Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
40k has a lot of unfluffy changes to balance the game already. Technically per fluff a single marine is tougher than a tank to take down, but in game a little fist bump from a Tau firewarrior can kill one lol

Agreed, but that's for the sake of the mechanics of the game working at all. 'Smaller' details (e.g. Plasma) tend to follow fluff/science

 Vineheart01 wrote:
40k has a lot of unfluffy changes to balance the game already. Technically per fluff a single marine is tougher than a tank to take down, but in game a little fist bump from a Tau firewarrior can kill one lol

This. This is why I don't really pay attention to their fluff. They self-contradict all the time anyhow.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Tactical_Genius wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
40k has a lot of unfluffy changes to balance the game already. Technically per fluff a single marine is tougher than a tank to take down, but in game a little fist bump from a Tau firewarrior can kill one lol

Agreed, but that's for the sake of the mechanics of the game working at all. 'Smaller' details (e.g. Plasma) tend to follow fluff/science

It's not unreasonable to just say plasma wasn't designed to burn through armor rated at 2+. Simple.

Martel732 wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
40k has a lot of unfluffy changes to balance the game already. Technically per fluff a single marine is tougher than a tank to take down, but in game a little fist bump from a Tau firewarrior can kill one lol

This. This is why I don't really pay attention to their fluff. They self-contradict all the time anyhow.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Tactical_Genius wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
40k has a lot of unfluffy changes to balance the game already. Technically per fluff a single marine is tougher than a tank to take down, but in game a little fist bump from a Tau firewarrior can kill one lol

Agreed, but that's for the sake of the mechanics of the game working at all. 'Smaller' details (e.g. Plasma) tend to follow fluff/science

It's not unreasonable to just say plasma wasn't designed to burn through armor rated at 2+. Simple.

Simple enough to say it, but not to believe it plasma can burn through pretty much anything

Plasma burns through anything in current day science. 40k tends to have unknown alloys that are insanely dense and strong, plasma not being so potent in that work makes total sense.

Tactical_Genius wrote:

Martel732 wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
40k has a lot of unfluffy changes to balance the game already. Technically per fluff a single marine is tougher than a tank to take down, but in game a little fist bump from a Tau firewarrior can kill one lol

This. This is why I don't really pay attention to their fluff. They self-contradict all the time anyhow.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Tactical_Genius wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
40k has a lot of unfluffy changes to balance the game already. Technically per fluff a single marine is tougher than a tank to take down, but in game a little fist bump from a Tau firewarrior can kill one lol

Agreed, but that's for the sake of the mechanics of the game working at all. 'Smaller' details (e.g. Plasma) tend to follow fluff/science

It's not unreasonable to just say plasma wasn't designed to burn through armor rated at 2+. Simple.

Simple enough to say it, but not to believe it plasma can burn through pretty much anything

I already don't believe in 40K's science fluff anyway.

Hey guys? How about we get back to talking Tau tactics?

Good choice

Silence. The Tau have enough tactics.

Eh i kinda did derail the threat a bit lol my bad.

Anyone here use Shadowsun? im gonna start bringing her and see how things work out. My idea is stick her with my usual 2 dual plasma and 1 dual fusion crisis team and have her deepstrike behind my opponent. Not quite as killy as buffmander due to no tankhunter/monsterhunter or ignores cover by default, but rerolls of 1 from CMD drone kinda helps the TL issue and gives the unit stealth + shroud.

Shadowsun + Riptide + Area Terrain = T6/2+.

Question kind of got lost in all the talk about the fluff...




Thoughts on giving Buffmanders Stimulant Injectors (FNP5+)?

I think they are expensive enough to warrant it but they usually have a lot of stuff to Look Out Sir to as well...I'm usually shrugging off harder to save shots to some drones...



Also: If you have the points, models and FoC slots open... what do you think would be a better all around build:
3x Broadsides + 6x Missile Drones
VS
2x squads of 2x Broadsides + 4x Missile Drones each squad

I know the second option is clearly more firepower and bodies but for sake of target priority I've been heavily debating splitting my 3x man Broadside Squad up (HYMP+SMS+TargetLock) into 2x squads of 2x Broadsides with the same loadouts. Big reason I want to do this is give my opponent harder target priority since now there is a duplicate squad of Broadsides AND now if 1 runs off the field because of their less than stellar LD then I don't lose my entire squad of firepower...I'd still have 2x more Broadsides...

