halberds, make sure your going in with large front areas (7 wide) to maximise attacks.

If against something thats not strong, but alot of armour (chaos knights for example) switch back to shields and hand weps.

also, queek will seriously boost the unit, allowing it to win combats it shouldnt be.

Halberds are great

Lets face it, you love temple guard, and what do they use?

**LunaHound**

JD21290 wrote:Halberds are great
Lets face it, you love temple guard, and what do they use?

halberd AND Hand weapons!!! + shield.

( if i can give them great weapons i would )

**JD21290**

So, now what do stormvermin use!?

**radiohazard**

Luna is correct about the SV. They are not worth the price hike. The uber SV maybe, but you need queek for them and that makes them very overpriced.

I think the hardest hitting Skaven force is going to be the Ratzilla list. I'm not just saying it because thats the list I want to build, but because an army with a ton of big stuff is going to want to charge and will most likely beat the feth out of anything.

EDIT:

I forgot about the weapon change. That makes SV a little better.

**JD21290**

Ill still have to use them, simply to get an idea of how well they pan out through a few games.

I was tempted by that (im guessing your on about Vlord + 2 HPA and some RA's?)
But it just seems to small for an army thats ment to be so numerous.
Ive been tempted by a rat ogre heavy list, and by all accounts, they have some options now.

also on that note, skweel is a SC right? i take it he uses up a hero slot, but can he be put with R.ogres?

However, im still stuck on which army to pick

Not sure weather to go skaven or lizzies -_-
Which is a pretty big problem since i want to start a new army soon.

**Flashman**

Yes Skweel is a special character, but he's an upgrade for a packmaster and therefore doesn't use up a hero slot. Quite a handy upgrade as he can give his charges (Giant Rats or Rat Ogres) poisoned attacks, regeneration or extra attacks.

I'm leaning towards Ratzilla too, just need to figure out a body to use for my Abomination. Hydra looks a good possibility, but is it large enough?

**JD21290**

Its settled then

Looks like skweel will be taking a large unit of rat ogres with him

As much as i dont want to, i think thats the way ill lean too.
Simply too many great units to not take.

Going for a GW model flash?
If so, maybe the plastic giant as framework for it then alot of GS thrown on to build it up and add shape.

If not, then how about this:

Pain in the arse to find over here, but in yankland they are about £20 ish if you can find em

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These may help you

What im using: ill be using a carnosaur with alot of GS work lol, adding in some tech like devices and plenty of warpstone

**Flashman**

Yeah, trying to go for a GW model. Hydra is nice and wormy but too thin. The giant has good stomach possibility, but not much use after that. After a scan of the GW website, I'm wondering about this fellow. Take away the head, arms and legs. File down the some of the iconography and plaster on rat ogre heads and arms.

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Some nice ideas, good use of the corpse cart too (I've got a spare one of those).

**radiohazard**

JD...

I personally wouldn't use V.Lord as it's too many points for a 2K game. Maybe in 3K or larger.

I'm leaning towards either Throt in a unit or a Warlord on a Bonebreaker in a unit of Rat Ogres. Skweel is a definate yes yes for the army. He's way too good not to take.

As for the HPA modelling conundrum...

It's going to be on a chariot base, anything vaguely wyrm like (Hydra) has been on such a base. However i'm leaning towards the use of the WFB Giant as a base. However Flashman's suggestion of the Shaggoth is a very good one. Not much converting needed there and he is big enough to represent such a beast as the HPA.

Nice work Flashman.

**JD21290**

Flash, with the giant it could be amusing to flip the body up-side-down

That way you get a bulky torso with a hunched back

Never actually thought of the shagoth, nice find!

Just a note though mate, you ever brought one of these?
They are fething solid lol, it would take you a good 5-6 hours drilling out the main head, let alone the hair lol.
However, you could mix up kits.
Remove the plague censer from the furnace, and put that on the axe haft instead of the twin blade axe

What ill be doing:

1: Get a carnosaur.
2: Hack it apart, keeping it as just the legs, body and head.
3: Cut away at the head, removing the carapace from the top.
4: GS facial features, including a split open head, with a chunk of warpstone in there lol.
5: Lengthen the arms alot, making them a good 50% longer and bulkier, pose them in a "gimma a hug" pose

6: Use wire to build up a tail, then GS it to make it ratlike, with a triple tail at the end.
7: add fur, boils and slight mutation to it.
8: Tech it up with a small warp-fire thrower poking out of his mouth, a jezzail sight like eye, etc.

But yea, havent put much thought into it other than that lol.

all i know is it will be big, and imposing, perfect for a centerpiece.

