Imperial Guard--What would you like to see?

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**Intruder**

ThePorcupine wrote:
Multilaser must drop in price to at least the same as a heavy bolter, considering it's equal or worse.

Chimera should drop in base cost at least 5 points. Or allow one embarked model to fire their weapon out of the top hatch. Or both.

Sentinels could use some sort of "weapon stabilizers" or something to allow to re-roll hit rolls of 1 or BS not being affected by moving. Just a little something. Right now it seems stupid to pay 60 points on a single BS4+ lascannon shot when you can have the same for the exact same cost as part of a 10 man infantry squad that can receive orders to reroll 1s and also has a gakload of lasgun shots and ablative wounds.

Taurox prime should go up 5 points or so.

Russ tanks should go down 5 points or so. Or go up to 13 wounds from 12. Or have all their weapons unaffected by moving. Or all 3.

Eradicator nova cannon should be S8, or 48", or both.
Exterminator autocannon should be heavy 6.
Vanquisher battle cannon should be heavy 2 or able to reroll hits.

Creed is a bit too many points for what he does. He should have some additional fluffy ability like adding +1 to your roll if you're trying to seize the initiative. And considering he costs more than two company commanders, he should be able to issue 4 orders up from 3, or give orders from 12" up from 6".

Conscripts unable to receive orders. Boom. Fixed.

Veterans should get doctrines back but they should cost 20 down from 30

Scions 10 points per model up from 9

Plasma gun up to 10 points per gun

Melta gun down to 10 points per gun

Autocannon down to 13 points from 15

Grenadier gauntlet down to 5 points from 10. Why am I paying more for a worse grenade launcher?

Vox cost 3 points down from 5 and now has infinite range

Devil dog melta cannon should be assault d3, not heavy d3

Bane wolf chem cannon down to 12 points from 15 points

Lord Commissar leadership and/or execution bubble up to 12" from 6". What's the point of a lord commissar? It's 20 points more than a regular commissar and does the exact same thing. Nobody's gonna use this guy.

Nork Deddog is not worth 80 points. Lower it down to 60

Valkyries down to 12 wounds from 14. Why the hell does a flying transport have a beefier profile than a main battle tank?

Vendettas need to be in the main codex. And they need BS3+ to justify their cost. They're not throwing out a barrage of missiles and bullets like Valkyries. They're trying to land pinpoint shots.

Deathstrike must go back to the previous edition's way of shooting. It should fire on a 6 or more, not an 8 or more. Right now it's almost impossible to fire it earlier than turn 4. By that point the game is already over.

Please god GW listen to this man. For the most part. I still think conscripts would be a problem without orders, but better a scalpel than a hammer, eh? Also I've seen Creed used in tournament lists - I think he's fine or at least close enough to fine to not warrant a change.

**Future War Cultist**

Yeah, some really good suggestions there. Personally I think commissars and lord commissars could be combined into one entry that sits nicely in the HQ section. The marines don't have separate entries to differate between the different librarian ranks for example. But that's just me.

**Robbert Ambrose**

Any indication that IG will be seeing a release anytime soon anyway? So far it seems GW have all but forgetten them.

**Aenarian**

Robbert Ambrose wrote:
Any indication that IG will be seeing a release anytime soon anyway? So far it seems GW have all but forgetten them.

Just like GW has forgotten most of the factions? Grey Knights and Chaos Space Marines next, probably followed by Death Guard, Thousand Sons and probably some other marine variant (or popular xenos) in september-october. I don't believe we'll see our release before november and probably not before Christmas.

**master of ordinance**

Aenarian wrote:
Robbert Ambrose wrote:
Any indication that IG will be seeing a release anytime soon anyway? So far it seems GW have all but forgetten them.

Just like GW has forgotten most of the factions? Grey Knights and Chaos Space Marines next, probably followed by Death Guard, Thousand Sons and probably some other marine variant (or popular xenos) in september-october. I don't believe we'll see our release before november and probably not before Christmas.

Given that barring Sisters the Imperial Guard are the oldest faction in the game model wise i dont think that the other factions have any room to complain.

**SuspiciousSucculent**

Quick question, do you think making grenade launchers indirect fire weapons would be enough to make them worth taking? They are often used to arc grenades at things in cover in real life, so it would be somewhat justifiable, and it would go some way towards making the grenade launcher unique rather than just being a bad plasmagun or a long range frag grenade.