It may not be an equivalent exchange because of 1 more Broad and 2x more drones but just increasing the limit and target saturation is my main goal here. When I have 1 squad of Broadsides on the table it makes it "fairly easy" to wipe out one of my primary squads were all my firepower is coming from. I'm sure a lot of you fellow Tau players can relate.

if you have the FOC slot to spare its a valid decision. It gives you that 4th broadside without having him be a loner and lets you manage your shots better, since sometimes all 3 broadsides + 6 missiledrones is overkill lol.

Buffmander with FNP is usually if youre making him Iridium tankmander anyway. Iridium + shield + stim is a 65pt upgrade but it lets hiim tank so much crap everything except riptides cannot since now hes T5 2+ 4++ FNP with 4 wounds lol. Provided no S10 shots (which is really only the random Railhead, Wraithknights, or the seemingly vanished from existance Vindicare) he can tank for days. Problem is thats 65pts on top of an aleady expensive one rofl

 Vineheart01 wrote:
if you have the FOC slot to spare its a valid decision. It gives you that 4th broadside without having him be a loner and lets you manage your shots better, since sometimes all 3 broadsides + 6 missiledrones is overkill lol.

Buffmander with FNP is usually if youre making him Iridium tankmander anyway. Iridium + shield + stim is a 65pt upgrade but it lets hiim tank so much crap everything except riptides cannot since now hes T5 2+ 4++ FNP with 4 wounds lol. Provided no S10 shots (which is really only the random Railhead, Wraithknights, or the seemingly vanished from existance Vindicare) he can tank for days. Problem is thats 65pts on top of an aleady expensive one rofl

Since when was the vindicare S10?
More S10: vindicators, demolishers, chapter master orbital bombardment, medusae, manticores and much much more

Vindicator my bad (im not a marine player and i oddly enough rarely play against any that have that thing available).

Either way the ones i listed are the most common, least in my meta or in the meta i had back in korea. My bikernobz are more likely to get pasted by an S8 shot after being Enfeebled than any S10 lol so iridium commander would be in the same boat technically.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
if you have the FOC slot to spare its a valid decision. It gives you that 4th broadside without having him be a loner and lets you manage your shots better, since sometimes all 3 broadsides + 6 missiledrones is overkill lol.

I always put Target Lock on my Broadsides so I can manage those shots separately. Having all that stuff shoot into 1 target is just ridiculous hahah and often than not, overkill!

Drawback of that vs multiple units is you have to declare where theyre all firing before any fire. Separate units dont have that issue. If you find you wiffed against that AV11 rhino and now you have nothing else except a BIG shot to finish it off, youre gonna be sowwy

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Drawback of that vs multiple units is you have to declare where theyre all firing before any fire. Separate units dont have that issue. If you find you wiffed against that AV11 rhino and now you have nothing else except a BIG shot to finish it off, youre gonna be sowwy

Ya that's true. That's a real good reason to take 2x2 instead of 1x3.

Do any of you fear not being fearless with the Tauzilla Deathstar?

Ov'esa
Farsight
Buffmander
HBC RipTide
4x Shielded Missile Drones

If they pump enough shots into it 1st turn like some armies can and you lose of the missile drones due to Look Out Sir or just later game and losing 25% of your squad you will start taking LD10 tests. Yes it's LD10 but to lose almost 800/900 points seems real scary lol Anyone ever had their deathstar run away? hahah

 syypher wrote:
Do any of you fear not being fearless with the Tauzilla Deathstar?

Ov'esa
Farsight
Buffmander
HBC RipTide
4x Shielded Missile Drones

If they pump enough shots into it 1st turn like some armies can and you lose of the missile drones due to Look Out Sir or just later game and losing 25% of your squad you will start taking LD10 tests. Yes it's LD10 but to lose almost 800/900 points seems real scary lol Anyone ever had their deathstar run away? hahah

Its definitely a weakness. I don't Run the O'Vesa Star, but LD is definitely a weakness of the list. The problem is most of the leadership based attacks are psychic in nature and are negated by the Talisman of Arthas Moloc.