Dont like the idea of it being mounted on a machine as such, makes it to comical and not enough "RAR! scary so to speak"

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Edit: Bone breaker? once again, new to me lol.

Im still tempted by queek, even if he is out of place

I wont be using a V.lord often, but since i have one and he's painted up i might aswell field him now and then

(ill grab some pics of him in a sec)

Im just put off with the sort of chariot worm idea, even if thats how the fluff says it is, the fluff is wrong!

I will however have it on a somewhat large scenic base (chariot size base)

**radiohazard**

I'll knock a Ratzilla list up for 2k as soon as I get this script done.

I HATE DEADLINES!!!

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JD:

The bonebreaker is a heavily mutated, much larger Rat Ogre that the Warlord can use as a mounted monster.

It's a real beast!!!

**JD21290**

Edit: Looks like the bonebreaker is interesting then, i need that armies book now XD

After sorting through over 10,000 pics in my comp i found my vermin lord pics XD
But yea, this was just before his final highlights, even though i had a gak cam. at the time.

Randomly found a pic i drew years ago of a zombie dragon lol, brings back memories XD

**radiohazard**

Nice work...

Get the Army Book JD, it's one of the better ones, even though it has a feth load of errors.

I'm torn between Throt and a Bonebreaker Warlord.

Throt is ok, nothing much to really write home about, but the Bonebreaker Warlord could be a real monster in combat if kitted out properly.

**Flashman**

Never done any converting JD, so not sure who'll win the filing down battle, me or the Shaggoth. Will give it a good go anyway. I'm going to try and find one cheap on ebay, lose the head and limbs and stick him on a corpse cart.

Here's hoping the Abomination is worth the bloody effort!

EDIT - Nice Vermin Lord

**JD21290**

Thanks radio

The GF agreed to start me off with a new army for xmas (got a £200 limit on it though lol) so the army book will be comming

Its made by GW, i think thats the cause of aid errors

Ill have to take a look, a monster mount could be nice, but depends what throt has to offer me.

Flash: Dont get ahead of yourself mate

I gave up using a dremmal on the head and swapped to a fething black and decker drill to grind it out

From what i can remember, the shoulders and stumps of leg will be a bitch to remove aswell, so good luck with that one

I wont have too much work on a carny since its just cutting apart a head crest, which using a jewelers saw wont take long i hope.

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Edit: Thanks flash

He's about somewhere i think lol

**radiohazard**

Just looked at the book and my Verdict on Throt is...

Not bad.

He can be used as a packmaster, has all Rat Ogre and Giant Rats in 12" use his Ld.

He has Killing Blow, and D3 wounds on larger creatures.

He has to pass a Ld check every turn or he has to gobble up a friendly model in B2B - even a Rat Ogre.

Stat wise he is like a Warlord with -1 I.

Oh - did I mention if he is included in an army, Giant Rats count towards minimum core choices and...

Up to two units of Rat Ogres can be taken as Core Choices?

For 225 he aint bad, but he really isn't a combat character. Most other army generals would rip him to pieces.

**JD21290**

225 points!?

This i like, this i like very much.
do you choce who he muches if he fails? (if so, packmasters get eaten lol)

So, keep him away from skweel, keep him away from ogres unless they have packmasters.

but, his monster killing abilities seem nice, mixed with the fact he can lead rat ogres i guess they can beast hunt.

dont care about giant rats, the 2 rat ogre units as core got me

**radiohazard**

Owning player chooses yeah.

I'm not sure it is a good idea though, to put him with Rat Ogres. Sure he munches a packmaster and is one himself. But what happens when you run out of Packmasters???

I thought the Ratzilla list would be the most viable after seeing Throt's rules.

One thing I must point out guys is a tactic that I think is going to work well for the Ratzilla list...

Lots and Lots of Rat Ogre units. Units of four will be enough, depending on how big the game is depends on how many units you can field. Block their LOS with Slaves and then run the Suicide Slave Bomb to soften up the opponent for the Rat Ogres to tear whats left apart.

Unit saturation is how Skaven win and it is still very possible with this list.

**JD21290**

In theory, couldnt you run him out of the unit?
So once the pack masters are gone you could drag him out of the unit and hide him behind them as such.

Thats actually what i was thinking tactics wise

But i had planned on a unit of 10 censer bearers to smash up units aswell, since they have a pretty nasty impact

**radiohazard**

I see where you are coming from in regards to the impact threshold of the Censer Bearers, but I would be more inclined to use Jezzail teams to bring down some of the tougher targets at range.