I'm just not sure it would be enough and might be too wacky.

**Future War Cultist**

It's not a bad idea. It would definitely give them a defined role, but could you justify it? My instinct tells me they're direct fire weapons.

I still say the strength should be bumped up to 4/8. That would make it a bit like a long range flamer in frag mode and a sort of plasma gun in krak.

**SlaveToDorkness**

Robbert Ambrose wrote:
Any indication that IG will be seeing a release anytime soon anyway? So far it seems GW have all but forgetten them.

IG and Tau are October releases.

**Aenarian**

SuspiciousSucculent wrote:
Quick question, do you think making grenade launchers indirect fire weapons would be enough to make them worth taking? They are often used to arc grenades at things in cover in real life, so it would be somewhat justifiable, and it would go some way towards making the grenade launcher unique rather than just being a bad plasmagun or a long range frag grenade.

I'm just not sure it would be enough and might be too wacky.

Most likely not. It would give them some additional use, but how much time do your GL-squads spend behind LoS cover and how much of it do you have to spare (as mortar teams, Basilisks etc. take up some space)?

Automatically Appended Next Post:

SlaveToDorkness wrote:
Robbert Ambrose wrote:
Any indication that IG will be seeing a release anytime soon anyway? So far it seems GW have all but forgetten them.

IG and Tau are October releases.

And the source for this statement is?

**ChargerIIC**

SlaveToDorkness wrote:
Robbert Ambrose wrote:
Any indication that IG will be seeing a release anytime soon anyway? So far it seems GW have all but forgetten them.

IG and Tau are October releases.

Source?

**Inquisitor Lord Katherine**

master of ordinance wrote:
Aenarian wrote:
Robbert Ambrose wrote:
Any indication that IG will be seeing a release anytime soon anyway? So far it seems GW have all but forgetten them.

Just like GW has forgotten most of the factions? Grey Knights and Chaos Space Marines next, probably followed by Death Guard, Thousand Sons and probably some other marine variant (or popular xenos) in september-october. I don't believe we'll see our release before november and probably not before Christmas.

Given that barring Sisters the Imperial Guard are the oldest faction in the game model wise i dont think that the other factions have any room to complain.

Uh, are IG?

I know for sure some other specific models out there are very, very old.

**daedalus**

Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:

Uh, are IG?

I know for sure some other specific models out there are very, very old.

The plastic cadian/catachans have been around since at least 4th edition as far as I know. I think the plastic catachans are older, but I'm not 100% sure.

I think all of the loyalist marine sets have been updated since (especially if you call going to "finecast" an update). Maybe not the Black Templar stuff.

Eldar Guardians and pathfinders are probably going to be fairly old. Might be close to guard if not older.

Dark Eldar have had updates.

Tau have definitely had updates. Are the current Fire Warriors new or was that a repackage?

Chaos might still have some old stuff. Abbadon's been around for a while.

**Future War Cultist**

Got an idea for a strategem. Allow all laspistols and lasguns in a unit to become AP -2 for one turn as they crank the guns up to full charge. How many CPs would you charge for that?

Also today I worked out a simple combat doctrine system for both infantry and vehicles. Almost 12 options, pick two of them (only one marked with an * can be taken) and apply this to all <regiment> infantry. It was things like Auxila (pick either ogyrns, ratings or rough riders. Officers can issue orders to them), mechanised (officers can issue tank orders to chimeras, tauroxes, hellhounds and sentinels. This would a * option), light infantry (can deploy anywhere on the board within 9" of a table edge and at least 9" away from enemy units. Another * option). Basically, if I can do this in a few hours GE can do it, so combat Doctrines please GW!

**Inquisitor Lord Katherine**

daedalus wrote:
Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:

Uh, are IG?

I know for sure some other specific models out there are very, very old.

The plastic cadian/catachans have been around since at least 4th edition as far as I know. I think the plastic catachans are older, but I'm not 100% sure.

I think all of the loyalist marine sets have been updated since (especially if you call going to "finecast" an update). Maybe not the Black Templar stuff.

Eldar Guardians and pathfinders are probably going to be fairly old. Might be close to guard if not older.

Dark Eldar have had updates.

Tau have definitely had updates. Are the current Fire Warriors new or was that a repackage?