A little food for thought, with three Tank Shocks you have ~%22 chance of breaking the Star. Each one has ~8% chance. Too bad we don't see too many of the Psyker Battle Squads around anymore. Barrage Snipe and Pin could be a tactic.

 Zagman wrote:

 syypher wrote:
Do any of you fear not being fearless with the Tauzilla Deathstar?

Ov'esa
Farsight
Buffmander
HBC RipTide
4x Shielded Missile Drones

If they pump enough shots into it 1st turn like some armies can and you lose of the missile drones due to Look Out Sir or just later game and losing 25% of your squad you will start taking LD10 tests. Yes it's LD10 but to lose almost 800/900 points seems real scary lol Anyone ever had their deathstar run away? hahah

Its definitely a weakness. I don't Run the O'Vesa Star, but LD is definitely a weakness of the list. The problem is most of the leadership based attacks are psychic in nature and are negated by the Talisman of Arthas Moloc.

A little food for thought, with three Tank Shocks you have ~%22 chance of breaking the Star. Each one has ~8% chance. Too bad we don't see too many of the Psyker Battle Squads around anymore. Barrage Snipe and Pin could be a tactic.

I ran it for the first time against my friends pretty well-rounded and competitive GK list. It utterly destroyed him... basically tabled him and just lost some troops and the RipTide that was running solo. that deathstar was really powerful. Wiping out 2x Squads of GKSS a turn with ease.

I actually really like it. It's super powerful hahah but I prefer my regular army lists that are more well-rounded TAC

Recently got my farsight sup FINALLY. Going through it, kinda disappointed because it literally looks like i either do a gimick all-suits army (which every tau wants to lol) or beef up riptide spam capabilities, which im always against anyway.

Bleh, kinda wish i didnt buy it now lol.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Recently got my farsight sup FINALLY. Going through it, kinda disappointed because it literally looks like i either do a gimick all-suits army (which every tau wants to lol) or beef up riptide spam capabilities, which im always against anyway.

Bleh, kinda wish i didnt buy it now lol.

The only reason I wanted to buy it honestly was because I need it to play them in the local tournaments since we are required to have the book. I'd also prefer it over a digital copy. I feel ya on what it allows us to do lol But it does help me a lot because the compulsory 3x Crisis Suits that are "required" is PERFECT for me because I always run 3x dual Missile Pod suits in all my lists with buffmander. The supplement just lets me make that a troop choice now! w00t!


What do you guys think is an optimal squad size for Sniper Drone Team @ 1500 points? At 1850 I'm definitely taking 2x Marker Guys + 9x Sniper drones. At 1500 points though I feel like my points are a little more crunched... those of you who have been messing with them (they have amazing mathhammer stats vs MC's and medium/tougher infantry) what have you been taking at 1500 points?

your tournaments require you to have it even if you arent using it? dafuq? thats dumb. And i agree the troop crisis suis are awesome since theyre 3pts more (since they require bonding) to be made troops...big whoop lol thats a pretty cheap cost increase to be a troop. Excellent marker platform/missile platform lol.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
your tournaments require you to have it even if you arent using it? dafuq? thats dumb. And i agree the troop crisis suis are awesome since theyre 3pts more (since they require bonding) to be made troops...big whoop lol thats a pretty cheap cost increase to be a troop. Excellent marker platform/missile platform lol.

Err.. I might have worded it wrong. I meant I need it and they require it because I use Tau Enclave If I didn't ally them to my Tau I wouldn't need it.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Recently got my farsight sup FINALLY. Going through it, kinda disappointed because it literally looks like i either do a gimick all-suits army (which every tau wants to lol) or beef up riptide spam capabilities, which im always against anyway.

Bleh, kinda wish i didnt buy it now lol.

Well, the only reason I play Tau is so I can take an all suits and drones army with the Farsight Enclave. The point of a Farsight Enclave army is suits, that is exactly what the army is meant to bring. I don't like that you refer to that as gimicky. We all prefer different play styles etc.