Chaos might still have some old stuff. Abbadon's been around for a while.

I'm not sure.

I think Termigaunts/Hormagaunts and Berzerkers are quite old, Red Terror is also really old, I think, unless they finally discontinued him.

Fire Warriors have ad a new kit, but I'm not sure about Crisis suits, I think they might have just had a reboxing.

**Merellin**

Fire Warriors and Crisis Suits both had new kits. As for Imperial Guard, I'm not sure if this is true, But I once heard that the Catachans where one of the first plastic kits that GW ever made for 40k, And they are still the same kit.. Not sure it is true, But thats what I heard...

**Future War Cultist**

It is true. I remember the kit coming out. It was still the 90s. Eldar Guardians are also quite old but have aged far better.

**master of ordinance**

Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
master of ordinance wrote:
Aenarian wrote:
Robbert Ambrose wrote:
Any indication that IG will be seeing a release anytime soon anyway? So far it seems GW have all but forgetten them.

Just like GW has forgotten most of the factions? Grey Knights and Chaos Space Marines next, probably followed by Death Guard, Thousand Sons and probably some other marine variant (or popular xenos) in september-october. I don't believe we'll see our release before november and probably not before Christmas.

Given that barring Sisters the Imperial Guard are the oldest faction in the game model wise i dont think that the other factions have any room to complain.

Uh, are IG?

I know for sure some other specific models out there are very, very old.

Cadians are a 2000/2001 release
Catachans are a 1998/1999 release
The current Leman Russ kit is essentially the old kit with some new addons and plastic sponsin weapons
The Chimera kit is the old kit with a new turret
Ratlings are ancient
Rough Riders are mid 90's models
The only new stuff that we have are the new storm troopers, hellhounds and Ogryns.

**Future War Cultist**

I thought ratlings were updated in the last decade or so? Fine cast versions.

**daedalus**

master of ordinance wrote:

The current Leman Russ kit is essentially the old kit with some new addons and plastic sponsin weapons
The Chimera kit is the old kit with a new turret
Ratlings are ancient
The only new stuff that we have are the new storm troopers, hellhounds and Ogryns.

The tanks have some quality of life changes too. Treads on the LR became a little less obnoxious to assemble, and the sponson weapons are much improved (and all present).

The new Chimera kit's side armor was reduced in number of pieces to assemble, and the treads were MUCH better to assemble. Those came from the hellhound kit, which was also a redesign, though I don't know when that one happened exactly. Chimeras also become maybe about a half centimeter more narrow as a result of the new sides. It was not much, but just enough that some of them fit into some of my battefoam in places where the others won't without rubbing. The top of the Chimera is also a new mould, since it has the notch for the turret instead of the pinhole for the old one.

So it wasn't like it was completely unchanged, but cosmetically they're almost indistinguishable other than what you pointed out.

I do think that both of the command squads are newer than the infantry kits, at least by some amount of time.

There were also two types of ratlings, as far as I can tell. The newer ones had bigger heads and slightly larger rifles. Both were metal and I'm guessing the obviously ancient ones I have are, like, 2nd edition era, while the others are maybe 3rd/4th.

**Future War Cultist**

They replaced the old type chimera chassis in the basilisk with the new type but the gun remains the original. It should be easy to replace it with a new gun that could also be assembled as a medusa siege gun or a griffon heavy mortar.

Also, should the IG now receive grav weapons? My gut says no but you might disagree!

**Panzergraf**

master of ordinance wrote:

Cadians are a 2000/2001 release

No, Steel Legion came out around that time (Armageddon campaign), plastic Cadians are more recent (Eye of Terror campaign). At least in my mind they are still "new-ish" models, but actually thinking about it they're getting old. I'm getting old...
If they're going to re-do the plastic Cadians, or release a series "generic IG" plastic models, I'd like something that more resembles the older metal Cadians.

There's no need for new Russ or Chimera models yet. I apprieciate that they made the new-ish models look like the old ones so they don't look weird next to each other.

**Future War Cultist**

You just reminded me that the old metal cadians are actually better looking than their plastic replacements! If those were made in plastic with a gun that resembles the one carried by the Death Korps I'd be all over them.

And I think the plastic cadians are from around 2003?