Yes, it allows for one very specific Riptide build. Once Tyranids hit I'm betting the O'VesaStar dies as a TMC/TAC Tournament list. Tau will require a more rounded build. At least we will see some of the spare Riptides disappear to allow for a higher volume of fire, etc.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Drawback of that vs multiple units is you have to declare where theyre all firing before any fire. Separate units dont have that issue. If you find you wiffed against that AV11 rhino and now you have nothing else except a BIG shot to finish it off, youre gonna be sowwy

Always have backup. For example a broadside unit full of missile drones, and x2 target locks. one broadside and the missile guys shoot at transport #1 while broadside #2 and #3 fire at transport #2. Maybe I destroy one and leave the other with a hull point left.

Now my group of crisis suits with (MP, MP, TL)x3 maybe a commander boosting some marker drones as part of this squad in there also. They are going to be the backup. Markerlights shoot one thing and I split up the rest of the fire as I need.

Target Locks like much of the tau army are meant to be part of a redundancy network, or synergy, or whatever us tau players are calling it nowadays. It IS the same reason why rail guns on hammerheads are considered somewhat sub par, and often overlooked in competitive lists. One single shot no matter how good just may not work in a game of dice, target locks use this same set up, and basicly makes your shooting less powerful, UNLESS you have units elsewhere to fill in those gaps where the primary didn't fully do thier jobs. Start viewing target locks as a different sort of markerlight maybe?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 syypher wrote:

What do you guys think is an optimal squad size for Sniper Drone Team @ 1500 points? At 1850 I'm definitely taking 2x Marker Guys + 9x Sniper drones. At 1500 points though I feel like my points are a little more crunched... those of you who have been messing with them (they have amazing mathhammer stats vs MC's and medium/tougher infantry) what have you been taking at 1500 points?

I honestly try to keep the squad size to 9 = x2 marksmen and 7 drones, These guys really do benifit from any extra shots they can produce so this isn't just a squad size for morale tests issue but a volume of fire idea also. Ethereal nearby highly recomended with them also. 3 shots at 24" (and still able to hit stuff at 48" is nice) is just awesome sauce + two markerlights on the target = easier time for something else to finish off whatever you were shooting at.

Horrify + Terrify = death to the Deathstars!

 Jancoran wrote:
Horrify + Terrify = death to the Deathstars!

Meh you have to let someone be within range at the start of their turn to cast those since they're maledictions. Thats not a very reliable prospect vs. any of the main deathstars right now. Even the ovesa star which is comparably slow next to jetseer and screamerstar is fast enough to dodge either of those powers. Not saying it's impossible, just really unlikely unless the deathstar player is unfamiliar with those powers or flat out bad.

thanatos67 wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:
Horrify + Terrify = death to the Deathstars!

Meh you have to let someone be within range at the start of their turn to cast those since they're maledictions. Thats not a very reliable prospect vs. any of the main deathstars right now. Even the ovesa star which is comparably slow next to jetseer and screamerstar is fast enough to dodge either of those powers. Not saying it's impossible, just really unlikely unless the deathstar player is unfamiliar with those powers or flat out bad.

Chaos Flying circus can perform this quite well.

thanatos67 wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:
Horrify + Terrify = death to the Deathstars!

Meh you have to let someone be within range at the start of their turn to cast those since they're maledictions. Thats not a very reliable prospect vs. any of the main deathstars right now. Even the ovesa star which is comparably slow next to jetseer and screamerstar is fast enough to dodge either of those powers. Not saying it's impossible, just really unlikely unless the deathstar player is unfamiliar with those powers or flat out bad.

Famous last words.

I haven't lost a game yet doing this. I've only played a dozen or so games, but that is a HEALTHY sample size.

As I say on my blog constantly, the easiest thing to attack in 40K is morale.

For farsight Enclave...how are you guys equipping your 3x Compulsory Suits?

I use to do 2x MPs each + Target Lock and then 6x Marker Drones and put my Iridium Buffmander in front. However I've been thinking that it may possibly be better to put him in with the Broadsides. TL for the Missile Drones and ignore cover/tank hunter for more shots.

So what wargear do you put with your Compulsory 3x man suit team? I'm thinking maybe keeping them as backfield obj holders?

Also, apart from the compulsory 3x man Crisis team slot in the Enclave book. Do you guys fill in the rest of your troops with 3x man 2x man or single Crisis Suits? I'm using singles for now. I like the cheapness factor so I can fit in other threats in my list.