**Firefox1**

Leman Russes could need a buff.
- The weapons stabilizer (ignoring the -1 on the move) for Leman Russ non-turret weapons
- LasCannons choice for the sponsons to do a real Leman Russ Annihilator.
- Exterminator autocannon needs 8 shots
- Make the battle cannon have 2D3 shots instead of D6.

In general the game would benefit from fix numbers of shots (D3=2; D6=4).

**vipoid**

I think Leman Russ should move slower (even when undamaged) but have the stabilisers for all weapons. The whole point is that they're slow but steady.

I think the Executioner Plasma Cannon should be firing 3d3 shots, with any 1s inflicting a single mortal wound (when overcharging).

**Desubot**

Firefox1 wrote:
Leman Russes could need a buff.
- The weapons stabilizer (ignoring the -1 on the move) for Leman Russ non-turret weapons
- LasCannons choice for the sponsons to do a real Leman Russ Annihilator.
- Exterminator autocannon needs 8 shots
- Make the battle cannon have 2D3 shots instead of D6.

In general the game would benefit from fix numbers of shots (D3=2; D6=4).

I feel like they just need to put back lumbering behemoth

No move and shoot penalty

cannot advance.

**Arbitrator**

Panzergraf wrote:
master of ordinance wrote:

Cadians are a 2000/2001 release

No, Steel Legion came out around that time (Armageddon campaign), plastic Cadians are more recent (Eye of Terror campaign). At least in my mind they are still "new-ish" models, but actually thinking about it they're getting old. I'm getting old...
If they're going to re-do the plastic Cadians, or release a series "generic IG" plastic models, I'd like something that more resembles the older metal Cadians.

Yeah, Cadian kits were from 2003. I should know because they released the same week I wandered into GW and started the hobby. I also feel too old now... dammit.

**Firefox1**

Desubot wrote:
Firefox1 wrote:
Leman Russes could need a buff.
- The weapons stabilizer (ignoring the -1 on the move) for Leman Russ non-turret weapons
- LasCannons choice for the sponsons to do a real Leman Russ Annihilator.
- Exterminator autocannon needs 8 shots
- Make the battle cannon have 2D3 shots instead of D6.

In general the game would benefit from fix numbers of shots (D3=2; D6=4).

I feel like they just need to put back lumbering behemoth

No move and shoot penalty

cannot advance.

Hope they hear you.

**Future War Cultist**

Looking at Iron Hand, I'm wondering if the IG should have more cyborgs? Perhaps this could be a thing for vets?

**argonak**

Desubot wrote:
Firefox1 wrote:
Leman Russes could need a buff.
- The weapons stabilizer (ignoring the -1 on the move) for Leman Russ non-turret weapons
- LasCannons choice for the sponsons to do a real Leman Russ Annihilator.
- Exterminator autocannon needs 8 shots
- Make the battle cannon have 2D3 shots instead of D6.

In general the game would benefit from fix numbers of shots (D3=2; D6=4).

I feel like they just need to put back lumbering behemoth

No move and shoot penalty

cannot advance.

They already have that for the turrets though. I guess putting it on the sponsons would be nice, but I don't think we should be buying a tank purely for the sponson weapons. Right now the main guns are just perception wise too weak. Analytically, I know it only costs 22 points and is generally far better than a lascannon, but it just feels weak.

**Inquisitor Lord Katherine**

argonak wrote:
Desubot wrote:
Firefox1 wrote:
Leman Russes could need a buff.
- The weapons stabilizer (ignoring the -1 on the move) for Leman Russ non-turret weapons
- LasCannons choice for the sponsons to do a real Leman Russ Annihilator.
- Exterminator autocannon needs 8 shots
- Make the battle cannon have 2D3 shots instead of D6.

In general the game would benefit from fix numbers of shots (D3=2; D6=4).

I feel like they just need to put back lumbering behemoth

No move and shoot penalty

cannot advance.

They already have that for the turrets though. I guess putting it on the sponsons would be nice, but I don't think we should be buying a tank purely for the sponson weapons. Right now the main guns are just perception wise too weak. Analytically, I know it only costs 22 points and is generally far better than a lascannon, but it just feels weak.

I wouldn't call it better than a Lascannon, actually. The point of strength and point of AP make a huge difference, and the D6 damage vs. D3 makes up for the fewer shots. I'll run the numbers for distributions tommorrow.